Mrs. TOBIAS. That's right, and they are not allowed to park, you know,
for any length of time--just for moving in and moving out, and here is
a back door out here that is into that driveway.
Mr. JENNER. So, his rear entrance was from the driveway?
Mrs. TOBIAS. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. Which I have so marked.
Mrs. TOBIAS. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. Now, you spoke of a court, did you not?
Mrs. TOBIAS. No, I didn't--I said a patio.
Mr. JENNER. A patio?
Mrs. TOBIAS. A patio--in between--this side and this side (indicating).
Mr. JENNER. In between the south side and the north side?
Mrs. TOBIAS. That's right. We call it a patio, you know, there is a
front entrance with each having their own and then, of course, we have
cement there in that entrance and there's lots of shrubbery.
Mr. JENNER. Is this open to the sky?
Mrs. TOBIAS. No; oh, sure, it's open. These buildings are all solid,
what I mean, there is nothing like--what do you call these--a
breezeway--there's nothing like that. It's just open in between 604 and
602, if I am making it clear?
Mr. JENNER. Yes, you are. Between your apartment on the north side of
the building and their apartment on the south side--it is open?
Mrs. TOBIAS. That is right.
Mr. JENNER. There is no roof over that area?
Mrs. TOBIAS. No; there isn't.
Mr. JENNER. And you call that a patio?
Mrs. TOBIAS. Well, that's what they call it--I guess that's what it is.
I think it is a patio.
Mr. JENNER. Well, I'm just trying to locate it.
Mrs. TOBIAS. That's what it's called--a patio.
Mr. JENNER. Of course, I'm not trying to make any comment about it.
Mrs. TOBIAS. That's what they do call it, though.
Mr. JENNER. All right, we'll call it a patio--does the patio run from
where?
Mrs. TOBIAS. From Elsbeth back to this.
Mr. JENNER. All right, we will make that a dotted line--back to the
rear of the building, which is the west end of the building, correct?
Mrs. TOBIAS. Right. Now, there is no entrance for them to go out here.
They got out over here--they come out into the hallway and into 602,
and then, they have a back entrance. This one apartment--there's a back
entrance only for that No. 10--no one else has a private but that No.
10.
Mr. JENNER. How private is that patio?
Mrs. TOBIAS. Well, it's just an entrance leading out to each house--an
entrance.
Mr. JENNER. If a man were in that patio with a firearm or a weapon or a
rifle and he were dry sighting--do you know what that is--dry shooting
it?
Mrs. TOBIAS. I think so.
Mr. JENNER. That is, holding it up, not loaded, but practicing the
trigger and sighting, and what not, would he be noticed?
Mrs. TOBIAS. Well, it's visible--that's what you meant?
Mr. JENNER. Yes.
Mrs. TOBIAS. There's an awful lot of shrubbery out there in front of
our window, the front window, and also--there's just an awful lot of
shrubbery. It would be noticeable--sure, if you were up in the front,
you would see it, but sad to say, I don't see very much from my front
window because it's just loaded with shrubbery and the trees are quite
tall--quite high.
Mr. JENNER. Now, this patio area which runs the length of the building
from Elsbeth Street back west--that is an open space and it's open
right up to the sky?
Mrs. TOBIAS. That's correct.
Mr. JENNER. During any of the time that the Oswalds occupied Apartment
604 and were your tenants, did you ever see Mr. Oswald in the patio
area with a weapon?
Mrs. TOBIAS. No; I never did.
Mr. JENNER. A firearm?
Mrs. TOBIAS. No; I haven't.
Mr. JENNER. Whether in the patio or elsewhere?
Mrs. TOBIAS. No; I never seen him appear out there--I never seen him
with any gun.
Mr. JENNER. Did you ever hear that he had one while he was there?
Mrs. TOBIAS. No; I didn't. I didn't hear that. I suppose we would
have been real frightened, but we didn't--he did have an awful lot of
trouble with his wife.
Mr. JENNER. Now, it is true, then I gather, from that chance remark
that you made that if you saw him with a weapon that would have alarmed
you?
Mrs. TOBIAS. I think it would have because he was kind of an odd kind
of a person.
Mr. JENNER. Now, were you in the office when that apartment was rented,
did you have the first contact with him?
Mrs. TOBIAS. Yes; he came in our house.
Mr. JENNER. Why don't you tell me about that?