The testimony of Sylvia Odio was taken at 6:30 p.m., on July 22, 1964,
at the office of the Secret Service, 505 North Ervay Street, Dallas,
Tex., by Mr. Wesley J. Liebeler, assistant counsel of the President's
Commission. Forrest Sorrels and John Joe Howlett, special agents of the
U.S. Secret Service were present.
Mr. LIEBELER. This is the continued deposition of Mrs. Sylvia Odio,
which is now being continued in the office of the Secret Service. We
have made arrangements in the presence of Agent Forrest Sorrels and
Agent Howlett, to show some movie films of some street scenes in the
city of New Orleans, and also a television appearance that Lee Harvey
Oswald made over station WDSU in New Orleans in August of 1963. I want
to ask Mrs. Odio to watch the film, and if you recognize anybody in the
film at any time say so as you see him and point the individual out and
we will run the film backward and see what it looks like at that time.
Please go ahead, John.
Mrs. ODIO [viewing film]. The man from the back with the glasses, I
have seen him, the tall thin one. I would like to see the beginning
where the man started coming in.
(Film was rerun.)
Mrs. ODIO. You see the one with the glasses, that thin man. He doesn't
have a mustache, though.
Mr. LIEBELER. That third man there?
Mrs. ODIO. I will show you the back when he comes. The man over to the
right in the white shirt from the back, that looks so familiar.
Mr. LIEBELER. That one right over there?
Mrs. ODIO. Right; he has the same build.
Mr. LIEBELER. Can you back it up, John? Let me ask you this now,
Sylvia. Did you recognize Lee Harvey Oswald?
Mrs. ODIO. Oh, yes; definitely. He made a television appearance. He
looked much more similar than the pictures from New Orleans. He had the
same mustache here.
Mr. LIEBELER. In the television appearance?
Mrs. ODIO. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. What about in the pictures that you saw in the police
station of him standing against the wall when he walked out of the
police station, did that look like the man that was in your apartment?
Mrs. ODIO. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. What about his voice? Did you recognize any similarity in
his voice?
Mrs. ODIO. No. I don't know if it was because in the television it
changed, or something, and he didn't speak too much that day, and it is
hard to remember a voice after such a long time.
Mr. LIEBELER. After looking at this picture, are you more convinced, or
less convinced, or do you still have about the same feeling that you
had before you looked at it that the man who was in your apartment late
in September was the same man as Lee Harvey Oswald?
Mrs. ODIO. I have to be careful about that, because I have the same
feeling that it was, but at the same time I have been looking at papers
for months and months of pictures, and these help you to remember too
much. I wish I could isolate the incident without remembering the other
pictures. I have a feeling there are certain pictures that do not
resemble him. It was not the Oswald that was standing in front of my
door. He was kind of tired looking. He had a little smile, but he was
sunken in in the face that day. More skinny, I would say.
Mr. LIEBELER. Well, do you have any doubts in your mind after looking
at these pictures that the man that was in your apartment was the same
man as Lee Harvey Oswald?
Mrs. ODIO. I don't have any doubts.
Mr. LIEBELER. Do you want to run the picture once more, John?
Mrs. ODIO. What I am trying to establish is the man with the bald in
the back was similar to the profile, but he seems lighter in this
picture. But the men looked like Mexicans. They did not look like
Cubans.
Mr. LIEBELER. Now we have here two pictures that have been made from
films of this movie.
Mrs. ODIO. In that picture he didn't resemble that at all [pointing].
Mr. LIEBELER. You are referring to Pizzo Exhibit No. 453-B; the man
marked with the number 2?
Mrs. ODIO. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. That is the same man you have been talking about as
looking similar?
Mrs. ODIO. That's right. But in the motion picture he looks thinner and
I was trying to give you an idea of the man that I saw that day.
Mr. LIEBELER. Do you think that the man you saw in the motion picture,
who is the same man marked number 2 in Pizzo Exhibit No. 453-B, could
have been the same man that was in your apartment with Oswald?
Mrs. ODIO. I think he had a mustache, and this man in the apartment
does not have any mustache.
Mr. LIEBELER. But otherwise, you think that he looks similar?
Mrs. ODIO. They have the same stature and same build and profile. I can
say he was standing to the side in the door, and his hair was pulled
back on one side.
Mr. LIEBELER. Do you want to run through it again, please?
(Film was rerun.)
Mrs. ODIO. The picture that resembled most, even though his hair was
not so cut that day.
Mr. LIEBELER. You have referred to the individual that was walking out
of the police station?
Mrs. ODIO. With his back.
Mr. LIEBELER. He had a mustache, and he had glasses on?
Mrs. ODIO. That day he did not have a mustache. He just had glasses,
and he would take them off and on. Lee Oswald--Leon is fatter in this
picture than what I actually saw him.
Mr. LIEBELER. You think this man standing on the corner, who is No. 2
in Pizzo Exhibit No. 453-B, is the same man you saw walking out of the
police station?
Mrs. ODIO. No.
Mr. LIEBELER. It is a different man?
Mrs. ODIO. That's right. The one that is walking out of the door, kind
of thin-looking individual, is darker.
Mr. LIEBELER. Is the man that was walking out of the police station?
Mrs. ODIO. You want me to point it out?
Mr. LIEBELER. Yes. Run it back. I think we should indicate in the
record there was a confusion in my mind, because I think it is pretty
clear that the man that was walking out of the police station is a
different man than is in Pizzo Exhibit No. 453-B.
Mrs. ODIO. He looked greasy looking. I will tell you when [looking at
film].
Mr. LIEBELER. Is it that man with the sunglasses that walked out of the
door?
Mrs. ODIO. That is the picture I see. That picture is what I mean.
Mr. LIEBELER. Yes. There he is again [indicating individual with
mustache leaving police station with Carlos Bringuier and others
depicted on film].
Mrs. ODIO. There he is again; big ears, but from the front, he doesn't
resemble it. It is the same build from the back, that thin neck.
Mr. LIEBELER. You think that that man we have just seen in the picture
resembles one of the men that was in your apartment?
Mrs. ODIO. From the back, because I remember that I put the light on on
the porch, and I saw them get in the car. I wanted to be sure they were
gone.
Mr. LIEBELER. But it is clearly not the same individual?
Mrs. ODIO. No, sir; clearly not the same. I am trying to see something,
to put something in paper that would make me remember. [The film was
rerun but the witness did not recognize anyone depicted on it except as
indicated above.]
Mr. LIEBELER. Thank you very much, Mrs. Odio.