It being moved to postpone the clause in the Report of the Committee of
Eleven as to the originating of money bills in _the first_ branch, in
order to take up the following--"that in the 2^d branch each State shall
have an equal voice,"
M^r Gerry, moved to add as an amendment to the last clause agreed to by
the House, "that from the first meeting of the Legislature of the U.S.
till a census shall be taken all monies to be raised for supplying the
public Treasury by direct taxation shall be assessed on the inhabitants
of the several States according to the number of their Representatives
respectively in the 1^{st} branch." He said this would be as just before
as after the Census; according to the general principle that taxation &
Representation ought to go together.
M^r Williamson feared that N. Hampshire will have reason to complain. 3
members were allotted to her as a liberal allowance, for this reason
among others, that she might not suppose any advantage to have been
taken of her absence. As she was still absent, and had no opportunity of
deciding whether she would chuse to retain the number on the condition,
of her being taxed in proportion to it, he thought the number ought to
be reduced from three to two, before the question was taken on M^r G's
motion.
M^r Read could not approve of the proposition. He had observed he said
in the Committee a backwardness in some of the members from the large
States, to take their full proportion of Representatives. He did not
then see the motive. He now suspects it was to avoid their due share of
taxation. He had no objection to a just & accurate adjustment of
Representation & taxation to each other.
M^r Gov^r Morris & M^r Madison answered that the charge itself involved
an acquittal; since notwithstanding the augmentation of the number of
members allotted to Mass^{ts} & V^a the motion for proportioning the
burdens thereto was made by a member from the former State & was
approved by M^r M. from the latter who was on the Com^e. M^r Gov^r
Morris said that he thought P^a had her due share in 8 members; and he
could not in candor ask for more. M^r M. said that having always
conceived that the difference of interest in the U. States lay not
between the large & small, but the N. & South^n States, and finding that
the number of members allotted to the N. States was greatly superior, he
should have preferred, an addition of two members to the S. States, to
wit one to N. & 1 to S. Carl^a rather than of one member to Virg^a. He
liked the present motion, because it tended to moderate the views both
of the opponents & advocates for rating very high, the negroes.
M^r Elseworth hoped the proposition would be withdrawn. It entered too
much into detail. The general principle was already sufficiently
settled. As fractions can not be regarded in apportioning the _N^o of
representatives_, the rule will be unjust, until an actual census shall
be made. After that taxation may be precisely proportioned according to
the principle established, to the _number of inhabitants_.
M^r Wilson hoped the motion would not be withdrawn. If it sh^d it will
be made from another quarter. The rule will be as reasonable & just
before, as after a Census. As to fractional numbers, the Census will not
destroy, but ascertain them. And they will have the same effect after as
before the Census; for as he understands the rule, it is to be adjusted
not to the number of _inhabitants_, but of _Representatives_.
M^r Sherman opposed the motion. He thought the Legislature ought to be
left at liberty: in which case they would probably conform to the
principles observed by Cong^s.
M^r Mason did not know that Virg^a would be a loser by the proposed
regulation, but had some scruple as to the justice of it. He doubted
much whether the conjectural rule which was to precede the Census, would
be as just, as it would be rendered by an actual census.
M^r Elseworth & M^r Sherman moved to postpone the motion of M^r Gerry.
On y^e question, it passed in the negative. Mass. no. Con^t ay. N. J.
ay. P^a no. Del. ay. M^d ay. V^a no. N. C. no. S. C. no. Geo. no.
Question on M^r Gerry's motion, it passed in the negative, the States
being equally divided.
Mass. ay. Con^t no. N. J. no. _P^a ay._ Del. no. M^d no.
_V^a no._ N. C. ay. S. C. ay. Geo. ay.
M^r Gerry finding that the loss of the question had proceeded from an
objection with some, to the proposed assessment of direct taxes on the
_inhabitants_ of the States, which might restrain the Legislature to a
poll tax, moved his proposition again, but so varied as to authorize the
assessment on the _States_, which leaves the mode to the Legislature,
viz "that from the 1^{st} meeting of the Legislature of the U. S. untill
a census shall be taken, all monies for supplying the public Treasury by
direct taxation shall be raised from the said several States according
to the number of their representatives respectively in the 1^{st}
branch."