Hallowmas for the twelve months.
8337. Do you always deal in Mr. Inkster's shop-Yes; I deal
oftenest there.
8338. What do you go for elsewhere?-It is very trifling. My
dealings are mostly with him.
8339. Is that because you fish for him?-Yes.
8340. Have you an account?-Yes.
8341. Are you obliged to deal on credit?-Yes, sometimes I am,
because I must have supplies.
8342. Is that the reason why you go to his shop?-No. I would
just as soon deal with him, if I had money, as I would go
elsewhere.
8343. Is there any other place hereabout where you could deal?-
Yes; but I would just as soon deal with Mr. Inkster as with any
other man.
8344. Are you generally behind at the settlement?-Sometimes I
am a little.
8345. But sometimes you have a balance to get in cash?-
Sometimes; but sometimes the seasons are so bad that I have
to go to him for a little supplies.
8346. I suppose that is the reason why you continue to fish for
him? If you owe him a little money, you don't like to go and fish
for another man?-I don't see what I could get by fishing for
another; I pay him the same for his goods, and he pays me the
same for my fish as another would do.
8347. Are his goods of as good a quality as in other shops?-Yes.
8348. Have you known any fishermen who have left one employer
and gone to fish for another?-No; not that I could point out.
8349. A man generally continues to fish for the same merchant?-
Yes; unless it may be a man who changes and goes south.
8350. But if he remains in the same place, does he generally go on
fishing for the same merchant for years?-Yes; but I have heard of
some of them shifting.
8351. What do they shift for generally?-They may shift to get
chances in boats belonging to other curers.
8352. They think they may be better off perhaps by getting into
another crew?-Yes.
[Page 203]
8353. Do men sometimes want to shift to another crew or another
master, and are prevented from doing so because they are in
debt?-I have never tried that.
8354. Do you know whether that is ever the case?-I could not
answer that question, because I would not like to say anything I
was not sure about.
8355. I suppose you would not think of leaving Mr. Inkster so long
as you were in his debt?-Even if I was clear with him, I see no
good I could do to myself by leaving him. If I ask him for money,
I get it, just the same as out-takes; and I get out-takes from him,
just the same as if I was paying down ready money for them.
8356. Do you think you would be any better off if you had not to
run such a long account?-I don't know. A poor man generally
can have very little until it comes perhaps to the twelvemonth's
end; and if it were not that we have sometimes a beast to sell,
or something like that, we would have very little to live on
throughout the year, because the fishing time is only for about
three months in the summer.
8357. You think if you were settled with at shorter periods, you
would not have enough to carry you through the year?-Yes.
8358. And you could not settle with the merchant at the end,
because the account you have to pay is bigger than what you have
to get?-Yes.
8359. Is that sometimes the case?-Yes; because for some years
there has been a good deal of bread to get in consequence of lean
crops, and that brings the poor fishermen very much down.
Brae, January 13, 1872, JOHN WOOD, examined.
8360. Are you a fisherman in Muckle Roe?-I am.
8361. Do you fish for Mr. Inkster?-Yes.
8362. Have you heard what Gideon Williamson said?-Yes.
8363. Is your way of dealing the same as he has described?-Yes;
the very same.
8364. Have you anything different to say?-No.
8365. How long have you fished for Mr. Inkster?-Nine years.
8366. Have you ever wished to change?-No.
8367. Do you always get your supplies from him?-Yes.
8368. Are you generally somewhat behind at the end of the
year?-Sometimes.
8369. Who did you fish for before?-Mr. Anderson.
8370. Why did you leave him?-Because it was more convenient
for us where we lived to fish for Mr. Inkster.
8371. Were you clear with Mr. Anderson when you left him?-
Very nearly. I think I was due him £1 or so.
8372. When did you pay that up?-Mr. Inkster paid it up for me.
He sent it to Mr. Anderson at the end of the season.
8373. Is that a usual thing to do when a man has shifted?-Yes,
8374. His new employer pays up the whole of his debt?-Yes.
8375. Have you heard of that being done often?-Yes; I have
heard of it being done.
Brae, January 13, 1872, GILBERT SCOLLAY, examined.
8376. You are a tenant on the Busta estate?-Yes.
8377. Do you fish any?-No.
8378. I understand you have come here to say something about
your line of life and its bearing upon this inquiry: what is it?-My
principal means of living is that I get an annuity for keeping some
pauper lunatics belonging to several parishes, Delting and
Tingwall, and so forth.
8379. What have you got to say about that?-At the time when I
commenced to do that, I unfortunately was not clear with the man
who now supplies me.
8380. Who is that?-Mr. Thomas Adie.
8381. Had you been a fisherman before?-No; I had been a sawyer
for many years.
8382. Had you kept an account at Voe?-Yes.
8383. Were you behind with it?-Yes, a little.
8384. How much?-I could not exactly say, but it was a good deal.
8385. Was it £20?-Perhaps more at times, and sometimes less;
but we will say it was that.
8386. What have you to say about it?-I want to speak about the
way of supply, and the prices of provisions and other things; I
never had my money at command.
8387. How long ago is it since you had that debt?-It is perhaps
ten years ago since I commenced with one pauper, and then I got
another one. I gave Mr. Adie leave to draw my money with which
to settle my accounts, and I got supplies from him.
8388. Where do you draw your money from?-From the parishes
that I had got the lunatics from.
8389. Was it because you were due Mr. Adie money when you left
that you gave him leave to draw your money?-It was not that
altogether. It was quite right, when I was due him an account, that
he should be paid for it, but he drew my money from the parishes
and supplied me with meal. Perhaps I required ten or twelve sacks
a year. I do not get it all from him now. If I had had the use of my
money, I might have tried to settle the old account with Mr. Adie
and have got my meal where I liked, but I could not do that. With
the money I could have got my articles at cost price. I asked my
money from Mr. Adie, but he refused to give it me some years ago.
8390. He refused to give it you because you had made an
arrangement with him that he was to draw the money?-Yes;
not to lay it out, but only to draw it for me.
8391. Was it not the arrangement that he was to draw it for you
in order that he might pay his own debt?-We never had any
arrangement of that kind, but that was perhaps considered to be
the arrangement both by him and me. I would have done that
willingly.
8392. Have you squared up your accounts with Mr. Adie at any
time?-It is a good while since I was able to do that without
injuring me otherwise; but Adie having the use of my money, I
got my things from him.
8393. What was the account for which was due to Mr. Adie?-For
meal principally, and clothing.
8394. Have you got an account?-Yes; it is in Mr. Adie's book at
Voe.
8395. Have you gone over every year at settling time and squared
up your account, and seen how much you were due to him, or how
much he was due to you, at the end of the year?-Sometimes I
did and sometimes not. I knew that I was not able to meet that
account, because I did not have the use of my money. If I wanted
a dozen sacks of meal, I was always told that there was 2s. a sack
as commission for the risk of getting it, and ultimately I wrote
to the meal dealers in the south, and I found that there was a
difference of 10s. on the sack of meal; that, upon 12 sacks, would
have been a saving of £6 alone.
8396. Did you give Mr. Adie an order to the inspector to pay the
money to him which was due to you?-Yes, I told Mr. Adie to
draw it for me, and I signed an order that he was to draw it.
8397. And he has drawn it ever since?-Yes.
8398. Was that for the money which you were to get from Delting
parish?-Yes.
8399. Is Mr. Adie a member of the Parochial Board of that
parish?-Yes.
8400. Is he the chairman?-I don't know.
8401. Who is the inspector of that parish?-Mr. Louttit.
8402. What do you think can be done for you?-I made my
complaint to Mr. Adie lately about the state of these things; but
it is not my wish to mention the names of any parties. It is only
the practice that I object to.
[Page 204]
8403. What practice do you refer to?-This truck system, and the
enormous prices that are charged.
8404. What have you to say about the prices? You have told me
that you can save £6 on 12 sacks of meal by dealing south?-Yes,
by dealing with Tod Brothers. I wrote to them about it, and they
answered me.
8405. Have you got their answer?-No, I have not got it, but I
remember it quite well.
8406. How long ago was that?-Just two or three years since.
8407. What was the price of Mr. Adie's meal at that time?-It was
34s. per sack for Indian corn meal.
8408. What was the price of Messrs. Tod Brothers'?-22s.
8409. That was it difference of 12s. per sack?-Yes, but it left me
to pay the freight, which would be about 2s. 6d.
8410. Could you have got the meal brought up here for 2s. 6d.?-
Yes, or whatever the 'Queen of the Isles' charged.
8411. How many sacks of Indian corn meal would you require in it
year?-Perhaps about a dozen sacks.
8412. Do you feed the lunatics on that meal?-No, not the
lunatics, but my own family, and sometimes the lunatics too.
8413. Have you made any comparison between the prices charged
at Mr. Adie's shop and elsewhere?-Yes. I could buy it at Mr.
Robertson's store, at Vidlin, for 27s.; that, upon 12 sacks, would
make it difference 4s. between the two places.
8414. Could you not have got your meal from Mr. Robertson's
store?-I got some of it, because I kept a party from Lunnasting,
and I got part of my supplies there.
8415. Did you get your supplies for that lunatic from
Lunnasting?-Occasionally, when I asked them.
8416. Had you an account there?-Yes; I could either get money
or anything that I wanted which was due. I could not have done
that with Mr. Adie; and therefore I have never been able to get
clear of my debt to him.
8417. Did you bring your supplies all the way from Mr.
Robertson's store to where you lived?-Yes.
8418. Was that because you kept a lunatic pauper from that
parish?-Yes. I took advantage of that, because I could get my
goods cheaper there but I could have got money as well, and have
gone to any other place with it. If I had had money to get from Mr.
Adie, I would have got it from him too with good will, but I never
had it to get, and it is that which has kept me deeper and deeper in
spite of all I could do.
8419. Could you not have gone to the Parochial Board of Delting,
and got your money whenever you pleased, instead of letting Mr.
Adie draw it?-I might have got it, but Mr. Adie at one settlement
made up a line, and I was compelled to sign it, that he was to draw
all the money which I had to get for the lunatic from that parish. I
signed it because he wrote me a letter saying I was to come down
and pay my account, and then to transfer my custom, which I was
not able to do without leaving me destitute.
8420. Have you got that letter?-No.
8421. What did you do with it?-I just destroyed it carelessly.
8422. How long ago was that?-I could not exactly say. If I state
it incorrectly, it is not done willingly, but it may have been three
years since. At the same time I asked Mr. Adie to give me the use
of my money, and to keep some of it in order to pay the old
account, but he did not do it, and that is the main cause why I am
so far behind. I could have had my account with him paid by the
profits I could have saved from dealing in the south; I am perfectly
sure of that.
8423. But if you wanted your money, why could you not have gone
to the Parochial Board and told them to pay you, and not to regard
Mr. Adie's orders about it?-What would have become of what I
was due to Mr. Adie if I had got the money from the Parochial
Board? It was my duty, and I had to pay it to him. At that very
time Mr. Adie told his shopman not to supply me unless I came to
his shop with cash.
8424. But you wanted to stop going to him because you thought
you could get your supplies cheaper elsewhere?-If I had got my
supplies in the south, I could have paid him something yearly and
lived better. I was making my complaint to Mr. Adie lately, and
he promised (and no man was ever deceived in anything that Mr.
Adie ever promised, neither was I) that for the future I should get
my things at cash price. So far as I am concerned, I have no cause
of complaint now; but that has been the cause why I am in debt.
8425. How long ago was that arrangement made about getting
your things at cash price?-It may be two or three months ago, and
I have got a part of the debt realized since. I have no reason to
doubt Mr. Adie's word, or that of any of his sons.
8426. You have one lunatic from Delting, and you have another
from Lunnasting?-Yes. I have not got a lunatic from Lunnasting,
but a pauper that I keep at a separate house.
8427. But in consequence of having that pauper you get some
supplies at Vidlin?-Yes.
8428. Who pays you for the keep of that pauper?-The inspector,
Mr. John Anderson, of Lunnasting.
8429. Was there any arrangement made when you got that pauper,
that you were to take supplies at Vidlin?-None whatever; it is by
my own will that I go there. I can get money, or anything I like;
but when I find it convenient, and that the goods are cheaper there
than elsewhere, I go and take them.
8430. Are Vidlin and Voe the only places where you get
supplies?-Yes; I have dealt with Mr. Adie for thirty years;
and I have no cause of complaint against him, except the
enormous price which he generally charges for his goods.
8431. Is there any other article which you could name besides
meal which is charged at an enormous price?-This place is
farther north, and the goods here should be charged a shade
dearer, because there is more expense in bringing them.
8432. But can you mention any one article, such as cotton or
cloth, which is dearer here than at Lerwick?-You can make a
better bargain in Lerwick than in the north.
8433. Have you done that frequently?-Yes.
8434. You only keep three paupers?-Yes.
Brae, January 13, 1872, JAMES ROBERTSON, examined.
8435. Are you a fisherman in Muckle Roe?-I was a fisherman at
one time, but I am not fishing now; I am too old to go to sea.
8436. Has it always been the practice of the fishermen there to
deal with the merchants they sell their fish to?-Yes; for forty
years back. I have been about thirty years in the fishing.
8437. Have you been at the Faroe fishing?-No; I always went to
the ling fishing.
8438. Did you always keep an account with the merchant who
employed you?-Yes.
8439. Did you always fish for the same merchant?-Yes, for John
Anderson & Co. and for Mr. Leisk, who was there before them.
8440. You always had an account at Hillswick?-Yes.
8441. Did you always go to Hillswick for your supplies?-No;
only twice a year. I went for my fishing gear before the season
began, and then at the end of the season I went again to settle.
8442. Did you get supplies then?-Yes, if I needed them.
8443. Did you always get the balance in cash when it was due?-
Very often it was not due, and I could not expect a thing which
was not due.
8444. Why was it not due?-Because of the bad [Page 205]
fishings, and of the meal being very dear then; much more so
than it is now.
8445. Did you always get more supplies than the value of your
fish?-No, I did not do that always.
8446. But generally?-No, not at any time; I always tried to deal
so as not to be in debt.
8447. But you said there was seldom anything to get at settling?-
There was very seldom any cash that I had to take, because they
were lean fishings.
8448. And because you had got supplies up to the value of your
fish?-No; but I did not ask for any supplies beyond what I
required for the fishing, and perhaps a little meal for my family,
which they could not do without.
8449. But the price of that was generally as much you had to get at
settlement?-It was.
8450. Was it ever more?-Not very often.
8451. Did you ever think of changing from one employer to
another?-No, I did not think of that, because I did not see any
good it could do me.
8452. Do you think you would not have got a better price?-No.
8453. And you would not have got better supplies from another
merchant?-The only merchant I ever dealt with was Mr. Inkster,
because his shop is nearest to me, and I always found his goods as
cheap as any other man's.
8454. Would it not have been far more convenient for you to have
got all your goods from Mr. Inkster's, instead of carrying them
from Hillswick?-Yes; but with regard to lines and hooks, and
such things as we require for the fishing, we could not get them
from Mr. Inkster, because we were bound to go for them to the
man that we fished for.
8455. How long is it since you gave up fishing?-About eight
years ago.
8456. You continued to go to the merchant for whom you fished
until that time?-Yes.
8457. Did you never think of fishing for Mr. Inkster?-No,
because the men I fished with in the boat wanted to go to Mr.
Anderson, and I did not want to make discord in the boat's crew.
8458. Have you heard the evidence of the other witnesses from
Muckle Roe, Gideon Williamson and John Wood?-Yes.
8459. Is there anything additional that you want to say?-No.
8460. Do you think the fishermen are generally quite free to
engage to fish to any employer they like?-They are quite right
to engage to any man that would give the best bargain and the
best agreement, and that is the thing they should do.
8461. But they would just get as good a bargain from one
merchant as from another?-Yes, equally the same because it
appears that one fish merchant won't pay more for his fish
than another does.
8462. So that the fishermen would have no advantage in
changing?-No.
8463. They cannot better themselves by shifting?-They cannot.
8464. Has that been your experience since you have been a
fisherman?-It has been my experience all my life, and many
besides me have found the same thing.
8465. They would like to better to themselves, but they could
not?-That is the very thing.
8466. Do you think they would be better by curing their own
fish?-They have no chance of curing their own fish, because
those who do so have to find booths for them until the crafts come
to take away the cured fish. Besides, poor men like fishermen
cannot do that.
8467. They have to buy salt for the curing, and that costs a lot of
money?-Yes.
8468. So that they are obliged to give their fish green to the
merchant?-Yes.
8469. Have you ever known men to make any attempt to cure fish
for themselves?-I have.
8470. Have they not been any better off in that way?-If the
fish-curers had been agreeable to them doing that, they would have
made a little off it. They would have saved, perhaps, a few pounds
on the ton, but they could not find booths in which to put their fish
at the season when they require to be housed. They had to pay
cellar rent to the parties to whom the booths belonged.
8471. Could they sell their fish at as good a price as the curers
could?-No. They could not seek out for purchasers in the south
country as the curers can do, and they were obliged to sell their
fish to the Shetland merchants and at the price which was current
here.
8472. Don't you think the men would be better off if they could
get payment for their fish earlier in the season, and could go and
deal at any store they liked for their goods?-I don't know that
that would be any advantage to them, because they know by
experience that their earnings are very small, and they could not
afford to take them in that way. They must try to save their
earnings for their rents, and for the maintenance of their families.
8473. But if they got their money in their hand, instead of running
an account, would they not make a better use of it?-I don't know.
Some of them might be inclined to do so and some not.
8474. Might they not buy their goods cheaper if they had the
money to pay for them?-Some of them might, but some of them
might spend their money very carelessly.
8475. Did you hear what Gilbert Scollay said about getting meal
cheaper in the south than it can be got here?-We all know that
that is the case.
8476. Have any of you tried to get it in that way?-No.
8477. Why?-From want of knowledge. We don't know where to
go in order to find the cheapest market for meal.
8478. But Gilbert Scollay found out where to go and he would
have told you?-Gilbert Scollay might have done that, but we
never like to deal in the kind of meal which he bought.
8479. You could have got any sort of meal if you had asked it?-
Yes, he would have got any sort.
8480. And so would you if you had gone to the right quarter.
Don't you think if a lot of you now were to agree to buy meal from
a man in the south, and were getting the price of your fish in cash,
so that you could pay for the meal in cash, you would be able to
make a better thing of it?-There is no mistake about that.
8481. What is to hinder a boat's crew or two from agreeing to
bring their own meal from the south?-The fish-curer must
supply them with money before they could do that.
8482. Will not the curer advance money to the men if they want
it?-It would just be at his own option.
8483. Do you think the fish-curer would not give you the money
before the end of the season?-I don't know, I never asked it, and
what a man has not asked he cannot speak to at all.
8484. Do you think he would be likely to do it?-The merchants
might do it to some, and to some they would not. They could not
be expected to do it to a man who was indebted to them; but if a
man was clear with them, they might have no objections to
advance the money.
8485. I suppose it would not be easy to find a boat's crew where
some of the men were not in debt?-I think there are a good few
boats' crews of that kind.
8486. Could not a boat's crew, where none of the men were in
debt, get their money in that way?-Certainly they could if they
wished it.
8487. And they could import their meal from the south if they
found it any cheaper?-Perhaps they could.
8488. Do any of your people knit or weave?-They do.
8489. Are they paid for their work in the way which Mrs.
Williamson and Mrs. Johnston have described?-Yes.
8490. They are paid mostly in goods?-They can take either goods
or money, because they are not in debt to any man.
8491. Do you keep an account with any merchant?-No; I keep
the family accounts.
[Page 206]
8492. Do you keep them all in one?-Yes.
8493. Is that a common way at Muckle Roe?-I think it is, and I
think it is the best way.
8494. Have you sometimes taken their webs to sell to the
merchants?-Yes, I have sometimes done so.
8495. Have you ever got money for a web?-Yes, if I wanted it.
8496. But did you ever get it?-I have. I have got £4 at a time,
when the web was worth it.
8497. Was that long ago?-It was this very year.
8498. Did you get it all in money?-Yes.
8499. Was that at Voe?-No, it was at Brae from Mr. Inkster.
8500. Did you ever get as much money before for any web?-No,
I don't think so.
8501. Were you paid mostly in goods before?-No, not altogether
in goods. If I did not require the goods, I could have it in money,
because if I was not in debt to them they were obliged to pay me
the money.
8502. Were they always obliged to pay money for webs?-Yes, to
men who were clear with them, and who would not take their wool
from them.
8503. But a man who was not clear would not get all money?-
No, he could not expect it.
8504. The price of his cloth would be put to his account?-Yes.
8505. And he might get a little money if he wanted it?-Yes. I
never knew a merchant to refuse a man a little money if he was in
need of it.
8506. But the man had to tell the merchant that he was in need of
it?-Yes, if he was in need, he had to explain that to him.
8507. If a man was in debt to a merchant, and wanted to get money
for his web, could he not take it to another merchant?-Yes; but it
would not be very fair to do so. A man who is in debt to another
ought always to pay his debt when he can.
8508. But he might pay it at another time and he might be wanting
the money for his own immediate needs?-Such cases as that
might occur, but not very often.
8509. You think the people round about you don't often do that?-
I don't think they do.
Brae, January 13, 1872, PETER BLANCH, examined.
8510. Are you a fisherman and farmer near Brae?-Yes, about a
mile or a mile and a half north from this.
8511. Have you a good bit of land?-Yes, just about as big as most
of the people have hereabouts-a small allotment.
8512. Have you got a brother in Ollaberry?-I have a brother-in-
law there, and a cousin, William Blanch.
8513. Have you been present to-day?-Not all the time. I have
been here for about an hour.
8514. Have you heard the description which has been given of
how the fishermen are settled with for their accounts?-Yes. I
was present at the first meeting which was held at Brae.
8515. Do you settle in the same way as you have heard
described?-Yes, much in the same way; but I am a Faroe
fisherman, and I have been so for the last twelve years.
8516. Are you a skipper?-Yes.
8517. Who do you ship with?-I have been employed by Mr.
Adie's firm for the last five years. Before that I went out from
Lerwick. I went for Mr. Sutherland, and then for Mr. George Reid
Tait.
8518. You settle every year in the winter?-Yes, or sometimes
twice in one year, but not often.
8519. You get supplies, as a rule, from the merchant in whose
smack you go to the fishing?-Yes, we get that if we require them.
8520. But, as a rule, do you get your supplies from that
merchant?-As a rule we do, but there are exceptions. For my
own part, I have never been under the necessity of taking out
supplies unless I chose; but, generally speaking, I have taken
them out, especially stores required for our own use in the vessel.
8521. And when anything is required for the man's family at home
during the season, is it generally got from the same merchant?-It
may be. In most cases,, I think, that would be the case; but, for
my own part, was not bound to do that, because at the time of
settlement I had always something to take, and I could deal where
I chose.
8522. You say you were not bound to do it: is it common for men
to feel that they are bound to do that?-Of course. If I was
employed by a curer or a merchant, and had been in the habit of
dealing with another before I was employed by him, I would
consider it something like a duty, in a moral point of view, to put
my money into his shop, and I have done so, although I have never
been obligated to do it.
8523. Are some of the men obligated to do that?-I think they are
obligated, for this reason, that they could scarcely help themselves.
Perhaps they had not the money to purchase their goods elsewhere,
and they were bound for that reason from a selfish motive.
8524. You think they could not get credit elsewhere?-Yes. Some
of them I know could not get it elsewhere. Perhaps some of them
could.
8525. But the merchant who employs men at the Faroe fishing
is generally ready to give credit to a man who is in these
circumstances, and who does not have money?-Of course he
does. He understands he has that to do. They make advances,
perhaps before, but as soon as the men engage to go to the fishing.
It may be about this time, or it may be a month previous to this,
when they make the engagement to go.
8526. And they made an advance then either in cash or in
out-takes?-I don't think they will likely give much cash. They
may give 8s. or 10s. in cash, but unless they know the man is to be
depended upon I don't think they will give much more. They may
give man until he has made some earning by his fishing; but unless
it is a case where they know it can be paid back again by the man
otherwise, they will not give it. He may pay it out of his stock for
instance, he may have some other means. For my own part, of
course, I was always so far able to pay my account, and I never had
need to ask for money. I can only speak to that from personal
experience; but I have known men who sailed with me for eight or
nine years, and I know they have got a little money, perhaps 10s.
or £1, at a time when they required it.
8527. Although they were bound?-I did not know about their
being bound. I would not say much about that. I daresay some of
them would be bound, and some of them were not.
8528. Have you ever known men being bound when, they engaged
to a merchant?-No. I may have heard about it, but I could not
show it by proof.
8529. Have you heard of men who are obligated, as you said, to
engage with it particular merchant for the fishing because they
were in his debt?-No; I could not say definitely as to that.
8530. Have you had an idea or it notion that a man might have
engaged for that reason?-Yes; I have had that idea, and I have
been told so by men themselves, but these men are not here, and I
could not say that it was actually the case. For my own part, I have
never been in these circumstances.
8531. Have you ever considered whether you would be better
under any other arrangement than making settlement at the end
of the year for the Faroe fishing?-I have considered that matter,
and I have often thought that we might have been better than we
are under the present state of matters. That may have been partly
our own blame, in consequence of the want of information
among the fishermen; but I have often thought, and I think so
still, that we don't have that fair play which we ought to have. I
think the present system is almost, if not altogether, a one-sided
arrangement for the merchant. That is my opinion with regard to
the Faroe fishing, and the ling fishers say the [Page 207] same.
We don't know what we are to get until the end of the season. We
go and toil away and catch fish if we can, but we don't know what
we are to get for them until the time of settlement. There is an
arrangement made between the fish-curers or merchants, and by
that time they have made up their minds, and have fixed upon
certain price, while we under our agreement have just to take
what they please to give us. Our understanding is that the crew get
one-half of the nett, and the fish-merchant or curer gets the other
half for his vessel. Of course, the salt and the expenses of curing
deducted, and the master's and mate's extra, and the score money.
8532. There are some deductions before you come to the nett?-
Yes; we don't get one half of the gross; we only get one-half of the
nett. There is allowance for salt and curing, which is generally £2,
10s., and I think it could be done cheaper, but that may be our own
blame. Then there is the master's extra and the mate's extra,
which is a fee of so much per ton to each, according as the
agreement is made.
8533. What other deduction is there?-There is score-money, and
there may be the expense of bringing the fish to market.
8534. Is that a deduction, or does it not come off the merchant's
half of the nett?-I don't know exactly how that is done. We
never see the account sales of the fish, although we ought to see
them, but that may be our own blame too.
8535. You don't know whether the merchant gets commission of
5 per cent?-I have been told so by one merchant that I was
employed by, Mr. Grierson. I never was told that by any other
merchant for whom I was employed, but Mr. Grierson told me that
was actually so in his case.
8536. You are a skipper, and you actually don't know how the
deductions are made which come off before the nett produce is
halved?-Of course I have asked about these things, and I have
been told that there were no other deductions taken off beyond
what have mentioned.
8537. Do you have nothing to do with the making of these
deductions yourself?-No.
8538. You have nothing to do with the weighing of the fish, nor
with the selling of them?-No; nor with making a market for
them.
8539. But you think you might be more fairly dealt with than
you are?-I think we might. I don't know whether that is
altogether the merchant's blame, but think we could have a fairer
understanding, for two reasons: In the first place, we ought to have
an understanding when we start or engage that we are to have a
certain fixed price for our fish, the same as the Englishmen have.
They know what they are to get before their fish are caught.
8540. Where do these Englishmen fish?-They are in smacks that
come from London and Grimsby and Hull and Berwick, and they
fish for curers in Shetland, and land their fish here.
8541. Have these men all an agreement for a fixed price?-So
far as I understand, they have. At least I have been told so by
themselves.
8542. These men have a fixed agreement with the curers here to
whom they sell?-Yes. Of course, their men are not paid in the
same way as we are. The men on board these vessels, except the
masters, are paid by weekly wages.
8543. And the master makes a bargain with the merchant here
about the fish?-I rather think it is the owner who makes the
bargain.
8544. Do you know the nature of the bargain they make?-I
cannot say that I know definitely. I know the merchant here agrees
to pay them a fixed price when the fish are landed in a dry state.
They are salted on board the vessels, and they get £10, £11, or
£12 a ton for salted fish when landed. They know they are to get
that before the fish are caught, and they cannot expect anything
more. Now; I say we ought to have something like that, and then
we would know what we were actually working for. It might be
that in that way we would get less than we do present, but we
would have a fair understanding. If we lost in one year, we might
gain in another.
8545. Do you think the men in Shetland, generally speaking,
would be inclined to consent to a bargain of that sort? Would they
not grumble very much if the price rose considerably before the
end of the season?-It would only be parties who were dull of
apprehension that would be likely to grumble. It would not be the
intelligent men. For my part, and so far as my experience goes, I
don't think a man of intelligence and experience would have a
right to grumble in that case and I don't think he would do so.
There are a great many I have spoken to, and reasoned the matter
with, who, I don't think, would grumble.
8546. Do you think the fishermen, under such a system, would
have the same advantage at the beginning of the season in making
a bargain as the masters would have? Would the masters not be
likely to know better what the market price was likely to be
towards the end of the season, and thus be able to make a
calculation as to the price more in their own favour?-The
merchants ought, from their position, to have more information
as to the probable state of the market, and, a rule, they do have
more information; but I believe there are not a few masters of
Faroe fishing vessels who could make as good a market, or nearly
as good a market, as the curers could.
8547. You think they have all the information necessary to guide
them in making a good bargain in the beginning of the season, or
just as much as the curers have?-Yes. A curer would just be as
likely to make a mistake in his arrangements as I would be. The
market is so fluctuating that it is possible a curer may go and make
a loss. He might possibly make an arrangement with another
merchant to sell his fish at a certain fixed price, and there is a
possibility of the fish rising after that, and of course I would stand
the same chance.
8548. Do you say that in the English vessels the fish is salted
before it is put on shore?-Yes.
8549. Is that the case in your smacks also?-Yes; we are always
bound to do that. We could not keep the fish otherwise. When
fishing on the coast of Faroe or Iceland, or elsewhere, we cannot
help ourselves; we must salt them in order to save them.
8550. Is the salt put on board the vessel, and supplied by the
fish-curer at starting?-Yes.
8551. You said you thought 50s. a ton was rather too high a charge
for salting and curing: is that your opinion?-I am inclined to
think so. I know the price of salt as well as the curers do. I have
been in the habit of buying salt at Liverpool more than two or three
times, and I know what I have paid for it, buying it with ready
money. The last cargo of salt which I brought here cost 7s. per
ton, when ready to leave Liverpool, and the freight here would be
10s. Then there would be 1s. per ton for landing, at least. Then
there would be 2s. for wastage and they might take off 1s. or 2s.
more for cellar rent. That would be 22s.
8552. Would that be the total cost of the salt delivered in
Shetland?-It might vary; but that is what I paid for it the last
time I bought a cargo.
8553. Do you think 22s. is a liberal calculation for it?-I think so.
Then the people have to be paid for curing, that is, washing and
drying the fish, and I think they generally pay at least 12s. per ton,
or in some cases more, for that. I have never cured fish myself,
but I have been told by curers that that is about the expense.
8554. That would be 12s. for the workpeople employed at the
curing; but you would also require some allowance for implements
and sheds and booths?-No doubt an allowance would require to
be made for that too. In some cases a man may be curing fish
where he has to provide a booth for himself, and he has to get
covering from the fish-curer or merchant. That, however, would
only be a trifle.,
8555. Would 3s. a ton be too much for that?-As rule, I think it
would not.
8556. Would it be too little?-I think it would not be too little; I
think it would fully meet it.
[Page 208]
8557. Would there be any other expense for the curing of the
fish?-Not so far as the curing is concerned.
8558. You say the charge for curing is 50s.?-Yes. I have paid my
share of it at that rate, and I have sometimes paid for it at the rate
of 52s. 6d., but it has been less than 50s. in my experience. At one
time it was 45s., but of late years it has never been less than 50s.
8559. The calculation which you have made comes so that you
think the fish-curer makes a profit of 13s. per ton upon the curing:
is that your opinion?-My opinion is just exactly as I have stated
it. It is possible I may be wrong in some of the items, because in
some cases the merchant may have to give the curer more. It may
be a late season, or a wet season, and in order to get the fish dried
and ready for market it is possible they might encourage the curer,
by giving him 1s. or 2s. more.
8560. The expense might be more than 37s. a ton in some
cases?-It might be.
8561. But you think that 37s. a ton is a fair enough calculation,
so far as you can make it, for the usual expenses of salting and
curing?-I think so.
8562. Do you think fishermen could cure for themselves upon a
small scale?-It might not be easy to get a crew together which
could do that, but I think it could be done. I do not see why the
master of a Faroe fishing vessel could not get a man to cure his
fish as well as another man. There are often beaches that he could
get the use of for the time being, and I think it is quite possible
they could get their fish cured, but there may be some difficulty
about it. It might be that every person would not be able to do it.
8563. You do not know whether that has been tried?-I do not.
For my own part, I never attempted it.
8564. Do you think the system of running accounts among the
Faroe fishermen you have met with has led them to incur too large
amounts of debt?-I am inclined to think so.
8565. Is that one of your reasons for wishing to have a price fixed
at the beginning of the year?-That would be one of the special
reasons, but it is not the whole reason. I have another reason for
that, which is, that as the system exists now, if the merchant makes
a good bargain or a good market for his fish, and the man he sells
them to does not fail before the price is payable, the merchant
never loses, because he never pays the price to us before then
which he can afford to pay. He is always secure; but if he had a
fixed price to pay for the fish; he might lose as quick as I would.
That is my main reason for objecting to this system. I would like
to have the thing altered so that there might be something like fair
play, and that if I lose, I lose, and that if I gain, I gain. I am not
saying that the merchant is not paying me a fair price now. He
may be paying me all he can afford to pay, but I don't know that.
8566. But by the system you propose, the price might be lower
than is sufficient for your labour?-I would have to take my
chance of that. In my experience I have had to contend with three
all but total failures at the fishing, and of course our labour and
time went for almost nothing. But that was not the owner's blame;
we could not help it, and no more could he.
8567. Is there any other plan for the payment of fish that has
occurred to you? How would it do, for instance, if a certain part
of the price per cwt. were arranged to be paid on delivery of the
green fish, and that the rest, whatever it might be, should be paid
at settlement according to the current price?-I could scarcely
speak with regard to green fish, because my experience has been in
salted fish, and I would only like to speak about that with which I
have been myself more immediately connected. But speaking with
regard to salted fish only, what you have suggested would be a far
better way, because I would then have a chance of seeing my fish
weighed out. I don't think the merchant has cheated me out of a
ton or half a ton of fish, but I have not had the chance of seeing my
fish weighed when I was there. Each vessel's catch is kept and
cured separately; but when we come to deliver the fish, if we had
a chance of seeing it weighed then, and got a certain figure for it,
that would be exactly the way in which these Englishmen deal.
They see their fish weighed, and they know what they are getting
for each ton or each cwt. of it, and they have nothing more to
expect. But we don't do that; we get the dried fish price.
8568. Do you know how much green fish makes a cwt. of dry?-I
know that about 21/4 cwt. is the general rate allowed in the ling
fishing for green fish, but if it is good fish it will not require so
much as that I have helped to cure myself, but it may be as much
as that with bad fish. As to salted fish, I could not say definitely
what is the proportion.
8569. There is no such calculation required in the Faroe fishing?-
No; it does not come so immediately under my notice. I never saw
my fish weighed dry; I have seen them occasionally weighed wet,
but not often.
8570. Are they occasionally weighed wet in the Faroe fishing?-
Sometimes, not often. It is done perhaps on shore or on board, as
it happens. Suppose we land them at a different station from what
we intended, they are counted out and weighed when sold, and
then the owner or fish-curer will know what they can turn out
when dry. That is the reason why they are weighed.
8571. Then there must be a calculation made in that case?-There
is, but I do not know exactly what it is.
8572. To go back to your calculation about the expense of curing
fish, can you tell me how much salt is required to cure a ton of
fish?-We generally reckon upon a ton of salt to a ton of dry fish.
If the salt is well cared for it will do a little more but we generally
reckon upon that as an average.
8573. Is the salt which the fish get all put on them before they
are put on shore?-Yes; it is all put on. There is none put on
afterwards, except it may be in the case of a few fish which are
likely to give way, or when we get fish and have not enough salt,
but that is a case of emergency and an exception-not the rule. As
a rule, we cure our fish and put all the salt on them they require.
8574. Have you any knowledge of the system of payment in the
ling fishing?-Only from what I have heard about it. I have been
at it only once when I was a lad; and I cannot say much about it
from experience.
8575. Do you think your neighbours are generally quite at liberty
to deal with any merchant they please in the ling fishing?-I
believe they are at perfect liberty so far as any man is concerned
who could stand in a position like me, and be able to pay his way
at any time; but I think a man who could not pay his way, and who
was always in debt, would not be at liberty to go where he chose. I
am not sure that even he would not be at liberty to use his own
judgment, and deal where he liked; but I don't know that he would
be looked well upon if he went to another. That is to say, if he
was in debt £10 or £20 to a merchant, I don't think the merchant
would look well upon it if the man went to another merchant to
whom he owed nothing, and fished for him. At least that is what
they have told me, and what I have known; but, of course, a man
who can pay his way, and who is not bound to fish for a certain
individual, can do as he likes. There are fishermen in other parts
of the country who are bound to fish for their landowner or their
factor, but that does not exist here.
8576. Is there anything else you wish to state?-I don't think
there is anything about any matter with which I am immediately
connected. We used to make a little Shetland cloth, but I could
only corroborate the evidence that has been already given about
that. I have never been under the necessity of selling it to a
particular party, and I have got the money for it when I asked it. I
don't know that the same price is always given in money as when
it is taken in goods; but if I needed money, and asked for it, I
always got it.
[Page 209]
8577. Then you have no objection to the practice which exists with
regard to the hosiery trade?-No; I would not say anything about
that.
8578. Have you any objection to what is done in the cloth trade?-
It is the cloth trade I mean. Of course the knitting is a thing that I
am not immediately connected with; there is not much done in that
way with me. I know, however, that in some cases, although
perhaps not in all, where women have been knitting hosiery, and
they have got a certain price for an article, yet by buying tea or
groceries, which are reckoned as money articles, they would have
to pay more for them. They would have to pay 2d. or 11/2d. more
upon a 1/4 lb. of tea, because it was being paid for by hosiery; but I
think I would have preferred a different way of dealing with them.
I think, if I had been in a position like that, I would have given
them less for their hosiery, and sold the articles to them at a fixed
price. It would just have come to the very same thing with the
merchants.
8579. You think that would have been a wiser course for the
merchants to take?-Yes. I remember on one occasion when I
brought two or three articles of hosiery to a merchant, I got a
certain sum put upon them; but when I got a little tea from him, he
said he had to make the tea 2d. more per quarter, because it was
paid for in hosiery. I said to him I would not deal in that way if I
were him, but that I would give a little less for the hosiery, and I
would charge a fixed price for my tea, or whatever other articles I
was selling; but he said, 'We must all do that, because if I were to
say that I would not give a woman so much for her hosiery, she
would go to another merchant with it, and they would give her a
higher price, and lay it on their goods;' which I have no doubt they
do.
8580. Therefore you did not convince the hosiery merchant?-I
convinced him so far, that I got my price. I would not pay the
price he charged, and would have taken my article of hosiery back
rather than pay it.
8581. Did that take place some years ago?-Yes; it is not less than
six years ago.
Brae, January 13, 1872, THOMAS ROBERTSON, examined.
8582. Have you been a fisherman here all your life?-Not all my
life; but I have been for a number of years.
8583. You hold a bit of ground at Weathersta?-Yes.
8584. Who do you fish for?-For Mr Adie, Voe.
8585. Do you settle with him every year?-Yes.
8586. Do you generally get some of your balance in cash?-Yes.
If I have a balance to get I get it, but I always got money when I
asked it, whether I had it to get or not.
8587. Do you get money advanced to you in the course of the
year?-Yes; whenever I ask it.
8588. Did you get that ten years ago if you asked for it?-I did.
8589. Was that the practice then?-Yes; but I never asked for
money unless I required it.
8590. You wanted goods oftener?-Yes.
8591. How far is it from Voe to your place?-About three miles.
8592. Is Mr. Adie's the nearest shop to you?-No. Brae is nearer
than Voe.
8593. But you dealt at Voe, because you were fishing for Mr.
Adie?-I dealt some at Brae too; but mostly at Voe.
8594. Was that because you had an account there?-Yes.
8595. And it was more convenient for you sometimes to deal upon
credit?-Yes.
8596. I suppose you would get a larger advance in goods at that
shop than you would have got if you were to ask money?-I don't
know; I only asked for goods when I was needing them.
8597. But if you had asked money with which to go and buy your
goods elsewhere, would you have got it?-I cannot say, for I never
asked it.
8598. Have you heard the evidence of Robertson and Wood, and
the other fishermen who have been examined to-day?-Yes.
8599. Have you anything different to say from what they said
about the system of dealing among the fishermen here?-No.
8600. Have you known fishermen changing from one employment
to another?-I have.
8601. Have you done that yourself?-No.
8602. You have always fished for Mr. Adie?-Yes.
8603. What is the general reason for the men shifting?-I don't
know. I suppose it is because they think they will be better.
8604. How are they better, when the same price is always paid at
the end of the year by all the curers?-I cannot see where they can
be better by shifting from one man to another; I never felt that I
would be any better to do so.
8605. I understand all the merchants hereabout pay the same
current price for fish?-Yes. Mr. Adie proposed a stated
agreement to me for fishing herring. The herrings in Shetland
then were 7s. a cran, and he agreed that he would give us 8s. a
cran; but we have only got 8s. a cran for two years. The price
varies with the agreement in each year; sometimes we get 13s. a
cran, sometimes 10s., and sometimes 12s.-just up and down.
8606. Do you generally go to the herring fishing every year?-Yes.
8607. At what season of the year do you go?-August and
September; after we are done with the ling fishing.
8608. And the bargain for the herring fishing is that you are to get
so much a cran?-Yes; that was the agreement we had with Mr.
Adie when we took our nets.
8609. Do you hire nets from him for that fishing?-No, we buy
them, and they are put into our accounts.
8610. Have you paid off the price of these nets now?-Yes.
8611. How long did it take you to pay them?-I could not say
exactly, but I think it took us between 8 and 9 years to pay for
them all, because we had lean fishings.
8612. You mean that the herring fishing was poor?-Yes.
8613. Did you get them paid off at last?-Yes.
8614. Is the price for the herrings paid down whenever you deliver
them?-No.
8615. Do you keep an account for the herring fishing separate
from the account for the ling fishing?-Yes.
8616. Do you get goods to the other side of that account too?-No;
they are all in the same account.
8617. Your goods are kept in an account at Voe?-Yes.
8618. And the price of the herrings is entered to your credit when
you settle?-Yes.
8619. Do you keep a pass-book?-Yes.
8620. Have you got it now?-No; I don't have it, because we think
there is no use keeping it after the end of the season. Once we find
the pass-book to be correct, we think it is of no farther use, and
when I brought it home I suppose the bairns tore it up.
8621. When you square up your account at the end of the year, do
you go and look at all the items in Mr. Adie's book?-Yes.
8622. Are they read over to you?-Yes; I compare them with the
items in my book, and I see that they are all correct.
8623. Is it mostly goods or cash that you get in the course of the
year?-It is goods for the most part but I get a good part of cash
too.
[Page 210]
Brae, January 13, 1872, JOHN RATTER, examined.
8624. You are a fisherman at Weathersta?-Yes.
8625. Do you fish for Mr. Adie?-Yes.
8626. Have you heard what Thomas Robertson has said?-Yes.
8627. Does it all apply to your case as well as his?-Exactly.
8628. How long have you fished for Mr. Adie?-Six years.
8629. Where did you fish before?-I did not fish for any one
before, except going for a fee to the ling fishing.
8630. Do you go to the herring fishing also?-Yes.
8631. And you are paid for it in the same way as Robertson?-
Yes.
8632. You get a fixed price for the herring?-Yes.
8633. Have you anything to add to what he has said?-No.
Brae, January 13, 1872, GILBERT SCOLLAY, recalled.
8634. Is there anything further you wish to say?-I forgot that I
had my pass-book with Mr. Adie for this year with me. It shows
the goods I am getting now. [Produces book.]
8635. I thought you were getting your goods at cash price now?-
Yes; I had a promise of them at cash price.
8636. I see there is tea, 5d.?-That is for 2 oz. of tea.
8637. Then you are not getting them for cash price yet?-I have no
doubt that when I settle with Mr. Adie he will square that up. I
have his promise for it, and I have no doubt that he will do it. I
wish further to say, that this truck system or compulsory barter is
a great cause of pauperism, as it makes the poor careless and the
rich fearless; because, should the head of the family die, the
creditor will probably take the effects left, and consequently leave
the widow and fatherless children, if any, on the parish. Another
thing is, that when the merchants have it in their power to price
both their goods and mine, they clearly see that I must sell, and off
it must go at whatever they say is the value, and I must take their
goods at the value they are pleased to put upon them, and I-if I
am in debt-dare not grumble.
8638. What goods have you had to sell upon which they have put
their own price?-For one thing, I have been a carrier of hosiery to
different places.
8639. Who have you carried hosiery for?-Perhaps for my wife or
others, and the value of the stockings was made to be 10d., or 8d.,
or 7d. If I took tea, and the value of the stockings was 10d., I
could only get 9d. worth. If I took cotton goods I would get the
full value, but not if I took tea. Then, if under this system a man
gets into debt, it is more in appearance than in reality; and should
that man ask money from the apparent creditor, the old account
will be shaken at him as a scarecrow, and he is generally told to
pay his credit and transfer his custom, and that consequently nails
him to the old plan. As to the difference in the price of meal, what
deceived me in that line was, that I and others were often told that
they only charged 2s. per sack as a commission, which would have
been £10 per 100 sacks; but at last, when I wrote to some of the
meal dealers in the south, I found it was more like £50 per 100
sacks-that is 10s. per sack instead of 2s.
Brae, January 13, 1872, WILLIAM ADIE, examined.
8640. You are a son of Mr. T.M. Adie, who has been already
examined?-I am. I am a partner of the business carried on at
Voe, although it is carried on in my father's name. I have been
a partner for seven or eight years.
8641. Are you aware of any arrangement existing between Messrs.
Adie, Anderson, and Inkster, to this effect, that when a fisherman
who is in debt to one of these curers goes to another, the new
employer undertakes the debt incurred to the former employer?-
There was an arrangement of that sort entered into.
8642. Has it been acted upon to a certain extent?-Yes; I think it
has been pretty well carried out.
8643. Was it reduced to writing?-Yes; I think the original
document is in our possession. I will send it to you.* A principal
object or inducement for having that document drawn up was, that
a great many of our fishermen were in the habit of settling at the
end of the season, and getting advances for rent, or of goods, on
the understanding that they were to fish, or go in a boat of ours to
the fishing, in the following season; and then they left and went to
Mr. Anderson, and took similar advances from him.
8644. Did you find that a man who got into arrears in your books,
and to whom you were obliged to refuse supplies on account of his
debt being too large, was apt to go to another merchant and engage
with him for the following season?-In some cases perhaps they
did so, but not as a rule.
8645. But did you not find that when a man's debt got so large that
you had to refuse him supplies, and he was not likely to pay it, he
went away to another merchant instead of continuing to fish for
you?-Sometimes; but most of the men, when they are in debt in
that way, save as much as possible, and keep under expenses, in
order to assist in getting the debt cleared off.
8646. You see when a man is trying to keep down expenses, and
you help him as far as possible?-Yes.
8647. Do you remember of one William Inkster leaving you in that
way a good many years ago?-Yes.
8648. And Mr. Anderson paid the whole of his debt to you under
that agreement?-Yes; Mr. Anderson paid his debt.
8649. Have other cases occurred of a similar kind?-Yes; I think
we have paid Mr. Anderson some accounts for some of his men,
and he has paid us.
8650. Is it the full debt that is paid in these cases, or only a
proportion of it, or do you make a compromise?-Sometimes
we make a compromise.
8651. Was there any understanding when you took the lease of
your premises at Voe, that no shop should be permitted on the
Busta estate near you?-I cannot speak positively on that matter.
I don't know the terms of the lease exactly. I think there was a
stipulation in the last lease, with regard to the pasture ground, that
no business should be carried on upon it.
8652. Do you mean no fish-curing business?-No shop. There
was a talk at one time of having a [Page 211] public-house put up
there; and I think it was with reference to that that the stipulation
was put in. That was in the lease of the park or enclosed property.
8653. Has your firm a grocer's licence?-Yes.
8654. I understand there is no public-house in the
neighbourhood?-No; we have a spirit licence.
8655. Have you a public-house licence as well?-Yes.
8656. That business is carried on, of course, in different premises
from your other business?-No; they are carried on in the same
premises.
8657. Is there not a different door to the place where you sell the
spirits?-No; we are quite at liberty to sell spirits there, but not to
consume them on the premises.
8658. Then you have no licence at all to consume on the
premises?-No.
8659. And the licence you have is not a public house licence?-
No.
8660. You have been present to-day and heard the evidence: is
there any observation you wish to make upon it?-I don't know
that there is. I think most of the things which have been referred
to were explained by my father. There is something, however,
with reference to the curing of the fish which I may refer to. That
matter has scarcely been gone into as it should have been. For
instance, it has been stated that a ton of salt will cure a ton of fish
in one of the Faroe vessels, but it never does so. At one time, I
believe, it would have cured a ton of fish, but there is a fearful
extravagance and waste of salt going on in these vessels now.
There are tons of salt which are wasted among ballast, and in other
ways, so that we never turn out a ton of dry fish for a ton of salt.
8661. You heard the calculation made by Blanch on that
subject?-Yes. Salt costs us a great deal more than he mentioned;
we don't have salt in our cellars under 27s. or 27s. 6d., and there is
the cost of shipping again into the vessels and wastage.
8662. He allowed 2s. a ton for waste?-Yes, in landing, but not in
shipping; 2s. a ton will not cover the waste both in landing and
shipping; and then the cost of labour is very much higher than it
used to be.
8663. Is 12s. a ton an insufficient allowance for labour?-It is.
8664. Have you made a calculation of that at any time for the
purposes of your business?-We can scarcely get an accurate
calculation made, but I am certain it is more than he stated.
There are different parcels of fish landed from different vessels
to be cured, and we cannot keep an accurate account of the time
expended on each parcel.
8665. But take a single ton of fish: is 12s. more than the ordinary
cost of curing it?-No; it is considerably less than the cost. I am
perfectly certain of that.
8666. Is 50s. per ton, the ordinary deduction charged off fishermen
for the Faroe fishing, very much above the actual cost?-I don't
think it is 6d. over the actual cost.
8667. Does that include anything for superintendence?-Of
course, it includes the allowance for our utensils, and the cost of
beaches and superintendence. Then Blanch said there was a
deduction of 5 per cent, but it is not 5 per cent. that is deducted.
There is generally £1 per ton deducted for expenses in realizing
the fish and storage, and so on.
8668. Is that £1 per ton on the cured fish?-Yes; that is known all
over the country to be the ordinary rate of charge.
8669. That comes to nearly 5 per cent.?-Yes; sometimes it is a
little more than 5 per cent, and sometimes it is not so much.
8670. Are these all the deductions that are made before the
division of the proceeds of the cured fish?-Yes; there is the
curing, and the master and the mate's extra, and the score-money.
8671. What is score-money?-The men are paid so much for each
score of fish they individually draw.
8672. That is to say, each man counts the fish which he gets with
his own lines?-Yes, and he gets 6d. a score for them.
8673. That is a sort of premium upon industry?-Yes; that is
deducted from the gross, and paid to the individual fisherman.
8674. Is there any other deduction in favour of either the merchant
or the men?-I am not aware of any. There are some payments for
bait which are deducted too. That is charged against the vessel's
fishing, and deducted from the gross.
8675. Is there any expense for lines, or do the men furnish their
own lines?-The men furnish their lines in the Faroe fishing.
8676. Is the price of these lines charged against the fishing, or
against the men individually?-Against the men individually.
Each man gets his own lines, and they are charged in his
individual account. There is a stock of lines generally kept by
the master on board the vessel, and they are supplied by him to
the men on board.
8677. These stores on board the vessel go to the individual account
of the men?-Yes, stores of all kinds. We supply them with 8 lbs.
of bread per man per week, and they find their own small stores.
8678. These they generally purchase in your shop?-Yes.
8679. And they are put to their account?-Yes.
* The agreement referred to was afterwards sent in, and was in the
following terms:-'We, Gideon Anderson, of Ollaberry; John
Anderson, Hillswick; James Inkster, Brae; and Thomas M. Adie,
Voe; considering the very disastrous consequences likely to ensue
to ourselves, and ultimately to our fishermen, from the reckless
system of giving them advances which has been for some time
practised, and knowing that such system is farther followed from
the fact that if any of us refused their demands, however absurd,
they turned to another, who gave them what they wanted; we have
resolved to do away with such in future, so that each of us may be
able to exercise his own judgment as to the propriety of what
advances he may make to his fishermen;' and the parties agreed
and bound themselves, so long as they continued as fishcurers in
the same localities, 'not to tamper with or engage each other's
fishermen, or allow our boat-skippers or men to do so, or to make
advances of rents to them on their cattle, sheep, or ponies, or under
any circumstances whatever, unless they produce a certificate from
any of us whom they last fished for, to the effect that he is clear of
debt and all other obligations existing therefrom, or in connection
with the fishing,' under a penalty of £5, to be paid to the poor of
the parish.
In a letter with reference to this agreement Mr. T. M. Adie says:-
'The only way in which it has ever had to be acted on is, that
occasionally some man would like to be in a boat more convenient
for him, when any of us whom he had fished for gave him a note
stating that he was under no obligation, or if he was due a balance,
the curer he went to paid it for him. On some occasions we had
found that a worthless fellow would get what he actually needed
advanced to him, and then, if any fancied want was not supplied,
he would leave the boat, and the rest of the crew lost their fishing
for want of a man in his stead, and it tended to keep down
advances in goods so that men had, more money to get.'
Brae, January 13, 1872, CHARLES NICHOLSON, examined.
8680. Where do you live?-In North Delting.
8681. Are you a fisherman?-I am.
8682. Who do you fish for?-Messrs. Pole, Hoseason, & Co.
8683. How far do you live from Mossbank?-About a mile.
8684. How long have you fished for Pole, Hoseason, & Co.?-Five
years.
8685. Do you keep an account at the Mossbank shop?-Yes.
8686. Do you make a settlement at the end of the year?-Yes.
8687. Do you get any money at settlement?-Yes, I get my rent.
8688. Who do you pay your rent to?-Mr. John Robertson. I live
on the Lunna estate; Sheriff Bell is the proprietor.
8689. Do you get any more money from Pole, Hoseason, & Co.,
besides your rent?-No more money, as I don't have it to get.
8690. Is that because you are in debt?-Yes.
8691. How far are you behind?-I was behind £3 at the last
settlement, but I have been as much behind as £13.
8692. Are you always behind in your accounts?-Yes.
8693. And you always go to fish for Pole, Hoseason, & Co., in the
hope of paying them off?-Yes.
8694. Are you at liberty to fish for any other merchant?-No.
8695. Why?-Because I am in debt, and I cannot pay my debt,
therefore I am obliged to fish for Mr. Pole.
8696. If you were to go to fish for another merchant and get paid
by him in money, could you not pay off your debt to Pole,
Hoseason, & Co.?-I might, but I don't see what good that would
do. I get the same price for my fish from Mr. Pole as I would get
from any other body.
8697. But don't you think you run up a bigger account when you
are dealing with Pole, Hoseason, & Co., than you would do if you
were getting your cash in hand?-Yes; if I had cash to purchase
my meal, which is the principal thing I require, I would get it
cheaper elsewhere.
8698. What is the price of meal at Mossbank just now?-I cannot
say rightly.
[Page 212]
8699. When did you know last? Have you made your settlement
this year?-Yes.
8700. Don't you know what you were charged for meal then?-
No.
8701. Do you ask the price of your meal as you buy it?-
Sometimes; but we must take it, whatever it is, because we
have no money to purchase it with elsewhere.
8702. Whose fault is that?-I don't know.
8703. Is it the merchant's fault?-I cannot say that is.
8704. Do you think Messrs. Pole Hoseason, & Co. charge too
high for their goods?-Yes; if we had money we could get them
cheaper in Lerwick.
8705. But I suppose you would have money if you could save as
much as would keep you for one year?-Yes.
8706. If you could manage that, you would not run into the
merchant's debt at all, but you would have all your cash to get at
settlement?-Yes, if we had as much as would once clear us off.
8707. Can you not manage to do that?-No. I have a small family,
and there is a great quantity of bread to buy, and clothes and
everything. I have nothing but what I can earn by the fishing.
8708. What kind of bread do you buy?-Oatmeal and flour.
8709. Are there many men who are in debt at Mossbank in the
same way as you?-I believe there are a few, but I cannot say.
8710. Do you want to go to fish for any other merchant?-No; I
don't see any good that that would do to me.
8711. Is there anything else you wish to say?-Nothing.
8712. Was there anything else you wanted to say when you came
here?-No.
Brae, January 13, 1872, PETER BLANCH, recalled.
8713. Do you wish to add anything to your former evidence?-
About the cost of fish-curing, I said I was not speaking exactly
from my own experience with regard to the sum paid, but I know
that we have never used more than a ton of salt to a ton of fish on
the average. I wish also to say that I have been told more than
once by parties who have cured fish for Mr. Adie and others, that
they only paid 12s. per ton of fish for the labour of curing. I also
say that I have paid 1s. for landing salt at Lerwick, and nothing
more, and I allow 2s. for wastage. These are things which Mr.
William Adie thought I had no doubt exaggerated, but I am
conscious of the fact that I told nothing but the truth.
8714. Was 12s. per ton a price which was paid under contract?-
Yes.
8715. Who are the parties who told you about that?-Arthur
Harrison was the last one I spoke to. I landed fish to be cured by
him, and he told me so. There was another man who told me the
same thing about five years ago, John Henry, Sandsting, in Walls.
With regard to the price paid for lines, I wish also to say that we
have to furnish our own lines in the Faroe fishing. You were
asking me if I thought there was a possibility of our bettering
ourselves. I thought there was, and that was one of the ways in
which I thought we might do so. I have always thought that the
owner, when he provided a vessel, ought also to provide the
material for the catching of the fish; but instead of that we have to
provide our own lines, and supply other lines if we happen to lose
them, at a very dear price. We 21/2 lines for each man, and we pay
2s. 6d. for what I know the merchants buy at 2s. or 1s. 6d.
8716. Could you not buy your lines at another shop if you
chose?-Yes; we could do that.
8717. Is it part of the arrangement that you are to take these lines
from the owner of the vessel?-I don't know that it is part of the
arrangement, but I don't think they would like it very well if we
went to another; still I don't know that we would be prevented.
8718. Do not the men sometimes hire the lines?-No; never in my
experience in the Faroe fishing.
Brae, January 13, 1872, JOHN NICHOLSON, examined.
8719. Where do you come from?-North Delting.
8720. Who do you fish for?-Messrs Pole, Hoseason, & Co.
8721. Have you heard the evidence of Charles Nicholson?-Yes;
and I would like to say about the price of our fish, that I don't
think it is very right that the men should have to go to the fishing
at the beginning of the season, and don't know what they are to get
until they come to settle.
8722. Do you think you ought to have your price fixed at the
beginning of the season?-Yes.
8723. Have you ever asked for that?-No; we have never asked for
it.
8724. Why?-Because some of the crew are for it and others are
against it, and we could not get the thing rightly settled up amongst
ourselves.
8725. How long have you fished for Pole, Hoseason, & Co?-I
have fished there for about fourteen years, both before and after
Mr. Pole came to Mossbank.
8726. Where do you buy your goods?-From Mr. Pole.
8727. Anywhere else?-No.
8728. Do you never go to any other shop in the neighbourhood?-
Not very often.
8729. Why is that?-Because sometimes I don't have ready money
to go with.
8730. If you had ready money would you go anywhere else?-Yes.
8731. Why?-Because I could get my goods cheaper and better.
8732. Are you not satisfied with the quality of the goods at the
Mossbank shop?-No. There are some of the articles there which
are inferior to other people's, and dearer too.
8733. What articles are inferior?-Tea and sugar and meal.
8734. Where could you get them better?-In Lerwick.
8735. That is a long way to go for them?-Yes; but a man must
take some trouble upon himself when he gets them cheaper and
better.
8736. What are you paying at Mossbank store for these things just
now?-Tea is 3s. per lb., sugar is 5d., and meal is 50s.
8737. When did you buy any of these three articles in Lerwick?-
About a month ago.
8738. What did you get them for?-I got tea for 2s. 4d., sugar for
4d., and meal for 32s.
8739. What is the price of meal now?- About 48s. but it was 50s.
in summer, and I bought a sack, or two bolls, at 32s. in Lerwick.
8740. What quantity of meal did you buy at Mossbank last, for
which you paid 48s.?-I got it out in lesser quantities. They don't
like to give very much at one time, and I had to take it in less
quantities than I could get it in Lerwick.
8741. Were you in debt to the shop at the time?-A little; not very
much.
8742. And they would not give it to you because you were in
debt?-No.
8743. Was it by the lispund you bought it at Mossbank?-Yes; I
paid 5s. 8d. per lispund for it, but about the end of July it was 6s.
We generally take it by the quarter boll there.
8744. There are 32 lbs. to the lispund, and 280 lbs. in the sack?-
Yes.
8745. Was the quality of the articles you bought in Lerwick, at the
price you have mentioned, as good as what you got at Mossbank at
the prices which [Page 213] say are charged there?-If there was
any difference, they were better.
8746. But you had to carry them to Mossbank?-I had. The meal
came by the steamer, and I had to pay 8d. for that.
8747. Can you not get cash from Pole, Hoseason, Co. when you
require it, and go and buy your supplies in Lerwick?-Yes; what I
require for the fishing, but not otherwise.
8748. You cannot get what you require for your family?-No.
8749. How did you happen to have money when you went and
bought the meal in Lerwick?-I had it from my small boat fishing
in the winter, and I saved the money.
Brae, January 13, 1872, WILLIAM ADIE (recalled), examined.
8750. Is there anything further in what Blanch has said to which
you wish to refer?-Yes; he said that 12s. was the contract price
for curing our fish: that is false. We paid 13s. for curing fish at
Urrafirth, by Arthur Harrison.
8751. Was that your contract price for the fish cured by him this
year?-He has cured none for us this year. He only cured a few
fish for us in the fall, and he got more than that for them.
8752. Then that was the contract price in 1870?-Yes, for curing
alone. Then we had to pay 3s. a ton for landing and shipping these
fish from Voe to Urrafirth, and 3s. to Voe again; so that the curing
of the fish would cost us about £1.
8753. Why do you pay so heavy freights? Can you not have the
fish landed at Urrafirth in the first place?-No. We send them
there as a convenience for ourselves, but the men are bound to
land them at Voe, and we have to remove them at our own
expense. We have no storage at Urrafirth for them, and they have
to be removed to our own stores again.
8754. Why do you carry your fish to Urrafirth to be cured?-
Because we have not sufficient accommodation for them all at
Voe when we have a large take of fish.
8755. Then you have to send your surplus fish all that way to be
cured?-Yes.
8756. Does it not arise in that way that you have a loss upon these
fish?-Yes, we have a loss upon the fish when we cure them by
contract.
8757. These fish will cost you more than 50s. for curing?-Yes,
they cost us considerably more.
8758. But that will be recouped by your other profit?-Yes; but of
course we must pay that extra out of our own pockets.
8759. But it does not follow that you have a loss upon the total
proceeds of the fish?-No, we would not need to have that.
8760. The profit you calculate upon obtaining from the sale of
your fish is sufficient to cover an occasional loss of that sort, and
is calculated accordingly?- Yes. Of course, the extra charge on
the curing at Urrafirth won't come to nearly the £1 per ton which
we have for storage and commission on the fish.
8761. Is there any one else who wishes to be examined?- [No
answer.] Then I adjourn the inquiry here until further notice.
[<Adjourned.>]
Brae, January 13, 1872, JAMES GARRIOCH, examined.
8762. You are shopkeeper to Messrs. Hay & Co. at their shop in
the island of Fetlar?-I am.
8763. How long have you been there?-Three years past on 1st
December. Before that I was a store-keeper with them in Lerwick.
8764. Was that establishment in Lerwick the one from which both
Faroe fishers and home fishers got their supplies for the season,
and their outfit for the fishing?-Yes; and Messrs. Hay's country
shops were also supplied from that shop for the most part.
8765. I understand the supplies for the country shops are sent
down to you with invoices of the prices at which you are to sell
them?-That is done with some shops belonging to Messrs. Hay,
but with others it is not. To some of them the goods are sent down
at cost price, and the shopkeeper fixes what prices he thinks right.
That is what is done at Fetlar.
8766. I see from the books you have produced, that on September
25 oatmeal was 5s. 3d.: is that per lispund?-That is for a
quarter-boll.
8767. Do you not sell by the lispund?-Sometimes we do, just as
the parties want it.
8768. A quarter-boll would be 3 lbs. more than a lispund?-Yes.
8769. And 5s. 3d. per quarter-boll would be for 35 lbs.?-Yes.
8770. Have you the invoice showing at what price that was
invoiced to you from Lerwick?-I have not.
8771. Do you remember how much it was invoiced at?-No. It
was not a fixed thing for the whole season; it varies.
8772. When did you get your supplies of meal last summer?-It
comes from Aberdeen almost weekly or fortnightly during the time
the fishing continues.
8773. You do not sell much meal in Fetlar after the fishing is
over?-No; the people then have their crops to depend upon.
8774. When do you begin to sell the greatest quantity of goods at
your store?-About April; we begin to be much busier then. From
September until April the people are depending for the most part
upon their own crop, but sometimes they do take a little meal from
us.
8775. Was 5s. 3d. per quarter-boll the selling price for meal during
the whole season?-No; it differs greatly. Sometimes you will see
it is more, and sometimes less.
8776. I see that it is 5s. 3d. in September, and 5s. 9d. in July?-
Yes; I expect that would be about the dearest time.
8777. I see an entry of oatmeal, 22s. 8d., in August?-That would
be for a boll.
8778. Do you sell a boll at the same price, proportionally, as a
quarter-boll?-Just the same.
8779. You do not make a difference for the retail?-None
whatever.
8780. Do Messrs. Hay hold Fetlar, or any part of it, under tack?-
Not so far as I am aware.
8781. Are the fishermen there bound to fish for them in any
way?-I don't think they are; at least not to my knowledge.
They have tenants there; at least they are not tenants exactly, but
Messrs. Hay are factors for the Earl of Zetland. I don't know how
Lord Zetland's tenants do, but I don't think they are bound.
8782. At any rate they are not bound by their tacks in any way?-
Not so far as I am aware,
[Page 214]
8783. Is it mostly Lord Zetland's tenants who fish for Messrs. Hay
in Fetlar?-I think not.
8784. Do some of Lady Nicholson's tenants fish for them also?-
Yes; I should think about half-and-half.
8785. Are there any other proprietors in Fetlar than Lord Zetland
and Lady Nicholson?-Not for the fishermen. There are other
proprietors in the island, but none of their tenants fish.
8786. I see here, under date June 1, 1871, an entry against George
Gaunson, 'Cash for penalty per current account, £4, 2s. 2d.:' what
does that mean?-He was summoned to court for some wrecked
timber that he was in possession of, and that was his penalty,
which was paid by me for him.
8787. You entered that to his debit?-Yes. What meant by
'current account' is, that I paid the money at Lerwick, and it
was charged to me at current account, and I gave Hay & Co.
credit for it in my book at Fetlar.
8788. How many tons of dry fish did you sell from Fetlar last
year?-We sold the following quantities for 1871:
Tons. Cwt. Qrs. Lbs.
Ling, 32 2 3 11
Tusk, 5 2 1 22
Cod, 3 16 3 17
Saith, 0 18 2 15
8789. Had you only ten boats' crews fishing for you last season?-
There were eleven boats.
8790. Did they contain sixty-six men, or were some of them
smaller boats?-Some of them were smaller boats, with only five
men. For instance, in Laurence Donaldson's boat, although there
were only six men, there were five shares, because two boys count
for a share.
8791. How many women and boys had you employed in curing at
Fetlar?-We had eight men and boys-no women.
8792. Have the beach boys got accounts in the ledger also?-Yes.
They are all in one place. [Shows.]
8793. The first is Laurence Brown. His fee was 10s., and, after
debiting his out-takes, he received 7s. 31/2d. in cash in full?-Yes.
8794. The next is John Sinclair, jun.; after debiting his out-takes,
he received 8s. 4d. in cash?-Yes.
8795. The next is John Coutts, who received 9s. 6d.?-Yes.
8796. The next is James Laurenson; his fee was only 5s., and he
received 14s. 11/2d. in cash?-Yes.
8797. The next is Arthur James Tulloch; his fee was 16s., and he
received 6s. 21/2d.?-Yes; he was only employed during part of the
season. I think I had eight besides him.
8798. The next is Peter Sinclair; he had a fee of 10s., and, after
deducting his out-takes, he received 6d. in cash in full, but he had
received 19s. 6d. in cash during the season?-Yes.
8799. The next is George Laurenson; his fee was £4 and he
received £1, 14s. 6d. in cash at settlement, and sundry small
sums in cash have been paid to him in the course of the year?-
Yes. He was a young lad, about sixteen years of age, I think.
8800. The next is Robert Johnston; his fee was 15s., and he
received 7s. 1d. in cash at settlement, having received 5s. 4d.
in cash during the season?-Yes.
8801. The next is George Donaldson; his fee was 10s. and he
received 9s. 1d. in cash at settlement?-Yes.
8802. He seems to have got a number of loaves and biscuit?-Yes.
His supplies were almost entirely for food.
8803. There are also the accounts of two men here; one of them is
Magnus Brown. Is he one of your principal curers?-Yes.
8804. His fee, called beach-fee was £8, 5s., and he received
17s. 41/2d. in cash at settlement?-Yes. He received £1 at the
commencement, and the next entry is 6s. 9d. paid for purchase
at sale. That was purchase at a sale of wreck, which was paid
for him by me, and was the same as cash. Including that purchase
at the sale, he received about 30s. in cash in the course of the
season.
8805. The next is Arthur N. Henderson: was the other
beach-man?-Yes.
8806. His fee was £5; he received £1, 6s. 3d. in cash at settlement,
and 4s. 6d. was paid to him during the season?-Yes.
8807. Were these all your beach people?-Yes.
8808. Why are they not paid weekly wages?-They could have it
in that way if they wanted it. It would be all the same to us; I
don't see any difference.
8809. Why do they not want it?-I don't think there is any
particular reason, except that they don't wish it in that way.
8810. Do you think they would rather have it settled for at the end
of the year?-I think so.
8811. Are not the people that Messrs. Hay employ in the curing at
Lerwick paid weekly wages?-Yes.
8812. But at all the stations, I suppose, they are paid by beach
fees?-Yes; and these are paid at the end of the year.
8813. The books which you keep at Fetlar are, first, the wet fish
book, in which each boat's crew has the amount of each delivery
of fish entered?-Yes.
8814. Then you have another fish book showing the amount of dry
fish shipped by your different vessels?-Yes; that book [showing]
is for the season of 1871.
8815. Do you begin to ship so early as June?-Yes. The men
generally catch a few fish in winter now, and these are shipped
first. The wet fish that are caught in winter are not in the book I
have brought.
8816. Have you a separate book for your winter fish?-Yes.
8817. What quantity of winter fish do you generally sell?-I
cannot say exactly; but for about two years I have had only about
2 or 21/2 tons of dry fish. They are cured along with the first fish
caught in the spring, and sent down.
8818. Then the shipment on June 6th of 4 tons 7 cwt. of ling will
include some summer fish as well?-Yes, spring fish.
8819. The only other book you keep is the ledger?-Yes, and the
goods account book-a book for the goods and the expenses on
the fish-curing.
8820. How do you keep your goods account book?-I enter every
invoice as it comes from Lerwick, and against them I enter my
returns.
8821. All your sales of goods are entered under the names of the
parties to whom they are sold?-Yes.
8822. And that is the only entry of sales you make?-Yes. We
don't enter what we get ready money for.
8823. You do not keep a waste day-book?-No.
8824. How do you balance the accounts with your fishermen?-
The ledger will show.
8825. Is that done by you, or by some one from, Lerwick?-
Always by some one from Lerwick.
8826. How long does it generally take to get all your fishermen
settled with?-Not long; I think about three days.
8827. Some one comes from Lerwick, and the fishermen come to
the office and are settled with in his presence and in yours?-Yes.
8828. Are the accounts read over to the men, or do they generally
have a pass-book?-They are generally read over. Some carry a
pass-book, and some do not.
8829. Are they always read over?-I don't think they are always
read over. Generally I read them, over before the men come up to
settle, so as to have them added up and ready.
8830. The ledger is written up from day to day as the goods are
taken out?-Yes, perhaps twice or thrice, in a day.
8831. And the fisherman signs at settlement?-Yes.
8832. He signs also when there is a balance against him, which
sometimes happens?-Yes.
8833. Have Messrs. Hay & Co. a spirit licence for the sale of
whisky?-No.
8834. Do you not sell whisky at till?-No, not unless a man asks
me to order it for him; and that [Page 215] goes into the current
account at Lerwick, and is a separate thing altogether from the
ordinary dealings.
8835. Is there no public-house in the island?-None.
8836. Do you buy hosiery at the store in Fetlar?-None.
8837. Are there any entries in this book [showing] relating to the
purchase of kelp?-The parties who work the kelp have accounts
in the book, and the kelp is credited to them there.
8838. How many people are employed gathering kelp in Fetlar?-
There is no one regularly employed, only those who are ready to
make it.
8839. Have Messrs. Hay & Co. a tack of the kelp shores?-No; it
is done by any one who wishes to make it.
8840. And the entries are made to the credit of the women who
gather it and burn it?-Yes.
8841. From how many of them have you made purchases during
last year?-Only from about half a dozen. I have only purchased
about 28 cwt. of it.
8842. What is the price paid for it?-4s. 6d. a cwt.
8843. Is that generally taken out in goods?-No.
8844. Do you pay 4s. 6d. when it is paid in cash?-Just the same; I
make no difference.
8845. Do you not have two prices for it as they have in some
places?-No; it is all the same to me whether they take money or
goods. I should like them to take the goods, no doubt, but I don't
compel them.
8846. In Robina Fraser's account I see that she has got more
money than she has given kelp for: why was that?-She made a
promise to work more, but she has not done it yet.
8847. Have you ever tried to send out a number of men to the
winter fishing in large boats from Fetlar?-No.
8848. Do you consider that would be impracticable?-I think so.
The coast is rather tempestuous, with heavy tides, and I don't think
they would make anything of it.
8849. Do you purchase cattle and other farm stock for Messrs.
Hay?-I purchase fat cattle at Martinmas, but only from the people
privately. I bought eleven last Martinmas.
8850. Are these generally credited to the sellers in the ledger, or
are they paid for in cash?-They are paid for in cash at the time
when the cattle are taken away.
8851. Do any of these purchases appear in the ledger?-No.
8852. Are the rents on Lord Zetland's property in Fetlar collected
by you?-No, they are generally collected by the man who comes
up to settle with the fishermen.
8853. Are separate receipts given for them?-Yes.
8854. Does he also settle for the cattle?-No, I generally settle for
the cattle myself.
8855. So that the cattle do not enter the rent account?-Sometimes
they do. Sometimes they wish me to send on the amount to Hay &
Co, to be credited in the next account.
8856. Of the eleven cattle which you purchased last year, would
some be settled for in that way?-Yes. I cannot say how many,
but I think four.
8857. You have no books showing that?-None here.
8858. They will be in the possession of Messrs. Hay; or have you a
cattle-book?-No; I don't have one.
8859. Do the purchases of cattle pass through your current account
with Hay & Co.?-Yes.
8860. Have you a private account of your own?-My account is
in the ledger, but we have a current account besides that. That
current account contains whatever comes from Lerwick, charged
at the Lerwick retail prices, and then all my returns of money or
anything are put to the current account.
Mid Yell, January 17, 1872, GEORGE GAUNSON, examined.
8861. You are a fisherman in Fetlar, and a tenant on Lord
Zetland's property?-I am.
8862. Are you at liberty to fish for any one you please?-I don't
know; we get as good a price from Messrs. Hay as we would get
from any one else, and we fish for them.
8863. Is there any one else on the island who would buy your
fish?-There is only one man on the east side, Jerome Brown,
who takes a little besides Messrs. Hay's people.
8864. But you don't know whether you are at liberty to fish for
Brown or not?-I don't know.
8865. Did you make any arrangement about fishing when you took
your land?-I did not.
8866. How long have you held it?-I think I have been 28 or 30
years in the island.
8867. Have you fished every year during that period?-Sometimes
I fished, and sometimes I was at sea.
8868. But when you have been at home you have always fished,
and sold your fish to Messrs. Hay at the current price at the end of
the season?-Yes.
8869. Have you generally found that you had balance in your
favour at the end of the season?-Yes, very often; but it did not
matter, because when I wanted anything, whether money or goods
or meal, I always got it. Very often we had no money for the
house, but we always got supplies from them.
8870. Where do you sell your cattle and your eggs, and other farm
stock?-We sell them just wherever we can get any person to buy
them. There are cattle dealers and other persons who come about
buying them.
8871. Do you sell oftener to them or to Messrs. Hay?-It makes
very little difference; when we have any cattle to sell, whenever
any one comes round he gets them.
8872. Did you ever sell a beast to anybody but Messrs. Hay?-
Yes; many a time. I have sold some horses to lots of people who
were going about. I have sold some to Mr. Thomas Williamson, in
Yell. I think he got the last one I sold; it was in February. It was a
little horse.
8873. Who have you sold your cattle to?-Sometimes to Messrs.
Hay's people, and sometimes to any other people who came round
asking for them.
8874. Did you ever sell them to anybody except Messrs. Hay?-I
have.
8875. When?-Some time before this.
8876. How long ago?-Last year I had none but the horse.
8877. Do you sell one or two beasts every year?-No; some years I
sell none at all, and some years only one.
8878. Where do you sell your eggs?-Just anywhere that we can
get the best price for them.
8879. Do you sell them generally to Messrs. Hay?-No;
sometimes not.
8880. Is there anybody else in Fetlar who buys eggs?-Yes; Mr.
William Tulloch buys some.
8881. Has he a small shop?-It is not a great deal of a shop that he
has. He deals in cottons and such as that, and he buys eggs. I get
6d. a dozen for them sometimes, and sometimes perhaps 7d.
8882. Did you sell most of your eggs last year to Mr. Tulloch or to
Mr. Garrioch?-I could not say. I don't deal much in that way
myself.
8883. You leave that to your wife?-Yes.
8884. Do you always get your supplies from Hay Co.?-Yes. I
never deal with Tulloch or Brown, and there is no other shop in
the island that is worth going into.
8885. But are there any other shops at all except Tulloch's and
Brown's?-I daresay some woman would sell some things
sometimes, but they would not be of any account.
8886. Do you know where Tulloch and Brown, and that woman
you speak of, get the goods they sell don't know.
[Page 216]
8887. Do you generally get a good quality of stuff from Hay &
Co., at a fair price?-Yes; they are very fair prices.
8888. Have you ever got goods at Lerwick?-Yes.
8889. Do you find the goods supplied at Hay & Co.'s shop in
Fetlar to be as good and as cheap its those you get in Lerwick?-
Yes; I have no reason to complain about that.
8890. What was the price of meal that you have been buying
lately?-It is much the same as we get it at in Lerwick; sometimes
it little higher and sometimes a little cheaper. I think last season
it was generally about 20s. per boll for oatmeal; but I don't
remember about that particularly.
8891. Do you have to keep up your own houses and your own
fences?-Yes; the house I am living in was built when I came to
it, and it is the same yet; we have to keep it in good order.
8892. The landlord does not do that for you?-I don't know; but
the last time something was done to the house it was put down to
Lord Zetland's account.
8893. Are most of the tenants on Lord Zetland's property in Fetlar
fishing for Messrs. Hay?-I suppose most of them do.
8894. Do they generally understand that they are under any
obligation to fish for them?-I don't think so; but it would make
very little difference fishing for any other body, when we would
get the same price from them.
8895. You don't think of curing your own fish, then?-No.
8896. Where do the Fetlar people sell their hosiery?-Generally in
Lerwick; they go down there with it. My family do not knit much,
because they have no wool, unless they get some to buy.
8897. What is paid for wool?-Sometimes it is 2s. per lb. for fine
wool, sometimes 1s. 6d., and so on.
8898. Do you get that from your neighbours?-There are not many
neighbours near us who have any sheep.
8899. Where do you buy it, then?-Sometimes we go to Lerwick
and buy it, and sometimes in Yell.
8900. Is there no shop in Fetlar where you can buy it?-No.
8901. Where do you buy it in Lerwick?-I don't know; I do not
buy it myself. They buy it just at any place where they can get it
best.
8902. To whom do you pay your rent?-To Hay & Co.
8903. Is it deducted from your account when you settle?-Yes.
8904. Have you ever tried the winter fishing?-No; they don't do
much in that with us. They might catch some in winter, but not
many. They have generally a long way to go to seek them, and it
requires particularly good weather to go out with the little boats.
8905. Have you not large enough boats for the winter fishing?-
No.
8906. Do you think you could do anything if you had large decked
boats?-I don't know; they have never tried them there. They
might do something with them, but I don't think they would pay
very well.
8907. Have your rents been raised lately?-No; they were raised a
little about eight or nine years ago.
8908. Was there any different arrangement made at that time about
the fishing?-No.
8909. Have you ever known any man in Fetlar who had to pay
liberty money for freedom to sell his fish to another than the
tacksman or factor?-No.
8910. And no man in your time has been put out of his ground for
fishing to another?-No; I never heard of anything of the kind in
Fetlar, either on Lord Zetland's or Lady Nicholson's ground.
Mid Yell, January 17, 1872, WILLIAM STEWART, examined.
8911. You are a tenant and fisherman at Seafield, Mid Yell?-
Yes. Kirkabister is the town I live in.
8912. Who is your landlord?-Mrs. Budge.
8913. To whom do you sell your fish now?-I have sold them this
year to Mr. Thomas Williamson.
8914. Who did you sell them to last year?-To Mr. Laurence
Williamson, Linkshouse.
8915. Why did you leave him?-Because Mr. Sievwright, Mrs.
Budge's factor, wished us to do it.
8916. Did you get a letter from him about the fishing?-Yes.
8917. Have you got it?-Yes. [Produces the following letter]:
'<Lerwick>, 22<d Nov>. 1870.
'WILLIAM, I now write, as I promised, to explain what I
expect the Seafield tenants to do in regard to fishing, that you may
communicate the same to them.
'The business premises at Seafield cannot be allowed to
remain vacant, and consequently unprofitable while it is clear
they must do so unless the tenants fish to the tenant of these
premises. The Seafield tenants, therefore, must fish to Mr.
Thomas Williamson upon fair and reasonable terms, and I
understand he is quite prepared to meet them on such terms.
I believe he will, in every respect, do you justice; and so long
as he does so, you have no reason to complain. But should it
happen that he fails to treat you fairly and honourably (of which
I have no fear), you can let me know, and matters will soon be put
right. You and the tenants, however, must not act towards Mr.
Williamson in a selfish or hard way either, for it is quite as
possible for you to do so to him as it is for him to do so to you.
Both he and you all must work together, heartily and agreeably;
and if you do so, I have no fear, humanly speaking, that the result
will be success to both.-I am, yours faithfully, W. SIEVWRIGHT.
'William Stewart, Kirkabister, Seafield, Mid Yell.'
8918. Is that the only letter you have got on the subject?-The
only one.
8919. Have you a written tack?-No.
8920. You hold your land from year to year?-Yes.
8921. Have you, since you received that letter, fished for Mr.
Thomas Williamson?-Yes, in the spring and summer.
8922. And in winter?-In winter there was not a great deal doing.
8923. But what fish you did catch, what did you do with them?-I
believe we sometimes went to Mr. Laurence Williamson and
sometimes to Mr. Thomas Williamson with them, just as it suited.
8924. When you received that letter, had you made any
arrangement to fish for the following year?-No.
8925. Had you not arranged to fish for Mr Laurence
Williamson?-No, not for myself.
8926. Nor for any one else?-No. There were none of our boat's
crew who had made any arrangement with Laurence Williamson,
so far as I know; but the other boat's crew I think had made some
sort of arrangement. There are only two boats' crews that belong
to Mrs. Budge's property.
8927. How many tenants are there on her property?-I think there
were formerly 23, but now there are only either 21 or 22.
8928. Mr. Sievwright speaks in his letter about the business
premises at Seafield: what do you understand by that?-The shop
and the station.
8929. Are there a merchant's shop and a curing station at
Seafield?-Yes.
8930. Were they not let previously to the time when that letter was
written?-No.
8931. Do you get the same price from Mr. Thomas Williamson
that Mr. Laurence Williamson used to give you?-Yes.
8932. That was the current price at the end of the year?-Yes.
8933. But you have got your goods from him instead of buying
them from Laurence Williamson?-For myself I did; but I think
some of the men bought their goods from Lerwick.
8934. Were these men paid in cash?-Yes.
8935. Was Mr. Thomas Williamson's shop [Page 217]the nearest
place to your house where you could get goods?-Yes.
8936. Did you take your goods from him before you fished for
him?-Sometimes. I had a sort of running account at his shop. I
was doing bits of jobs for him, and sometimes I got money, and
sometimes I took some of his goods.
8937. But you did not do so much with him before as after you got
that letter?-No; the principal part of my dealing was for the
fishing.
8938. But you did not buy so many goods from him before last
winter?-Certainly not.
8939. Did you buy from Mr. Laurence Williamson then?-I did,
because I was keeping a running account with him then.
8940. Do you keep a running account with him now?-I was
forced to do that, because I was not clear with him when I went to
fish for Mr. Thomas Williamson.
8941. Were you therefore forced to keep a running account with
him?-I was not in any way forced, but the account was not
cleared up, because I did not have the means.
8942. Have you added to it since then?-Not much.
8943. But it is not paid up?-It is not; I have never been able to do
it.
8944. Do you ever sell any beasts off your ground?-I sold one at
1st May last year, at the sale.
8945. Who was the purchaser?-Mr. Thomas Williamson.
8946. Was that at a sale at Mid Yell for the whole country?-The
sale to which I went was at Cullivoe for North Yell.
8947. Had you promised Mr. Thomas Williamson the beast before
you went?-No. When I went I was at liberty to sell it to any one I
liked, but he bought the beast at the roup.
8948. Did anybody else bid for it?-No.
8949. Was it marked?-No. It never was entered into the bill of
sale at the roup.
8950. But were the horns of the beast marked at any time?-I
don't know.
8951. Why was it not entered in the bill of sale?-I made an
agreement with Williamson just to take it away at the price I fixed.
He said he would give what I asked for it. I asked £5, and I sent
the beast home, and he gave me that for it.
8952. That took place in the first season you fished for Mr.
Thomas Williamson?-Yes.
8953. By that time, I suppose, he had a little account against
you?-I don't think it would be much. About that time the spring
fishing was finished, and I don't think there was very much either
way between us. I don't think I had much to give him, or that he
had much to give me.
8954. Have you a pass-book?-No.
8955. How was the price of that beast paid?-It was remitted to
Mr. Sievwright for my previous year's rent.
8956. Why had you not paid it before?-Because I had not the
means.
8957. Had Mr. Sievwright been asking you for your rent before?-
Yes. When he was here at Hallowmas I offered him the beast, and
he told me to keep her until any time when I was aware that cattle
would be at the best price.
8958. Did he say anything to you about selling it?-No. I just sold
it to Mr. Williamson, and he remitted the money to Mr.
Sievwright.
8959. Was that arranged between you and Mr. Sievwright, or
between you and Mr. Williamson?-It was arranged between Mr.
Williamson and me that he was to send on the money.
8960. Did Williamson ask you to agree to that arrangement?-No;
I asked him to do it for me, because he was in the habit of writing
to Mr. Sievwright oftener than me.
8961. Had you paid your rent through Mr. Williamson before, or
have you done it since?-No.
8962. Have you paid your rent that was due at November?-I have
not paid it yet. I intended to be in Lerwick before this time, but I
have not been able to get.
8963. Have you settled with Mr. Williamson for the last year's
fishing?-Yes. I think I had £6, 14s. to get, and I got it in cash.
8964. Did none of that go to pay your rent?-It is lying yet to go. I
have it in my possession, because I have not seen Mr. Sievwright
since.
8965. What price do you pay for meal at Seafield?-I think the
first I got was 22s. 6d. I think the last was much about the same,
but there might be a difference of 6d. or so.
8966. Was it of good quality?-It was very good.
8967. Where does your wife sell her eggs?-Anywhere that she
can get the best tea, from Lerwick north to Seafield.
8968. Does she always sell them for tea?-For tea, or any small
thing she can get.
8969. Are these sales settled for at the time?-Yes; they are settled
right away.
8970. How much tea will she get for a dozen eggs?-I cannot tell,
because I leave all these matters to her.
8971. Where does she sell her knitting?-She does not do much of
that.
8972. Has she an account of her own?-No; she never had.
8973. Is there any kelp gathered here?-Very little.
8974. Who buys it?-Mr Thomas Williamson has bought some for
a year or two back but I don't think he bought any last year. My
eldest daughter was employed for two years in working at it in the
summer time, and I think she had an account for it; but I don't
know much about that.
8975. Were you at one time a tenant in Whalsay?-Yes.
8976. When did you leave it?-In 1862.
8977. Up till that time you were a tenant under Mr. Bruce of
Simbister?-Yes.
8978. What rent did you pay there?-The rent I always paid for
my ground was 26s.
8979. Did you fish for Mr. Bruce at that time?-Yes, for the late
Mr. William Bruce.
8980. And you had an account with him at the shop in Whalsay?-
Yes.
8981. How did you pay your rent?-Generally by fishing.
8982. Was it put into your account?-Yes. The thing was carried
on on a very strange system. Our land was put in to us at a low
rent, and our fish were taken from us at as low a value. The prices
for the fish never varied, either for the spring or summer.
8983. Do you mean that they were the same every year?-They
were. Whatever they might be in the markets, they were all the
same to us.
8984. Had you never the benefit of a rise in the market at all?-
Never.
8985. Did you not object to that?-We just had to content
ourselves with it, or leave the place.
8986. It was part of your bargain for your land, that you were to
give your fish at a certain rate?-Yes; there were so much of the
fish taken off for the land. That was the first of the fishing. We
got 3s. 4d. cwt. for ling, 2s. 6d. for tusk, and 20d. for cod, and so
much of each kind of fish was taken off until the land was paid
for; and then the prices were raised to 4s., I think, for ling, 3s. 2d.
for tusk, and 2s. 6d. for cod, for all the rest of the summer fishing.
8987. Did you get these prices for a number of years?-I think for
the thirteen years that I was on the station they never varied one
halfpenny for the summer fishing. The prices for the winter
fishing varied little. Sometimes we would sell the small cod as
low as 2s. 6d., and at other times at 3s.
8988. Did you sell the winter fishing for payment at the time, or
did it go into the account too?-It was never put into the account
at all; we just got what we required for it. It was ready payment;
but it was very rarely that we got money for the winter fishing.
8989. Did you know at the time that the prices you [Page 218]
were paid at the latter part of the season were lower than the
market price of the fish?-We knew that but it was just the
bargain.
8990. Was that the system with all the tenants in that time?-With
every one.
8991. When did that system cease?-I think it ceased about a year
after I came here about 1863.
8992. Why did you leave Whalsay?-There was new division of
the land, and I did not consider that I was getting a good farm. I
was personally acquainted with Mr. Budge, who was leaving the
island then and coming to this property, and I came along with
him.
Mid Yell, January 17, 1872, LAURENCE WILLIAMSON, examined.
8993. You are a merchant in this neighbourhood?-Yes; at
Linkshouse, Mid Yell.
8994. Have you been long in business there?-Nearly eight years.
8995. On whose property are your premises?-The late Robert
Nevin Spence's property.
8996. Are there many tenants on it?-There are a few, but I could
not tell the number exactly.
8997. Are they engaged in fishing?-Some of them are.
8998. Are they at liberty to fish to any one they please?-Yes.
8999. You were engaged in the fish-curing business to a certain
extent?-Yes. I do very little in it now.
9000. Your business has been considerably reduced?-Yes.
9001. Has that been since Mr. Sievwright wrote the letter which
was produced by the last witness?-Yes. Mrs. Budge's tenants
were the men that I had fishing to me and when they went away I
could not fill up my boats.
9002. Had you made arrangements with any men for the fishing of
last season when they were taken away?-Yes. It was rather too
late when they let me know they were going.
9003. How do you mean that they were too late?-They
commonly make up their boats' crews about Hallowmas or
Martinmas, at the time of settlement, and one of the crews had
agreed to fish for me for the rising season, not knowing then that
they were to be taken away. Of course they had to leave me,
because they knew, or at least they believed, they would be
differently dealt with if they did not leave.
9004. Did you make any objection to them leaving after having
struck a bargain with you?-Yes, I slightly objected to it; but, of
course, I could not help it.
9005. In what way did you object?-The men who formed that
boat's crew had signed a sort of written agreement that they were
to fish for me in the rising year, on the same terms as they had
agreed with me before. Sometimes they don't have a written
agreement, only a verbal one, but on this occasion there was
written agreement entered into.
9006. I suppose a verbal agreement is the usual way of arranging
for the season's fishing?-Yes, generally.
9007. Did these men happen to have a written agreement?-Yes;
we had a little bit form drawn up and agreed to.
9008. Had you any reason for having a written agreement at that
time?-I was rather doubtful in my own mind that they would be
leaving me, or rather that they would be forced to leave.
9009. Was that because there had been some talk about Mr.
Thomas Williamson getting these fishermen?-The talk was not
about Mr. Thomas Williamson at that time, but about Mr. Magnus
Mouat. I think his name was mentioned when the talk commenced
about the men leaving.
9010. But you did not insist in your objection to your agreement
with the men being departed from?-No.
9011. Was that for fear of injuring the men?-Yes. Of course I
saw that I could not legally hold them.
9012. Why? If they had agreed to fish for you, were they not
bound to fulfil their bargain?-I thought I could not legally hold
them, and I just let them go.
9013. Were you not afraid of them suffering for it if they fulfilled
their bargain with you?-They must have suffered for it too.
9014. Did you make any representation on the subject to Mr.
Sievwright?-No. The only communication I had was with the
men themselves.
9015. How many men did you lose in that way?-Twelve.
9016. Were some of these men in your debt at the time?-Some of
them were. They had a sort of running account.
9017. Have you any men fishing for you this year at all?-For the
rising year I believe we will have two or three boats' crews.
9018. Had you any last year?-We had two. I and another man are
in a sort of company, and we had two boats last year-one each.
9019. Did you find that the fact of Mrs. Budge's tenants leaving
you and going across the water materially affected your business in
the shop?-I cannot say that it injured it very much.
9020. But it would make some difference?-I don't think it made
a great deal.
9021. Were not their accounts taken away from you?-There are a
good many of them who deal with me still, but not to the same
extent.
9022. From what quarter did you get your fishermen who engaged
with you for the rising season?-From the parish of North Yell.
That is the next parish to this.
9023. How far do they live from you?-Some of them are 10 miles
from here.
9024. What estates are they on?-I could hardly tell, except about
some of them.
9025. Have any of these men accounts for supplies in your
shop?-Yes; perhaps 4 or 5 of them.
9026. For whom were they fishing last year?-Some of them
fished for Pole, Hoseason, & Co, and some for Spence & Co.
9027. Do you know why they are leaving these merchants?-I
cannot say.
9028. Have you offered them better terms?-I don't think so.
They hardly ever say what they have been getting before. We
just make them an offer, and if they accept it we come to an
understanding.
9029. Do you know whether any of them were indebted, at last
settlement, to Pole, Hoseason, & Co., or Spence & Co.?-I cannot
say.
9030. Are these men nearer to Greenbank than to you?-Yes, a
great deal.
9031. Are your accounts with fishermen kept in a ledger?-I keep
them in a sort of shop ledger. Each boat's crew has a company
account, and each man has private account. [Produces ledger.]
9032. Your fish-book is a separate book?-Yes; with columns
showing the weight of the fish delivered.
9033. What are these pages which you have turned down in your
ledger?-They contain the account of William Stewart, who has
just been examined.
9034. I see that for 1869 the balance of his account carried
forward was £10, 0s. 41/2d., the total of his out-takes at the end
of 1869, including that balance was £17, 8s. 11d. The balance
due by him then was £6, 19s., after allowing £10, 9s. 11d. for
his fish, which was reduced by half of skipper's fee £1, being a
balance of £5, 19s. carried to the year 1870?-Yes.
9035. Then in 1870 there is an entry of 13s. 11/2d. account at North
Yell: what does that mean?-That is for some small things he got
there. We cure our fish there.
9036. The amount of his account at the settlement of 1870 was
£17, 6s. 01/2d., and the amount of his fishing was £14, 18s. 41/2d.,
leaving a balance of £2, 7s. 8d. There is it deduction of 17s. 6d.:
what was that for?-It was for a man who went off for Stewart.
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9037. Then there is it check for 19s.?-That was a check he gave
me for that sum.
9038. The balance which is left is £2, 6s. 2d.?-Yes.
9039. On January 4, 1871, there are-spirits 2s. 21/2d., and on
November 18 and November 29 there are additional supplies to
the amount of 11s. 6d., making the balance now due £2, 19s.
101/2d?-Yes.
9040. Are these all the supplies that you have given him since he
ceased to fish for you?-Yes. These are all that have been entered
in the book.
9041. But he may have got others and paid for them in cash?-
Yes.
9042. And he would get goods in payment for his winter
fishing?-He has not been at the winter fishing this year.
9043. Or at the spring fishing last year?-He was at the spring
fishing for Mr. Thomas Williamson.
9044. What men have you engaged for the rising year?-The
engagement has been made partly with my partner in North Yell,
and I don't know the names of them yet.
9045. But you know which men have opened accounts with you
from North Yell?-Yes. There is Charles More, Gutcher, North
Yell; he has got supplies to the amount of 19s. 8d.; and Thomas
Brown, who has got supplies to the amount of 17s.
9046. Are these men bound to you now by written engagement?-
No, it is merely verbal. Their boat's crew is made up.
9047. Who is your partner in North Yell?-Arthur Nicholson; he
has a shop of his own at Gutcher.
9048. Has he boats of his own besides those he has in company
with you?-No; but we have never been rightly in company. He
has been doing my work in North Yell, and getting a fee for it, and
our fish have been thrown together, and sold together.
9049. Is this [showing] the only book you keep?-It is the only
book I keep for accounts. I keep an invoice-book and it fish-book
also.
9050. Do you keep a day-book?-I keep a book for scrawling
things into, until they are posted up in the ledger.
9051. Do you buy kelp?-No.
9052. Do you buy hosiery?-A little sometimes.
9053. Do you pay for it in the way that is usual in the country, by
goods across the counter?-Yes, mostly.
9054. Do you give out wool to knit?-I sometimes give out
worsted, and I pay for the knitting of it in the same way.
9055. Have you a knitters' book, or are the knitters' accounts kept
in the ledger?-I keep a book for women's accounts.
9056. Is that book used entirely for sales of hosiery?-No. We
don't do a great deal in hosiery. We buy few haps and small
shawls, but the principal thing we buy is worsted. I buy a good
deal in the course year from the spinners, and I sell it chiefly in
Lerwick to the merchants there. I sell most of it to Mr. Robert
Linklater. I invoice it to the merchants, and I take a note of the
quantities when I send them away.
9057. When did you send away the last?-I suppose it would be
about a couple of months ago.
9058. At what price did you send it out?-We get 3d. per cut for
very fine, and 21/2d. and 2d. for the coarsest.
9059. You sell to the merchants as a sort of wholesale dealer?-
Yes.
9060. The price per pound of that worsted varies according to the
quality?-Yes.
9061. It does not correspond with the price per cut in any way?-
No. Of course the finer the worsted the finer the thread is.
9062. You do not calculate the price of that worsted, by the pound
at all?-No. We just judge of the fineness or the thickness of it.
9063. The names of the men who were fishing for you in 1871 are
entered in the ledger?-Yes.
9064. Had you generally more than two boats previous to last
year?-Yes. We sometimes had four, but that was the most I ever
had. This [showing] is the company account for one of the boats,
Basil Ramsay & Co., and then there are the private accounts of the
men.