Mr. LIEBELER. Now----

Mr. ANDREWS. I remember that pretty good because I called the Feebees,

and the guy says to put the phone, you know, and nothing happened.

Mr. LIEBELER. The Feebees?

Mr. ANDREWS. That's what we call the Federal guys. All of a sudden,

like a big hurricane, here they come.

Mr. LIEBELER. Do you remember telling him at that time that you thought

that Clay Bertrand had come into the office with Oswald when Oswald had

been in the office earlier last spring?

Mr. ANDREWS. No; I don't remember.

Mr. LIEBELER. Was Bertrand ever in the office with Oswald?

Mr. ANDREWS. Not that I remember.

Mr. LIEBELER. Do you have a picture in your mind of this Clay Bertrand?

Mr. ANDREWS. Oh, I ran up on that rat about 6 weeks ago and he spooked,

ran in the street. I would have beat him with a chain if I had caught

him.

Mr. LIEBELER. Let me ask you this: When I was down here in April,

before I talked to you about this thing, and I was going to take your

deposition at that time, but we didn't make arrangements, in your

continuing discussions with the FBI, you finally came to the conclusion

that Clay Bertrand was a figment of your imagination?

Mr. ANDREWS. That's what the Feebees put on. I know that the two

Feebees are going to put these people on the street looking, and I

can't find the guy, and I am not going to tie up all the agents on

something that isn't that solid. I told them, "Write what you want,

that I am nuts. I don't care." They were running on the time factor,

and the hills were shook up plenty to get it, get it, get it. I

couldn't give it to them. I have been playing cops and robbers with

them. You can tell when the steam is on. They are on you like the

plague. They never leave. They are like cancer. Eternal.

Mr. LIEBELER. That was the description of the situation?

Mr. ANDREWS. It was my decision if they were to stay there. If I decide

yes, they stay. If I decide no, they go. So I told them, "Close your

file and go some place else." That's the real reason why it was done. I

don't know what they wrote in the report, but that's the real reason.

Mr. LIEBELER. Now subsequent to that time, however, you actually ran

into Clay Bertrand in the street?

Mr. ANDREWS. About 6 weeks ago. I am trying to think of the name of

this bar. That's where this rascal bums out. I was trying to get past

him so I could get a nickel in the phone and call the Feebees or John

Rice, but he saw me and spooked and ran. I haven't seen him since.

Mr. LIEBELER. Did you talk to him that day?

Mr. ANDREWS. No; if I would have got close enough to talk to him, I

would have grabbed him.

Mr. LIEBELER. What does this guy look like?

Mr. ANDREWS. He is about 5 feet 8 inches. Got sandy hair, blue eyes,

ruddy complexion. Must weigh about 165, 170, 175. He really took off,

that rascal.

Mr. LIEBELER. He recognized you?

Mr. ANDREWS. He had to because if he would have let me get to that

phone and make the call, he would be in custody.

Mr. LIEBELER. You wanted to get hold of this guy and make him available

to the FBI for interview, or Mr. Rice of the Secret Service?

Mr. ANDREWS. What I wanted to do and should have done is crack him in

the head with a bottle, but I figured I would be a good, law-abiding

citizen and call them and let them grab him, but I made the biggest

mistake of the century. I should have grabbed him right there. I

probably will never find him again. He has been bugging me ever since

this happened.

Mr. LIEBELER. Now before you ran into Clay Bertrand in the street on

this day, did you have a notion in your mind what he looked like?

Mr. ANDREWS. I had seen him before one time to recognize him.

Mr. LIEBELER. When you saw him that day, he appeared to you as he had

before when you recognized him?

Mr. ANDREWS. He hasn't changed any appearance, I don't think. Maybe a

little fatter, maybe a little skinnier.

Mr. LIEBELER. Now I have a rather lengthy report of an interview that

Mr. Kennedy had with you on December 5, 1963, in which he reports you

as stating that you had a mental picture of Clay Bertrand as being

approximately 6 feet 1 inch to 6 feet 2 inches in height, brown hair,

and well dressed.

Mr. ANDREWS. Yes.

Mr. LIEBELER. Now this description is different, at least in terms of

height of the man, than the one you have just given us of Clay Bertrand.

Mr. ANDREWS. But, you know, I don't play Boy Scouts and measure them.

I have only seen this fellow twice in my life. I don't think there is

that much in the description. There may be some to some artist, but to

me, there isn't that much difference. Might be for you all.

Mr. LIEBELER. I think you said he was 5 feet 8 inches before.

Mr. ANDREWS. Well, I can't give you any better because this time I was

looking for the fellow, he was sitting down. I am just estimating. You

meet a guy 2 years ago, you meet him, period.

Mr. LIEBELER. Which time was he sitting down?

Mr. ANDREWS. He was standing up first time.

Mr. LIEBELER. I thought you met him on the street the second time when

you----

Mr. ANDREWS. No, he was in a barroom.

Mr. LIEBELER. He was sitting in a bar when you saw him 6 weeks ago?

Mr. ANDREWS. A table at the right-hand side. I go there every now and

then spooking for him.

Mr. LIEBELER. What's the name of the bar you saw him in that day, do

you remember?

Mr. ANDREWS. Cosimo's, used to be. Little freaky joint.

Mr. LIEBELER. Well, now, if you didn't see him standing up on that

day----

Mr. ANDREWS. No.

Mr. LIEBELER. So that you didn't have any basis on which to change your

mental picture of this man in regard to his height from the first one

that you had?

Mr. ANDREWS. No.

Mr. LIEBELER. I am at a loss to understand why you told Agent Kennedy

on December 5 that he was 6 feet 1 to 6 feet 2 and now you have told us

that he was 5 feet 8 when at no time did you see the man standing up.

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