Mr. SENATOR. Pardon me.
Mr. HUBERT. Concerning the radio in the automobile, what was his custom
about putting it on when he was riding? Was it his custom to put it on
or not?
Mr. SENATOR. No, not. He normally didn’t put it on.
Mr. HUBERT. Normally he would not put it on?
Mr. SENATOR. Normally he wouldn’t have it on. He also had one of the
little transistors, one of these transistors that he had. The reason he
had this transistor, of course he had it before I was around, the car
he had before then, the radio didn’t work, so he had the transistor.
Mr. HUBERT. Where did he keep it, in the automobile?
Mr. SENATOR. Yes; he laid it on the seat.
Mr. HUBERT. Did he play it?
Mr. SENATOR. Yes; he put on the music.
Mr. HUBERT. So that was his custom when he was driving around, instead
of turning on the radio in the automobile?
Mr. SENATOR. I wouldn’t say at all times. Certain times he would put it
on and play the music.
Mr. HUBERT. He would play the transistor?
Mr. SENATOR. Yes. That was on the car he had when the radio, the car
radio was not working.
Mr. HUBERT. What was Ruby’s habit so far as you know concerning his
finances, and his banking and so forth?
Mr. SENATOR. As far as I know about it, his bank was his pockets. Now,
if he had any banking, I don’t know what he had in it.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you observe then that he carried large sums of money?
Mr. SENATOR. Oh yes; always. Everybody knew that.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, how did he carry it?
Mr. SENATOR. In ready cash.
Mr. HUBERT. But I mean did he roll it up and put it in his pocket?
Mr. SENATOR. Rolled it up or have a string around it, not a string, you
know, one of these rubber bands around it. He would carry some here and
he would carry some here, and some here, and some in his back pocket. I
don’t think he knew where he had it half the time.
Mr. HUBERT. Let the record show that when the witness was saying “here,
here and here,” he was pointing to various pockets.
Mr. SENATOR. This is the way. As a matter of fact, he used to say to me
“George, where is my money,” because he can’t remember where he put his
money.
Mr. HUBERT. Now you were with him frequently when he closed up the
Carousel at night and you would go home?
Mr. SENATOR. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. How was the money handled then, that is the receipts of
that night?
Mr. SENATOR. In his pocket.
Mr. HUBERT. We have heard something about a canvas bag, a money bag.
Did you ever see that?
Mr. SENATOR. Yes; I don’t know what he would have in the bag. You know
when it comes to money, that is his business. It doesn’t get that close
to me.
Mr. HUBERT. No; we are just asking you what you observed, that is all,
about his handling of it.
Mr. SENATOR. He has had money in the bag, and he has had it in his
pockets. Now I don’t know what the separation could be unless he has
got a certain amount of money for bills or what it is I don’t know.
Mr. HUBERT. When he had money in the bag where did he leave the bag?
Mr. SENATOR. The bag? In the trunk.
Mr. HUBERT. In the trunk of the car?
Mr. SENATOR. While going home.
Mr. HUBERT. In other words, when you would come out of the Carousel he
would take his bag up, and it had money in it, and bring it and throw
it in the trunk of the car?
Mr. SENATOR. Right. He would get home, open the trunk, take the bag up.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, do you know anything about a gun that he had, a pistol?
Mr. SENATOR. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Tell us what you know about it.
Mr. SENATOR. I know he had a pistol, one of the small ones. In the
nature of his type business, carrying all this money, this cash with
him, this is why he always had the gun with him.
Mr. HUBERT. Did he keep the gun on his body?
Mr. SENATOR. At times he had it on his body and at times he had it in
his pocket.
Mr. HUBERT. Did he own a holster for the gun?
Mr. SENATOR. No; not that I know of.
Mr. HUBERT. Either a shoulder holster or a hip holster?
Mr. SENATOR. No; I have never seen it.
Mr. HUBERT. So when he carried a gun on his person where would he keep
it?
Mr. SENATOR. It would be in his pants pocket or sometimes it may be in
the bag.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you know anything, from talking to him or otherwise,
about the ownership of the Vegas Club? Who owned the Vegas, in other
words, as far as you know?
Mr. SENATOR. As far as I know Jack Ruby owned it.
Mr. HUBERT. Am I correct in assuming that your opinion on that point is
from what he told you, or did he say anything else?
Mr. SENATOR. I always understood that he owned it, I mean as far as I
know. Of course, there is a lot of things that I don’t know that he
never told me, you know. He doesn’t expose everything.
Mr. HUBERT. Eva Grant was actually the operator of it, wasn’t she?
Mr. SENATOR. Yes; but Eva always felt like she was the owner. This is a
sister. Of course, she had it and managed it for quite a while. I don’t
know how long she managed it, has been at the Vegas Club, because it
was before me even, you know.
Mr. HUBERT. On what do you base that opinion that she thought that she
really was the owner?
Mr. SENATOR. Because I assumed that Jack was a brother and she felt it
was like hers.
Mr. HUBERT. You see what I am trying to get at is whether or not there
are any statements or incidents that occurred which led you to the
opinion that she thought she owned the Vegas. Do you see what I mean?
Mr. SENATOR. The only way I could express that is Jack used to say to
me that “Eva thinks she owns the club,” because she has been staying
there so long.
Mr. HUBERT. How do they get along?
Mr. SENATOR. They are both of the same nature, like cats and dogs.
Mr. HUBERT. I take it from that you mean they used to fight a lot.
Mr. SENATOR. Yes; because as well as Jack would holler, let me assure
you she can holler too.
Mr. HUBERT. And you have been a witness to some of those instances?
Mr. SENATOR. As a matter of fact, the further away the better.
Mr. HUBERT. I don’t quite understand.
Mr. SENATOR. For me the further away the better. In other words, I
shied away from all that. I didn’t want to listen to that kind of stuff.