Mr. LOWERY. It is wrong.
Mr. HUBERT. Yes, that's correct, and now, I don't think we have to do
anything more about it.
Mr. LOWERY. All right. Then, on page 2 in--let's see, this page 2,
paragraph 4, and this will carry on to paragraph 1 of page 3. All
right. "This police car had its red lights on, flashing, and there were
two or three officers in the car."
That is a mistake. The facts are is this police car was a marked squad
car, occupied by one officer, and that officer was Officer O'Dell, who
is a patrolman, and as far as I can say, he was alone in the car. Only
person in the car. All right. On page 3, this also is in paragraph 1.
"He did not know who this individual was until his hat fell off in the
melee and he saw it was Jack Ruby whom he has known for several years."
The facts are that at approximately the same instant the shot was
fired, or within a fraction of a second thereafter, I did recognize the
person firing the shot as being Jack Ruby.
Mr. HUBERT. The correction there being that you recognized him before
his hat fell off, is that what you mean?
Mr. LOWERY. Well, I couldn't definitely say that I recognized him
before his hat fell off. I don't----
Mr. HUBERT. Did you recognize him before he fired the shot?
Mr. LOWERY. Well, it seemed like to me at the same time. Now, of
course, this happened directly in front of me, closer than--about half
of the distance between the two of us and----
Mr. HUBERT. Let the record show that the witness indicates the distance
that I would judge to be approximately 6 feet.
Mr. LOWERY. Well, he would be within 4 feet, I think. That Jack Ruby
would be within 4 feet of me.
Mr. HUBERT. Would you say that the distance that I judge is 6 feet, you
think is about two-thirds of that distance?
Mr. LOWERY. That's right. Three to 4 feet, and I couldn't say that Jack
Ruby's hat--I couldn't say whether the hat had fallen off or not.
Mr. HUBERT. All right.
All right. Now, you have looked over the other pages of 5083, and
handed it back to me, are there any corrections or deletions or--wrong
statements or anything that you would like to comment upon?
Mr. LOWERY. Best I can remember the rest of it is fairly accurate.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, I want to have you identify a chart of the basement
area of the Dallas Police Department and I am marking upon it for the
purposes of identification the words, "Dallas, Tex., March 25, 1964.
Exhibit Number 5084, deposition of R. L. Lowery." And I am signing my
name below that, and just for the purposes of identification, I wish
you would sign your name below it, too, below my name.
I would like you to look at the mockup here and--if you will come over
here with me, we can put the chart and the mockup together, and I would
like you to--by using the mockup, point to the place on the mockup
where you were standing and then we will mark it on the map.
Mr. LOWERY. All right. I was standing exactly at this point here
[indicating]. In fact, the corner--I was leaning back against the
corner, and I could feel it exactly between my shoulder blades.
Mr. HUBERT. All right. Now, I am marking a circle right here as the
point that you are talking about?
Mr. LOWERY. Yes, sir; and that would be on the southwest corner.
Mr. HUBERT. Southwest corner of the intersection of the jail corridor
and the ramp?
Mr. LOWERY. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. I am marking a circle around the position you have
indicated and I am writing the words, "Position of R. L. Lowery at the
time of the shooting," which I am also placing in a circle. Now, is
that correct, sir? That was your position?
Mr. LOWERY. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, how long had you been in that position prior to the
shooting?
Mr. LOWERY. Well, I couldn't definitely say how long I had been at
that one particular position. I had been in this area for, oh, from
approximately 10 minutes. I had been within a few feet of there. I just
took this position a few minutes, and--or maybe a couple of minutes
before the shooting actually took place, but I was standing within a
few feet of that point.
Mr. HUBERT. At the moment of the shooting, you were in precisely that
position?
Mr. LOWERY. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. And you would judge you had been in that position about 2
minutes?
Mr. LOWERY. I don't believe it would be any more than 2 minutes' time.
I don't know.
Mr. HUBERT. You were facing then in the general direction of the TV
cameras?
Mr. LOWERY. Well, when the actual shooting took place.
Mr. HUBERT. And the time before that? I want to get both?
Mr. LOWERY. Well, I looked both ways, both left and right.
Mr. HUBERT. I'll ask you if you scanned the crowd?
Mr. LOWERY. Well, in the direction of the TV cameras, the lights were
so bright I couldn't have seen any people in the crowd. I could see
forms, but I couldn't--I wouldn't be able to----
Mr. HUBERT. Do you know a detective, W. J. Harrison, I think he is
called "Blackie" Harrison?
Mr. LOWERY. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Was he in your line of vision?
Mr. LOWERY. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Could you see him?
Mr. LOWERY. I saw him shortly before the shooting. Now, at the time
all the TV lights and everything were turned on, I don't recall seeing
"Blackie" from that time until the shot was actually fired.
Mr. HUBERT. I wonder if you would use the mockup first to place the
position, approximately, of Harrison, the last time you were able to
see him, and then translate that by placing a circle on the map that----
Mr. LOWERY. Let me get squared away here. He would have been in
this general area. I couldn't say in relation to this wall--to this
guardrail. I would think they would have been approximately----
Mr. HUBERT. Well, I am going to mark a line, which I am labeling as
line "A, B," and then I want to ask you to take the pen and put the
approximate position of Harrison the last time you saw him.
Mr. LOWERY. Well, I would say about this [indicating].
Mr. HUBERT. Now, you have made an "X," and I am putting a circle about
the "X," and drawing a line out and writing the following, "position of
W. J. Harrison--" the approximate position, is that what you mean?
Mr. LOWERY. Right.
Mr. HUBERT. "The approximate position of W. J. Harrison when last seen
by Lowery."