learned that it was intended by this vote to soothe the discontent which
exists in Ireland. I will look at the causes whence this discontent
arises. Does it arise because the priests of Maynooth are now
insufficiently clad or fed? I have always thought that it arose from the
fact that one-third of the people are paupers--that almost all of them
are not in regular employment at the very lowest rate of wages--and that
the state of things amongst the bulk of the population is most
disastrous, and to be deplored; but I cannot for the life of me conceive
how the grant of additional money to Maynooth is to give additional
employment, or food, or clothing to the people of Ireland, or make them
more satisfied with their condition. I can easily see how, by the
granting of this sum, the Legislature may hear far less in future times
of the sufferings and wrongs of the people of Ireland than they have
heard heretofore; for they may discover that one large means of
influence, possessed by those who had agitated for the redress of Irish
wrongs, is to be found in the support which the Irish Catholic clergy
has given to the various associations for carrying on political
agitation; and the object of this Bill is to tame down those agitators--
it is a sop given to the priests. It is hush-money given, that they may
not proclaim to the whole country, to Europe, and to the world, the
sufferings of the population to whom they administer the rites and the
consolations of religion. I assert that the Protestant Church of Ireland
is at the root of the evils of that country. The Irish Catholics would
thank you infinitely more if you were to wipe out that foul blot, than
they would even if Parliament were to establish the Roman Catholic
Church alongside of it. They have had everything Protestant--a
Protestant clique which has been dominant in the country; a Protestant
Viceroy to distribute places and emoluments amongst that Protestant
clique; Protestant judges who have polluted the seats of justice;
Protestant magistrates, before whom the Catholic peasant could not hope
for justice. They have not only Protestant, but exterminating landlords,
and more than that, a Protestant soldiery, who, at the beck and command
of a Protestant priest, have butchered and killed a Catholic peasant,
even in the presence of his widowed mother. All these things are
notorious; I merely state them. I do not bring the proof of them: they
are patent to all the world, and that man must have been unobservant
indeed who is not perfectly convinced of their truth. The consequence of
all this is, the extreme discontent of the Irish people; and because
this House is not prepared yet to take those measures which would be
really doing justice to Ireland, and to wipe away that Protestant
Establishment which is the most disgraceful institution in Christendom;
the next thing is, that they should drive off the watch-dogs, if it be
possible, and take from Mr. O'Connell and the Repeal Association that
formidable organization which has been established throughout the whole
country, through the sympathies of the Catholic priests being bound up
with the interests of the people. Their object is to take away the
sympathy of the Catholic priests from the people, and to give them more
Latin and Greek. The object is to make the priests in Ireland as tame as
those of Suffolk and Dorsetshire. The object is, that when the horizon
is brightened every night with incendiary fires, no priest of the paid
Establishment shall ever tell of the wrongs of the people amongst whom
he is living; and when the population is starving, and pauperised by
thousands, as in the southern parts of England, the priests shall not
unite themselves with any association for the purpose of wresting from
an oppressive Government those rights to which the people have a claim.
I am altogether against this system for any purpose, under any
circumstances, at any time whatever. Nothing can be more disastrous to
the best interests of the community, nor more dangerous to religion
itself. If the Government wants to make the priests of Ireland as
useless for all practical purposes as the paid priests of their own
Establishment, they should not give them 26,000_l_. merely, but as
much as they can persuade the House to agree to. Ireland is suffering,
not from the want of another Church, but rather because she already has
one Church too many; for with the present Church, having a small
community, overpaid ministers, a costly Establishment, and little work,
it is quite impossible to have peace and content in that country. If you
give the Catholic priests a portion of the public funds, as the
Government has given the _Regium Donum_ to the Presbyterians of the
North, they will unite with the Church as the Presbyterians did against
any attempt to overturn the old system of Church and State alliance in
that country.
The experience of State Churches is not of a character to warrant the
House in going further in that direction. In this country there is a
State Church, and I do not deny that there are many excellent ministers
in it; but from time immemorial it has been characterized by a most
deplorable and disastrous spirit of persecution, which even at this hour
still exists; for that Church is now persecuting a poor shoemaker at
Cambridge for non-payment of Church rates, and pursuing him from court
to court. That Church has been upheld as a bulwark against Catholicism,
and yet all the errors of Catholicism find a home and a hearty welcome
there. In Lancashire and Yorkshire, and in other counties, that Church
is found to be too unwieldy a machine, and altogether unfitted to a
population growing in numbers and intelligence like that of those parts
of the kingdom. Even in Scotland, where there is a model of the most
perfect Establishment which perhaps could be raised, there are the
Secession Church, the Belief Church, and the Free Church; that which the
State upholds being called by the complimentary name of the Residuary
Church. After the experience of such State Churches, which have done so
little good and so much evil, is this a time for establishing another
Church? If I approved of Church endowments by the State I would vote for
this Bill with all my heart, because it is calculated to create a kinder
feeling towards this country amongst the people of Ireland.
Two parties opposed to the Bill are represented by hon. Gentlemen on the
other side of the House. They state that the Roman Catholic religion
should not be established or helped by the State. But when their Church
is absorbing millions of the public money, while millions of their
countrymen refuse to enter its doors, how can they for a moment object
to the passing of a measure which will give some sort of show of
assistance to that Church to which millions of the Irish people belong?
The Nonconformist or Dissenting party in this country are opposed to the
measure; but by some of them a spirit is mixed up with their agitation
of this question which shows that they do not understand, or do not
value, the great principles of Nonconformity, for which their
forefathers struggled and suffered. I allude more especially to a
portion of the Wesleyan body, which, I believe, does not altogether
repudiate the principle of endowment.
But, with regard to the rest, I am persuaded that their agitation
against this measure is honest. If the Dissenters look back to all that
their forefathers have suffered, aye, even within a late period, they
will be recreant to their own principles, and merit the contempt of the
House and of the world, if they do not come forward manfully to uphold
their own principles, and dissent from and oppose the measure under the
consideration of the House. For myself, I shall oppose the Bill in every
stage, simply on one ground, that I believe the principle of endowment
to be most unjust and injurious to the country, and whatever may be the
effect on any Government, whether that of the right hon. Baronet or any
that has preceded or will succeed him, no strength of attachment to
party or Government will induce me to tamper with what I hold to be the
greatest and dearest principle which any man or any body of men can
assert. When I look back to the history of this country, and consider
its present condition, I must say, that all that the people possess of
liberty has come, not through the portals of the cathedrals and the
parish churches, but from the conventicles, which are despised by hon.
Gentlemen opposite. When I know that if a good measure is to be carried
in this House, it must be by men who are sent hither by the
Nonconformists of Great Britain; when I read and see that the past and
present State alliance with religion is hostile to religious liberty,
preventing all growth and nearly destroying all vitality in religion
itself, then I shall hold myself to have read, thought, and lived in
vain, if I vote for a measure which in the smallest degree shall give
any further power or life to the principle of State endowment; and, in
conclusion, I will only exhort the Dissenters of England to act in the
same way, and to stand upon their own great, pure, and unassailable
principle; for, if they stand by it manfully, and work for it
vigorously, the time may come, nay, it will come, when that principle
will be adopted by the Legislature of the country.
* * * * *
IRELAND.
II.
CRIME AND OUTRAGE BILL.
HOUSE OF COMMONS, DECEMBER 13, 1847.
[Towards the conclusion of this year (1847) numerous crimes and outrages
of a serious character were committed in Ireland. They were chiefly
agrarian. In order to increase the powers of the Irish Executive,
Parliament was invited in the Queen's Speech (Nov. 23) to take further
precautions against the perpetration of crime in certain counties in
Ireland. The Bill was moved by Sir George Grey on Nov. 29, and leave was
given, by 224 votes to 18, was read a second time (296 to 19) on Dec. 9,
and passed (174 to 14) on Dec. 13. It was passed in the House of Lords
on Dec. 19. On July 31, 1848, the Irish Government proclaimed certain
districts in which rebellion had broken out. Smith O'Brien and the other
leaders of the insurgents were speedily arrested, tried, and convicted.]
I feel very much in the position of the hon. Member who has just
addressed the House, for I am in some degree compelled to speak before
this Bill is read a third time. I have presented a petition against the
Bill, signed by more than 20,000 persons, inhabitants of the borough of
Manchester, and I am unwilling to vote without briefly giving the
reasons which make it impossible for me to oppose this Bill. When I
recollect the circumstances attending the rejection of the Bill of 1846,
for the protection of life in Ireland, I am convinced that the
Government would not have brought forward the present measure if it had
not appeared to them absolutely necessary, and that, but for this
supposed necessity, it would never have been heard of.
The case of the Government, so far as the necessity for this Bill is
concerned, seems to me to be as clear and as perfect as it can be. From
the speech of the right hon. Gentleman the Secretary of the Home
Department, from the unanimous statements of all the newspapers, and
from the evidence of all parties connected with Ireland, it is placed
beyond a doubt that in the disturbed districts of Ireland the ordinary
law is utterly powerless. The reason why the law is carried into effect
in England is, because the feeling of the people is in favour of it, and
every man is willing to become and is in reality a peace officer, in
order to further the ends of justice.
But in Ireland this state of things does not exist. The public sentiment
in certain districts is depraved and thoroughly vitiated. [Mr. J.
O'Connell, 'No! No!'] The hon. Member cries 'No, No;' but I maintain
that in the disturbed districts the public or popular feeling is as I
have described it. I do not mean to assert that all which the newspapers
contain is true, or that they contain all the truth; but I ask the hon.
Gentleman if he has not read accounts which are not contradicted, from
which we learn that on the occurrence of some recent cases of
assassination, whole districts have been in a state of rejoicing and
exultation? These assassinations are not looked upon as murders, but
rather as executions. Take the case of Mr. Lloyd, a clergyman, who was
recently assassinated. There was no show of vindictive feeling on the
part of his murderers; there was little of the character of ordinary
murders in it. The servant was allowed to depart unharmed; a boy who was
in the carriage was removed that he might not be injured; and the
unhappy gentleman was shot with all the deliberation and the calmness
with which a man would be made to suffer the extreme penalty of the law.
It is clear, then, that the ordinary law fails, and that the Government
have a case for the demand they make for an extension of the present
powers of the law.
I do not say the present Bill will certainly be effective, but it is the
less to be opposed because it does not greatly exceed or infringe the
ordinary law; and it is the duty of the Legislature, when called upon to
strengthen the Executive, to do so by the smallest possible infringement
of the law and the constitution. But, to leave the particular measure
now before us, I am bound to say that the case of the Government with
respect to their Irish policy in general is not as good as could be
wished. The Government has not shown the courage which is necessary to
deal effectually with the difficulties of Ireland. They should remember
what passed when the Poor-law was proposed for that country. They were
told it would be a failure--that it could not be worked; but
disregarding these statements, they passed the Bill; and I believe,
since the Act of 1829, no measure has passed this House of equal benefit
to Ireland. The noble Lord at the head of the Government has said that
all parties are to be blamed for the misgovernment of Ireland; but he
should remember the responsibility which is upon him, for he is now in
the position of dictator on Irish questions, and whatever he proposes
for that country, I verily believe, will find no successful opposition
in this House.
There is another fact to which I would call attention. The Irish Members
complain, and very justly, of the past legislation of this House; but
when we call to mind that there are 105 of them here, of whom 60 or 70
are of Liberal politics or opinions, and that about 30 of them are
Repealers, and hold very strong views with regard to the mismanagement
of Irish affairs in the Imperial Parliament, I think we have a right to
complain that they have not laid on the table of the House any one
measure which they believe to be necessary to the prosperity of their
country.
I have been in this House more than four years, and I have never yet
seen the Irish Members bringing forward any proposition of a practical
character--nor am I aware that they have supported any measure they
deemed necessary for Ireland, with unanimity and earnestness, or with
anything like perseverance and resolution. I am sure that 105, or even
30 English Members, sitting in a Parliament in Dublin, and believing
their country had suffered from the effects of bad legislation, would,
by their knowledge of the case, their business habits, activity, union,
and perseverance, have showed a powerful front, and by uniting together,
and working manfully in favour of any proposition they might think
necessary to remedy the evils of which they complained, they would have
forced it on the attention of the House. But the Irish Members have not
done this. So far then, they are and have been as much to blame as any
other Member of this House for the absence of good government in
Ireland.
I will not, like them, complain of bad legislation, and propose no
remedy. What is the condition of Ireland? Last year we voted millions to
keep its population from starvation; and this year we have been asked
for a further sum, but have not granted it. We maintain a large army in
Ireland, and an armed police, which is an army in everything but in
name, and yet we have in that country a condition of things which is not
to be matched in any other civilised country on the face of the earth,
and which is alike disgraceful to Ireland and to us. The great cause of
Ireland's calamities is, that Ireland is idle. I believe it would be
found, on inquiry, that the population of Ireland, as compared with that
of England, do not work more than two days per week. Wherever a people
are not industrious and are not employed, there is the greatest danger
of crime and outrage. Ireland is idle, and therefore she starves;
Ireland starves, and therefore she rebels. We must choose between
industry and anarchy: we must have one or the other in Ireland. This
proposition I believe to be incontrovertible, and I defy the House to
give peace and prosperity to that country until they set in motion her
industry, create and diffuse capital, and thus establish those
gradations of rank and condition by which the whole social fabric can
alone be held together.
But the idleness of the people of Ireland is not wholly their fault. It
is for the most part a forced idleness, for it is notorious that when
the Irish come to England, or remove to the United States or the
Colonies, they are about the hardest working people in the world. We
employ them down in Lancashire, and with the prospect of good pay they
work about as well, and are as trustworthy, and quiet, and well-disposed
to the law as the people of this country. The great secret of their
idleness at home is, that there is little or no trade in Ireland; there
are few flourishing towns to which the increasing population can resort
for employment, so that there is a vast mass of people living on the
land; and the land itself is not half so useful for their employment and
sustentation as it might be. A great proportion of her skill, her
strength, her sinews, and her labour, is useless to Ireland for the
support of her population. Every year they have a large emigration,
because there are a great number of persons with just enough means to
transport themselves to other countries, who, finding it impossible to
live at home in comfort, carry themselves and their capital out of
Ireland; so that, year after year, she loses a large portion of those
between the very poorest and the more wealthy classes of society, and
with them many of the opportunities for the employment of labour.
I do not believe that the Bill for regulating the relations of landlord
and tenant, as recommended by the hon. Member for the County of
Limerick, will restore prosperity to Ireland. Such a measure may be
passed with great advantage; but if it be intended by a Bill with this
title to vest the ownership of the land in the present occupiers, I
believe this House will never pass it, and if it did, that it would
prove most fatal to the best interests of the country. I think we have a
right to blame the Government that as yet we have not seen the Bill for
the sale of encumbered estates in Ireland. I wish to ask why such a Bill
is not ready before this? [Lord John Russell: 'The Bill has been ready a
long time'] The noble Lord says the Bill has been ready long ago; but
that statement only makes the Government open to greater blame, for if
the Bill is ready, why has it not been brought forward before this? Last
Session the Bill was withdrawn, and the reason given was that landlords
and mortgagees did not like it. If the Government wait till the
landlords and mortgagees like it, it will never be brought forward at
all. Had they waited till the Irish landlords asked for the Poor-law,
there would have been no Poor-law in Ireland now.
The Government should disregard the opposition of these parties, and
should take their stand above all class interests. They must refuse to
listen to the interested suggestions of one class or the other, and they
must remember that they are the Executive Government of the country, and
bound to act for the public good. There is an unanimous admission now
that the misfortunes of Ireland are connected with the question of the
management of the land. I have a theory that, in England as well as in
Ireland, the proprietors of the soil are chiefly responsible for
whatever bad legislation has been inflicted upon us. The ownership of
land confers more political power than the possession of any other
description of property. The Irish landowners have been willing parties
to the past legislation for Ireland, and they have also had the
administration and execution of the laws in that country. The encumbered
condition of landed property in Ireland is at this moment the most
pressing question. I am informed by a gentleman in Dublin, of the best
means of information and of undoubted veracity, that in the province of
Connaught there is not five per cent, of the land free from settlements
of one kind or other, and that probably not one per cent, is free from
mortgages. I have asked Irish Members of all parties if this be true,
and not one of them is disposed to deny it; and if it be true, I say it
is idle to seek elsewhere for the source of the evils of Ireland; and
every day, nay, every hour we allow to go by without taking instant
measures to remedy this crying mischief, only adds to the criminality
which rests on us for our past legislation.
Patchwork legislation will not now succeed; speeches from the Lord
Lieutenant--articles in the newspapers--lending to the landowners at 3
1/2 per cent. money raised by taxation from the traders of England, who
have recently been paying 8 per cent.--all will fail to revive the
industry of Ireland. I will now state what, in my opinion, is the
remedy, and I beg to ask the attention of the Government to it, because,
though they may now think it an extreme one, I am convinced that the
time will come when they will be compelled to adopt it.
In the first place, it is their duty to bring in a Sale of Estates Bill,
and make it easy for landowners who wish to dispose of their estates to
do so. They should bring in a Bill to simplify the titles to land in
Ireland. I understand that it is almost impossible to transfer an estate
now, the difficulties in the way of a clear title being almost
insurmountable. In the next place, they should diminish temporarily, if
not permanently, all stamp duties which hinder the transfer of landed
property, and they should pass a law by which the system of entailing
estates should for the future be prevented. [Laughter.] I can assure
hon. Gentlemen who laugh at this, that at some not distant day this must
be done, and not in Ireland only, but in England also. It is an absurd
and monstrous system, for it binds, as it were, the living under the
power of the dead.
The principle on which the law should proceed is this, that the owner of
property should be permitted to leave it to whomsoever he will, provided
the individual is living when the will is made; but he should not be
suffered, after he is dead, and buried, and forgotten, to speak and
still to direct the channel through which the estate should pass. I
shall be told that the law of entail in Ireland is the same as in
England, and that in Scotland it is even more strict. I admit it; but
the evil is great in England, and in Scotland it has become intolerable,
and must soon be relaxed if not abolished. Perhaps I shall be told that
the laws of entail and primogeniture are necessary for the maintenance
of our aristocratic institutions; but if the evils of Ireland spring
from this source, I say, perish your aristocratic institutions rather
than that a whole nation should be in this terrible condition. If your
aristocratic families would rear up their children in habits of
business, and with some notions of duty and prudence, these mischievous
arrangements would not be required, and they would retain in their
possession estates at least as large as is compatible with the interests
of the rest of the community. If the laws of entail and primogeniture
are sound and just, why not apply them to personal property as well as
to freehold? Imagine them in force in the middle classes of the
community, and it will be seen at once that the unnatural system, if
universal, would produce confusion; and confusion would necessitate its
total abolition.
I am thoroughly convinced that everything the Government or Parliament
can do for Ireland will be unavailing, unless the foundation of the work
be laid well and deep, by clearing away the fetters under which land is
now held, so that it may become the possession of real owners, and be
made instrumental to the employment and sustentation of the people. Hon.
Gentlemen opposite may fancy themselves interested in maintaining the
present system; but there is surely no interest they can have in it
which they will weigh against the safety and prosperity of Ireland? I
speak as a representative from a county which suffers extremely from the
condition of Ireland. Lancashire is periodically overrun by the
pauperism of Ireland; for a year past it has suffered most seriously
from the pestilence imported from Ireland; and many of the evils which
in times past have been attributed to the extension of manufactures in
that county have arisen from the enormous immigration of a suffering and
pauperized people driven for sustenance from their own country.
As a Lancashire representative, I protest most solemnly against a system
which drives the Irish population to seek work and wages in this country
and in other countries, when both might be afforded them at home.
Parliament is bound to remedy this state of things. The present
Parliament contains a larger number of men of business and of members
representing the middle classes than any former Parliament. The present
Government is essentially of the middle class--[a laugh]--and its
Members have on many occasions shown their sympathy with it. Let the
hon. Gentleman laugh; but he will not deny that no Government can long
have a majority in this House which does not sympathise with the great
middle class of this country. If the Government will manfully and
courageously grapple with the question of the condition of land in
Ireland, they will, I am convinced, be supported by a majority of the
Members of this House, they will enable the strength and skill of
Irishmen to be expended on their own soil, and lay the foundation of her
certain prosperity by giving that stimulus and reward to industry which
it cannot have in the present circumstances of that country. Sir, I feel
it impossible to refuse my vote in favour of the Bill now before us; but
I am compelled to say, that unless the Government will zealously promote
measures in the direction I have indicated, they cannot hope long to
retain the confidence of this House or of the country.
* * * * *
IRELAND.
III.
EMPLOYMENT OF THE POOR.