Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes. I might have done it if I hadn't had my own
profession.
Mr. JENNER. That you were able to obtain positions?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Everybody would be able to to obtain a position.
Khokhlov, he was in Washington, D.C., even, I believe. I don't remember
exactly what he was. But, anyway, all those people not only expressed
their beliefs and shared their beliefs publicly, you know, with other
people----
Mr. JENNER. Yes.
Mrs. VOSHININ. But--the other point was that it would really help
Oswald materially, don't you think so, in a material way? He would earn
some money. Other people were earning their living by lecturing on
anti-Communistic talk. So, why did he have to sit jobless or to go to
the factory--or whatever he did, I don't know exactly, whatever work he
worked--instead of going and lecturing, which he never did. Right?
Mr. JENNER. Right.
Mrs. VOSHININ. From what we heard of him he never expressed himself for
being anti-Communist. We remember that. We never heard a word of this.
Mr. JENNER. Did it ever occur to you that his knowledge and his
learning was entirely superficial and he didn't have the capacity to
lecture?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Not never. Because George was so emphatic about his
mental powers, about his erudition, education, you know, that it really
never occurred to me. I thought that he was an intellectual, very
well read. Because George said that many times. He said, "He's a very
interesting person, he's very well read, a very intelligent person."
Mr. JENNER. Did you ever argue this with De Mohrenschildt--say, "Well,
why doesn't he lecture? I don't understand this?"
Mrs. VOSHININ. I remember I did ask that--and I don't remember the
exact answer. Whatever it was, I don't remember. But, as far as I
remember, they said something that maybe from the gratitude to Russia,
or something like that, he doesn't want to do that, and said they'd
leave that up to him.
Mr. DAVIS. Did George De Mohrenschildt ever mention that Oswald spoke
fluent Russian?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes; he did. Uh-huh. He said that Oswald spoke very good
Russian.
Mr. DAVIS. Did he ever discuss where he learned to speak Russian so
fluently?
Mrs. VOSHININ. No; in fact, he did not discuss or quote--I don't
remember him discussing extensively Oswald's background or quoting what
Oswald said about what. I tried to remember it yesterday very hard, you
know, but just couldn't. I just don't remember.
Mr. DAVIS. I wonder if I might ask an opinion of you here? If he were
working, say, in a factory or in normal pursuits in Russia for, say, 2
years, would it be possible to become that fluent in Russian--just from
the fact of working--just from the fact of working there?
Mrs. VOSHININ. I think so. Yes; I think so--because, after all, you
rub shoulders with Russian workers, you know, so you're in it all the
time. It's good that you ask the question, because there was one more
suspicious thing about Oswald. According to hearsay, his wife said that
Oswald had a very nice apartment in Russia--modern apartment. And they
just don't give such apartments to anybody. You know, they usually have
to earn that to get it.
Mr. DAVIS. Did she tell this to you?
Mrs. VOSHININ. No, sir; I never met her. But I heard from other
people--I think, Mrs. De Mohrenschildt said that, I believe.
Mr. DAVIS. That they had a very nice apartment?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes; that they had a very modern, nice apartment in
Russia.
Mr. JENNER. What would a nice apartment in Russia be? Just one room?
Mrs. VOSHININ. No.
Mr. JENNER. What concept did you have in your mind when Mrs. De
Mohrenschildt said to you, "They had a very nice apartment in Russia?"
What did you think they had?
Mrs. VOSHININ. I didn't think of apartment. I immediately thought
of why must they have it. I thought maybe he had a roomette with a
bath and kitchen. Something like that, you know. Certainly not nice
according to our standards here. That's for sure. But there was another
little thing. Marina supposedly mentioned that Russians did not like
him; that his workers actually hated him.
And that was another hint to me--that why did they hate him? Usually,
Russians are very cosmopolitan people, you know. They like foreigners.
Now, why would they hate a guy? And I come to conclusion that maybe
he reported on them--or something like that. You know, little by
little--but do you understand, sir, that everything I say, taken
separately, doesn't mean anything, probably. But you just put it
together and it sort of tells something to us, you know.
Mr. JENNER. You go right ahead. What you put together and what
impresses you, little by little by little, is helpful to me in bringing
out the bases upon which you had these views and opinions. So, don't be
embarrassed about it or hesitant. I want you to say, in giving these
impressions, why, what you base them on--and I understand that you are
rationalizing.
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yeah; that's right.
Mr. JENNER. Excuse me. Did you want to ask a question, Mr. Davis?
Mr. DAVIS. Do you recall if George De Mohrenschildt ever mentioned to
you the fact that the Oswalds had been in Moscow for any period of time?
Mrs. VOSHININ. No; he never did.
Mr. DAVIS. You don't recall anything about them being in Moscow?
Mrs. VOSHININ. I don't remember anyone mentioning them being in
Moscow. Wasn't this in some magazine or newspaper--or maybe his mother
mentioned it--his being in Moscow? Didn't she? I think his mother
mentioned this in connection with his seeing some CIA man with the
American Embassy in Moscow. I believe I did read something somewhere.
Some of her gossip, you know.
Mr. JENNER. Some of her gossip?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yeah.
Mr. JENNER. I would like to have you, when you're giving us these
impressions, however, give us your impressions as you had them as of
the time----
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yeah.
Mr. JENNER. And not influenced by what you have learned and read since
November 22, 1963.
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yeah; uh-huh.
Mr. JENNER. And that's what you are doing, is it not?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Right.
Mr. JENNER. Fine.
We interrupted you. You were relating your rationalization as to your
fear or aversion to this person known as Lee Oswald, who had been in
Russia and had come to America with his wife and child----
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yeah.
Mr. JENNER. And why, in your mind at this time about which you speak,
you were fearful that despite Mr. De Mohrenschildt's attempted
reassurances to you that he, Oswald, wasn't acting like a person who
was free of Russia, so to speak, and had an aversion to Russia, who you
expected to be doing some things, here, such as lecturing and what-not,
and these were things he wasn't doing--from which you concluded you had
some misgivings, at least.
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. All right. And have you recounted all of that now?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. You have completed your rationalizing statement in that
connection?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes; right.
Mr. JENNER. All right. Mrs. Voshinin, was there a period of time or a
series of occasions that troubled you and your husband with respect to
the activities of Mr. De Mohrenschildt and also his present wife with
respect to trips to Houston, Tex.?
Mrs. VOSHININ. It didn't trouble us actually, because we knew very
little of his business and we just were not very much interested in his
business affairs--but we just noticed that he was traveling to Texas.
Mr. JENNER. To Houston?
Mrs. VOSHININ. I mean to Houston. Right.
Mr. JENNER. Were these regular?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Quite regular. And usually it would coincide, somehow,
with his next assignment. You see, you asked me to think at that time,
prior to November 22, 1963. At that time, it did not bother us at all.
We just didn't give much thought to that.
Mr. JENNER. But you noticed it?
Mrs. VOSHININ. We noticed it definitely. Yes. Because he was always
expecting some telephone calls from Houston. If they would be at our
house, for example, she would tell me that he give our telephone
number, you know, to call him--and it would be from Houston.
But he also was traveling so extensively that it was absolutely
impossible to remember everywhere where he went. I know that he went
a lot to New York on business; he went a lot to Philadelphia on his
private business--private life. Of course, that would include Dee Dee
Sharples--concerning his third wife and children. They had disagreement
there.
Mr. JENNER. Did you and your husband have occasion to discuss these
Houston trips recently?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes; recently. And we discussed also those Houston trips
before November 22--because our friends, the Jitkoffs, they mentioned
to us that they don't like George at all and they didn't want us to
bring him to their house. And I asked why, and she didn't want to tell
exactly why, but she said something about some people--some character
whom he is visiting in Houston.
Mr. JENNER. Character?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. What did you gather from that? Did she use the word
"character"?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Yes; _Teep_ [phonetic] is "type" in Russia. That means
"character" in English. You know, it means type of a person.
Mr. JENNER. Yes; I appreciate what you mean by character--but what kind
of a person?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Well, unsavory character.
Mr. JENNER. Unsavory character?
Mrs. VOSHININ. I understood politically unsavory.
Mr. JENNER. Politically unsavory?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Right. That's what I understood.
And also Mr. and Mrs. Jitkoff, on several occasions, expressed surprise
that we became friendly with De Mohrenschildts again--and I assumed
that it was on the basis of his visiting this particular person in
Houston.
Mr. JENNER. Did they name the person?
Mrs. VOSHININ. I don't remember their naming the person; no. But she
said something--I just don't remember, really, what she said. But we
thought that the Jitkoffs don't know George De Mohrenschildt too well,
you know, and that's why they might be little bit exaggerating, you
know, the bad character of George. Because, if you know him well, you
can see why he thinks. [laughing]
Mr. JENNER. Did it occur to you or your husband, now that you reflect
on the matter, that the trips to Houston could possibly have had some
connection with Oswald?
Mrs. VOSHININ. Never. No. In fact, we didn't think of Oswald very much.