The testimony of Jack L. Ruby was taken at 11 a.m., on July 18,
1964, at the Dallas County Jail, Dallas, Tex., by Mr. Arlen Specter,
assistant counsel of the President’s Commission. Present were: Bell P.
Herndon and W. James Wood, special agents of the FBI; Clayton Fowler
and Joe H. Tonahill, counsel for Jack Ruby; William F. Alexander,
assistant district attorney for Dallas County, Tex.; Allan L. Sweatt,
chief criminal deputy for Dallas County, Tex.; E. L. Holman, chief
jailer; and Dr. William Robert Beavers, observer.
Mr. SPECTER. May the record show that present at this time are Mr.
Clayton Fowler, chief counsel for Jack Ruby; Mr. Joe H. Tonahill,
cocounsel for Jack Ruby; Mr. William F. Alexander, assistant district
attorney for Dallas County, Tex.; Mr. Allan L. Sweatt, chief criminal
deputy and polygraph operator for Dallas County, Tex.; Mr. Bell P.
Herndon, the polygraph operator and special agent of the Federal Bureau
of Investigation; Mr. W. James Wood, special agent of the Federal
Bureau of Investigation; Odell Oliver, court reporter; and Arlen
Specter, assistant counsel of the President’s Commission.
We have discussed preliminarily the procedure to be followed on the
polygraph examination, where those currently present may remain
while the polygraph operators, Mr. Herndon and Mr. Wood, explain
the questions to Mr. Ruby, and then everyone would leave except the
operators, Messrs. Herndon and Wood, the court reporter and I, and the
question now subject to being resolved is the issue of whether anyone
will be present from the sheriff’s office.
As you know, the President’s Commission is trying to bring its work to
a close and the Chief Justice promised a polygraph test and that was
6 weeks ago tomorrow. There have been a lot of things we have had to
work out, and I think it all ought to be on the record. I would want to
give everyone an opportunity to put any request right on the record in
any way you want; and, of course, I think that all your objections and
comments about this proceeding should go on the record. After you have
so stated, I will state responsively the Commission’s position on these
proceedings.
I will say further that there is no closed mind on these issues and
that they will have to be weighed and evaluated by the members of the
Commission themselves.
Mr. FOWLER. Let me first suggest then—why don’t I discuss this with
Jack?
Mr. SPECTER. That’s fine.
Mr. FOWLER. And then Jack may say whether he wants to go ahead with
this and how I have advised him, and that he has on numerous occasions
requested it, and I will tell him that the Chief Justice promised to
give it to him and they are here ready to do it, which I am going to
tell him, and if he insists on it, I can’t and won’t try to hold him
back.
Mr. TONAHILL. That’s a good suggestion.
Mr. SPECTER. Fine; and if he has changed his mind for any reason, I
will just want to have it on the record, and that will conclude the
issue, so far as the Commission is concerned.
Mr. FOWLER. Let’s see—he’s on what floor?
Mr. TONAHILL. 6-M.
Mr. FOWLER. Let me step down and chat with him for just a few minutes.
Mr. TONAHILL. Do you want me to go with you?
Mr. FOWLER. I may need you later.
Mr. SPECTER. Let the record show that Mr. Fowler left the room, and
in approximately 5 minutes thereafter, returned to the room from his
conference with Mr. Ruby.
Mr. FOWLER. He says he’s going to take this test regardless of his
lawyers, and he says, “By God, I’m going to take the test.”
Mr. TONAHILL. Well, you know the law is in his favor and that he is
presumed to be sane, and there can’t be anybody speak for him but
himself.
Mr. FOWLER. I have advised him, and I have read this letter to him, and
I have explained all of this to him when I talked to him.