Mr. JENNER. Yes.
Mrs. PAINE. He said he had not been able to find work in Dallas, around
Dallas, and Marina suggested going to New Orleans, which is where he
had been born.
Mr. DULLES. He said she had suggested?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes. That is my best recollection.
Mr. JENNER. Was Marina present now while he is relating this to you?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; I think so.
Mr. JENNER. She was present. Was he speaking in Russian or in English?
Mrs. PAINE. I think he must have been speaking in English when he asked
me to take the things to the bus station and explained that he was
going to look for work.
Mr. JENNER. Your best recollection is that this was in English?
Mrs. PAINE. I don't recall. It could well have been in Russian also. He
didn't like to speak English to me. He preferred to speak Russian.
The CHAIRMAN. To you?
Mrs. PAINE. To me; yes.
Representative FORD. Did he ever indicate why?
Mrs. PAINE. No.
Mr. JENNER. I think you said to me this morning, and please correct me
if my recollection is not good, that he always spoke to you in Russian.
Mrs. PAINE. With, perhaps, a couple of rare exceptions, yes, he spoke
to me in Russian. When I tried to teach him to drive I tried to explain
to him, proceeded to explain to him in English.
Mr. JENNER. Excuse me, you tried to teach him to do what?
Mrs. PAINE. To drive. This is later.
Mr. JENNER. Drive, yes.
Mrs. PAINE. But he would answer me in Russian, which is a way of
getting the person to go back to Russian. But I couldn't explain
driving in Russian, so I did it in English.
Mr. JENNER. That incident, Mrs. Paine, is very important, and we will
get to that at a later stage as to your efforts to teach him to drive.
Going back to this 24th of April, there was here, this was, a complete
surprise to you. You arrived at the home and this man was all packed to
go to New Orleans.
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Had you had any discussion with Marina about her coming to
live with you of which she was aware prior to this occasion on April 24?
Mrs. PAINE. I had discussed with her the possibility of her coming at
the time the baby was expected.
Mr. JENNER. When was the baby expected?
Mrs. PAINE. Mid-October.
Mr. JENNER. But there had been no discussion up to April 24, to your
recollection, even about your inviting Marina to come to live with you?
Mrs. PAINE. You mean on a more permanent basis, other than to stay when
the baby was due?
Mr. JENNER. Yes; which would be in the fall of the year.
Mrs. PAINE. That is right. There was none.
Mr. JENNER. There was no discussion about her coming to live with you
in the spring around about this time?
Mrs. PAINE. I remember feeling when I arrived that they were, and
probably appropriately, making their own plans, and wondering whether I
should have already made this invitation, but I had not.
Mr. JENNER. You say they were already making their own plans; are you
seeking to imply that they had some notion she might join you?
Mrs. PAINE. No; I don't think there was any notion. I am trying to say
I recall that I hadn't made that invitation at that time.
Mr. JENNER. To the best of your recollection it is now that you had not
discussed the subject with Marina up to this occasion?
Mrs. PAINE. Not the subject of staying on with me as an alternative to
going back to Russia.
Mr. JENNER. Only staying with you in the fall?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. When the baby came?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. What did you say, Mrs. Paine--excuse me. First, have you
exhausted your recollection of everything that Lee Oswald said on that
occasion when you arrived there?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. What did you say?
Mrs. PAINE. I said, yes, I would take his bags to the station if he
wanted me to.
Mr. JENNER. All right.
Mrs. PAINE. And we then did.
Mr. JENNER. You just left?
Mrs. PAINE. Take them to the bus station to be checked.
Mr. JENNER. Did Marina accompany you?
Mrs. PAINE. Marina went, and he checked the baggage. It was rather more
than he could have carried on the city bus, and I am sure he preferred
me to a taxi because I don't cost as much.
Mr. JENNER. You didn't cost anything?
Mrs. PAINE. That is right. And he then bought a ticket, he bought a
ticket for Marina, I mean I was thinking, while he was in the bus
station, and suggested that it would be a very difficult thing for a
pregnant woman with a small child to take a 12-hour, 13-hour bus trip
to New Orleans, and suggested that I drive her down with June.
Mr. JENNER. You volunteered this?
Mrs. PAINE. I volunteered this, and suggested further that instead of
her staying at her--at the apartment, as was planned at that time,
while waiting to hear from him, that she come and stay at my house
where he would reach us by phone, and where she would have someone else
with her while she waited to hear if he got work.
Mr. JENNER. This was the conversation between you and Lee Harvey
Oswald? Was it in English or in Russian?
Mrs. PAINE. Probably in Russian. I would think so, because I wanted her
to understand.
Mr. JENNER. Was Marina along?
Mrs. PAINE. She was present.
Mr. JENNER. She was present; I see.
Representative FORD. This took place where, in the car?
Mrs. PAINE. Probably in the bus station--in the car near the bus
station. He then took the bus ticket back, returned it, and got the
money.
The CHAIRMAN. Ticket for her?
Mrs. PAINE. Ticket for her.
Mr. DULLES. Her bus ticket?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; and he left some money for her for buying things in
the next few days before she could join him.
Mr. JENNER. Did he get on the bus then and depart?
Mrs. PAINE. No; the bus left in the evening. We all drove back to the
apartment after he had checked the baggage, and he helped load the baby
things and things that Marina would need during the next few days into
my car, and we emptied what was left there of the things that were in
the apartment, and which belonged to them, and then drove, I drove with
Marina and June and my two children back to my house, and he stayed
at the apartment. He was scheduled to leave by bus, city bus, and an
interstate bus that evening.
Mr. JENNER. I take it then, Mrs. Paine, that your impression was that
it was contemplated, when you arrived at the Oswalds that morning, that
Mrs. Oswald, Marina, and her child June, and her husband, Lee, were
contemplating going to New Orleans together that day?
Mrs. PAINE. No.
Mr. JENNER. Am I wrong?
Mrs. PAINE. That is wrong. She was to have stayed in the apartment.
Mr. JENNER. I see.
Mrs. PAINE. And wait to hear from him.
Mr. JENNER. Yes.
Mrs. PAINE. If they had been going together that would not have been
the hardship on her, but that traveling alone was, I felt.