Mr. JENNER. Was it a public or private institution?
Mr. OSWALD. I would say it was a private home. The atmosphere
generally--of course all the boys and girls were separated--I recall
just one large dormitory building, sleeping area and so forth. The
cafeteria was located----
Mr. DULLES. Could you tell us about how many there were in this
orphanage, roughly? Was it 50, 100, 200?
Mr. OSWALD. I would say around 75 to 100, sir.
Mr. JENNER. So you are now about 8 years old, am I correct?
Mr. OSWALD. 1942--that would be correct, sir.
The cafeteria was located in a separate, or perhaps a wing of this
large dormitory building. The school area was located in a separate
building towards the entrance of the home. There was quite a large
playground there, and quite a large playroom within that large
dormitory.
Mr. McKENZIE. The home itself was located in New Orleans, is that
correct?
Mr. OSWALD. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. In the city proper, rather than a suburb?
Mr. OSWALD. I would say that was so, sir. I still recall that it was
pretty close to the end of the St. Charles Street carline at that
particular time.
My recollection of the atmosphere and the general conditions there--it
was nice, I had a lot of friends there at the home. It was a Christian
atmosphere.
Going back to the Catholic school--we had to go to church every morning
and so forth like that.
But here at the tables and so forth we had our grace and such as that.
It was generally a Christian atmosphere there. He treated us well, I
might add--better than the Catholic school did. They were not as strict
as far as discipline was concerned, but they certainly kept us in line.
Mr. DULLES. Could I ask a question there?
Was this a denominational school, or a publicly maintained school?
Mr. OSWALD. I don't believe it was a denominational school. I believe
it was a public--I feel it was a private school or home. But that the
religious background did not have anything to do with it. It might have
been just a Protestant home.
Mr. JENNER. I am curious, if I may, Mr. Dulles--the name of this school
or home is the Bethlehem Orphan Home. But neither of you boys was an
orphan.
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir.
Mr. JENNER. I take it, then, that apart from the name of the school,
there were orphans and young people, children such as you, whose
mothers, or perhaps fathers, were unable to take care of them during
the daytime completely, and the school accepted children under those
circumstances.
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; that is my understanding.
Mr. JENNER. Therefore, it was not exclusively for orphans?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir.
Mr. DULLES. I think I have read somewhere--I would like to ask, if I
may--I understand there had to be only one parent, though. I don't
think if you had two parents you were eligible for this school. I
don't know where I read that, but I recollect that.
Is that the case, do you remember?
Mr. OSWALD. My recollection on that, sir, was that I do recall mother
saying something that there was a little difficulty in placing us in
there, because we were not orphans. But that they had from time to
time made exceptions to this, where one parent was living and unable
to attend the children fully during the day and so forth, and even at
night.
Mr. JENNER. Now, you entered in 1942. Did you and John continue in this
school--for what period of time?
Mr. OSWALD. Until we moved to Dallas, in 1944, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Before we get to that, has Mr. Oswald responded to the
questions you had in mind, to describe the nature of the school?
Mr. DULLES. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Were you visited by your mother and Lee to the extent that
she brought him along, when you and John were in the Bethlehem Orphan
Home?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; we were. I do recall quite vividly that on
Wednesdays--this perhaps might have been during the summer months
only--that John and I would go to downtown New Orleans and meet mother
at her place of employment, and either spend the afternoon with her, or
she would give us money to go to a movie or something. And at this time
mother was employed as a manager or assistant manager of a hosiery shop
located on Canal Street. I don't recall the name of it, or the exact
address of it.
Mr. JENNER. Would you be good enough to inform the Commission to the
best of your recollection about weekends? Did your mother visit you on
weekends? Were you free to return home and spend the weekend? Describe
that, please.
Mr. OSWALD. I do not recall on the weekends--a weekend, I should
say, that we visited mother. Normally, we just saw her once a week
at that particular time. I do not recall--I have been thinking about
this--seeing Lee too often at that time.
Mr. JENNER. You and John would be naturally curious to see him once in
awhile?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; I know we did. I cannot remember it too clearly.
But I would say that it wasn't too frequently that we did see Lee.
Mr. JENNER. Now, you moved to Dallas in 1944?
Mr. OSWALD. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. Was there anything unusual prior to the time you moved to
Dallas about your life and your relationships with your mother and with
Lee, if any? Was there an event that is now etched on your mind?
Mr. OSWALD. I would like to back up there just a little bit.
Lee was placed at the Bethlehem Orphan Home for approximately the last
year that we were there.
Mr. JENNER. That would be, then, 1943?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. I see.
Mr. DULLES. He would have been 4 to 5 years old then?
Mr. JENNER. Yes. He was born in October 1939. So he would then be
approximately 4--well, when he was placed in Bethlehem Home it was some
time during the year 1943, to the best of your recollection?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Would you be good enough to relate to the Commission the
circumstances that brought that about? What do you recall as to why?
Mr. OSWALD. My opinion on that, sir, was this. That mother had wanted
to bring Lee to the home at an earlier date, but that they had a
minimum age required before he could be placed in there, because they
did not have any real small children there. I mean there was no nursery
there that I recall. And there was no very young children. When I say
very young--say under 3 years old.
I remember some children there that perhaps were four or three and a
half years old.
Mr. JENNER. I take it, Mr. Oswald, your mother put Lee in the orphan
home at the first opportunity open to her under the rules or policy of
the Bethlehem Orphan Home in that respect.
Mr. OSWALD. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. Now, did she come to visit the home when Lee was placed in
the home?
If I may, you recall you said you were free on Wednesdays, it may have
been limited to the summer time, and you and John would go into the New
Orleans town district and visit your mother.
Did she come to see Lee? Does that stimulate your recollection that she
did come to visit?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; she did come to visit us. I recall after Lee
was placed in the home, that all three of us would go down and visit
mother, and we always took Lee with us.
Mr. JENNER. I see. What contact did you have with Lee in that 1-year
period, in 1943, when he was with you boys in the home?
Mr. OSWALD. John and I both looked on Lee as our kid brother, and we
stayed pretty close to him, and defended him whenever we had to.
Mr. JENNER. How did Lee get along during those days?
Let's confine it to up to 1944, when you moved to Dallas.
Mr. OSWALD. I don't recall any instance where it would stand out in my
mind that he did not get along with anybody.
Mr. JENNER. He had the normal life of a 4-year-old at that particular
time--got into his fights to the extent everyone else did?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. McKENZIE. You mean at the time he was 4 years old?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. There may be others who would be interested in his course
of conduct and his reactions even at age 4. You will forgive me for
going into that.
Mr. OSWALD. Certainly.
Mr. JENNER. But your present recollection, as far as Lee's relationship
with other 4-year-olds or 5's or 3's, his general course of conduct,
with regard to the interplay between himself and others at or near his
age, is what you would describe as normal?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; that is correct.
Mr. JENNER. All right.
Now we are moving to Dallas in 1944. You brought out the fact that Lee
became enrolled in Bethlehem Orphan Home, because I asked you questions
whether there was anything unusual etched on your mind at that time
that had occurred up to the point of your moving to Dallas. Was there
anything else that this discussion, that is now stimulated that you
would like to report?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir, I cannot think of anything else.
Mr. JENNER. Now, what was the reason you moved to Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. I don't really know, sir. Of course we were quite happy to
leave the Bethlehem Orphan Home. By that, I don't mean to imply that
they didn't treat us well there. But, of course, we were quite happy to
be with mother again, all of us together.
As to the reason why mother moved us to Dallas, I do not know.
Mr. JENNER. Now, when you moved to Dallas, you resided--can you recall
the address or at least approximately where you lived in Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. As I recall, it was Victor Street. It was a corner house,
a large two-story white--I feel sure it was a frame white house. The
garage was to the back side of the house. Victor Street ran in front
of the house, and another street down the side where you entered the
garage.
Mr. JENNER. I don't think I asked you this. It is a little bit out of
order.
Do you happen to recall your brother John's date of birth?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; you did ask me that. It was January 17, 1932.
Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. All right. Thank you.
Your mother, did she become immediately employed in Dallas, or had she
already arranged for employment in Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. This I do not recall, sir. I feel more like that she
perhaps had arranged for employment in Dallas before we moved there. I
would think this would be the natural thing to do. We had never been to
Texas before. And, to my knowledge, she didn't know anybody in Texas.
And why we moved to Dallas, I certainly don't recall any reason at all.
Mr. JENNER. Did you have any relatives in Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Where did Mr. Ekdahl reside? Was he living in or a native
of Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. I understand Mr. Ekdahl was from Boston, Mass., and he
was at that time--I believe that is correct, sir--at least the way I
remember it--employed by the Texas Electric Co.
Mr. JENNER. At what office?
Mr. OSWALD. At Dallas. It might not have been Texas Electric. Texas
Power and Light, perhaps--something like that.
Mr. JENNER. But Mr. Ekdahl was then living in Dallas when you, your
mother, your brother John, and your brother Lee moved to Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. And had you become--you boys become acquainted with Mr.
Ekdahl prior to the time you moved to Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir.
Mr. JENNER. And do you recall any discussion of Mr. Ekdahl prior to the
time of your moving to Dallas?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Now, your education was, of course, continued when you
moved to Dallas.
Would you tell us about that--all three of you? You and your brother
John first, because Lee was not yet of school age.
Mr. OSWALD. All right, sir.
I recall the elementary school there in Dallas. It was the Davy
Crockett Elementary School, which was approximately three or four
blocks from the house.
Mr. DULLES. What was that name?
Mr. OSWALD. Davy Crockett.
Mr. JENNER. Both you and your brother John were enrolled?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir. And there was--I believe it was a city park right
across the street from this elementary school that I recall playing
ping pong and croquet and swimming over there, and such as that.
Mr. JENNER. This period of your life, as you recall it, was a pleasant
one?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. And except for the restrictions that you and John
encountered in the Catholic school and in the Bethlehem Orphan Home,
what is your recollection of that early period of your life--subject to
those limitations--normal and pleasant?
Mr. OSWALD. The only thing I can remember--I did have a little
difficulty because I had something of a southern drawl.
Mr. JENNER. When you reached Texas?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir. And I do recall having a little difficulty in
school myself, to make myself clearly understood.
Mr. DULLES. May I ask a question there?
When you went to the Davy Crockett School, was that a school where you
lived, or did you live at home and just attend the school during the
school hours?
Mr. OSWALD. That was a public school in Dallas, and we did not live
there. We lived at home.
Mr. DULLES. And your mother then was employed, as I understand it.
Mr. OSWALD. To the best of my knowledge--I feel certain she was
employed.
Mr. JENNER. Do you recall the nature of her employment there?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir; I do not.
Mr. JENNER. She was employed full-time during the daytime, home on
weekends?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Now, what was happening to Lee when you were living in
Dallas--in the sense of who took care of him during the daytime, if
anyone? What was done for his comfort?
Mr. OSWALD. This I don't remember, sir. I don't remember any
housekeeper or any maid that mother had at this time. Something is
coming into my mind about a day nursery. I think perhaps----
Mr. JENNER. A day nursery?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir--that Lee was taken to during the day when Mother
was working, and brought home with her at night. I believe that is
correct.
Mr. JENNER. Would you boys take him to the day nursery and bring him
home?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Did you play any part in that at all?
Mr. OSWALD. No, sir, I do not have any recollection of taking Lee to
the day nursery or bringing him back.
Mr. JENNER. Now, would you please indicate how long you remained in the
Davy Crockett Elementary School, you and John?
Mr. OSWALD. Say for 1 year, sir, 1 school year.
Mr. JENNER. All right.
Now, during this year, did you become acquainted with Mr. Ekdahl?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; I would say towards the latter part of that
school year.
Mr. JENNER. He could come--he did on occasion come to visit your
mother's home?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Would you please indicate whether the contact that you
boys had with Mr. Ekdahl about that--that is, he would visit the home
occasionally?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Did he take you boys out?
Mr. OSWALD. I don't recall. I think perhaps on maybe two occasions we
did go to the zoo. I don't recall any other occasions.
Mr. JENNER. We now have you towards the latter part of the year--you
were now 9 years old. Am I correct about that?
Mr. OSWALD. 1944, I would be 10 years old.
Mr. JENNER. Your brother John was 12?
Mr. OSWALD. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. And your brother Lee was then 5?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir.
Mr. JENNER. Did you continue--when did you change--you said you stayed
at Davy Crockett Elementary School a year. And then you entered what
school?
Mr. OSWALD. In the fall of that year we entered Chamberlain-Hunt
Military Academy, at Port Gibson, Miss. That was the fall of 1945.
Mr. JENNER. You and John?
Mr. OSWALD. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. Now, what was the date that you gave me as to the marriage
of your mother and Mr. Ekdahl?
Mr. OSWALD. Approximately the early part of 1944. That is what I
stated before. And I think now that it would be more correct--after
we completed the year at Davy Crockett, I believe they were married
shortly after the end of the school year.
Mr. JENNER. That is in June, probably?
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir; somewhere along that time.
Mr. JENNER. And that would be--June of '44?
Mr. McKENZIE. June of '45.
Mr. JENNER. So that following the marriage of your mother and Mr.
Ekdahl--what was his full name?