Mr. LITCHFIELD. No; they said, “If you give false information as to an
exact statement—” not an opinion, but if I say I’m positive, that’s a
statement.
Mr. HUBERT. Well, are you conveying to me that you really were
positive, but that——
Mr. LITCHFIELD. In my mind.
Mr. HUBERT. You were scared off of it?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. No, sir; no, sir. I said in my mind I was positive that
it looked like him, but I’m just as fallible as anybody else. I could
be 100 percent wrong. I said, “In my mind, the man that I saw looked
just like him,” but then again, I can’t say 100 percent.
Mr. HUBERT. And that is still your opinion?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. I said it bears a close resemblance, but not having
come in contact with Oswald at all or having never met him or anything,
and just seeing him for a fleeting glance, the back of his head and
when he walked by me; no, I can’t be 100 percent pure positive.
Mr. HUBERT. But you knew all of that the first time you told it to
Green?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Well, like I said, “It sure does look like him—the man
I saw there sure does look like Oswald,” those are my words.
Mr. HUBERT. But, what has caused you to weaken in your opinion it was
Oswald, as you tell it to me, is the fact that you got the impression
that if you gave a positive identification and it proved to be false,
that it would be a Federal offense, is that correct?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Yes; they said, giving false information to the FBI,
and I’m not 100 percent pure positive. I say, “It bears a close
resemblance,” and this is all I can say.
Mr. HUBERT. And that’s all you did tell them?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Yes, sir; that’s the statement I signed.
Now, the big heavy-set fellow that I met, I shook hands with, made an
impression on me. I was as close to him as I am to you now, or closer.
I shook hands with him, and I saw him more than for a fleeting moment.
Mr. HUBERT. I want to show you a picture and ask you if you can see any
resemblance between the picture I am going to show you and the man you
thought might be Oswald—this picture I am going to show you, the man is
dressed up, but if you can use your imagination to see if there is any
resemblance?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. To see if there is any resemblance?
Mr. HUBERT. To see if there is any resemblance in the face, at least,
and the hair, and so forth?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. No; Oswald’s hair isn’t that thick in the center.
Mr. HUBERT. I’m not talking about Oswald, I’m talking about the man you
saw at the club you thought might be Oswald.
Mr. LITCHFIELD. No, sir; there is no resemblance.
Mr. HUBERT. There is no resemblance?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. No, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Let the record show that the picture that I have shown
to the witness has been identified as Exhibit 5302 in the deposition
of Andrew Armstrong. Do you know Captain Fritz of the Dallas Police
Department?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. Have you had difficulties with him?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Once.
Mr. HUBERT. In what regard?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. He sent two men to the place that I was working and
had them pick me up for investigation without a warrant, bodily remove
me out of my office, and held me on robbery by firearms, which I
couldn’t have a writ of habeas corpus that night, or something, I had
to go before a judge or something, and I didn’t get out until the next
morning, and he didn’t even appear at the hearing.
Mr. HUBERT. How long ago was that?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. That was in—I think it was March or April of 1961, I
believe.
Mr. HUBERT. You haven’t seen him since?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Well, when I had to go down to the police station, I
did.
Mr. HUBERT. You mean the next morning?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. No; when I had to go down for questioning. No, he
didn’t even show up at the hearing there.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you know a man by the name of Jess Willard Lynch
[spelling] J-e-s-s W-i-l-l-a-r-d L-y-n-c-h?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. I don’t think so—the name doesn’t sound familiar. I
know a Lynch, but Jess Willard Lynch?
Mr. HUBERT. What Lynch do you know?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. I know a Donald Lynch from school.
Mr. HUBERT. Is he in Dallas?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. I believe so.
Mr. HUBERT. How long has it been since you have seen him?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. High school.
Mr. HUBERT. I see—that is to say about 10 or 12 years ago?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Roughly—that name doesn’t sound familiar.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you know a person by the name of Earlene Roberts?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Earlene Roberts—I don’t remember whether I know her or
not. Closely, I don’t—I could have dated her or seen her, but closely,
I don’t remember.
Mr. HUBERT. I’ll put it this way, when I mention the name of Earlene
Roberts, do you associate it with anybody you know?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Well, I used to go out quite a bit in my life, and I
went with a number of people, and I was thinking that I dated one time
a girl named Earlene, but I don’t remember her last name—that’s why I
stopped and hesitated.
Mr. HUBERT. And that’s the person whose image came to your mind when I
mentioned Earlene Roberts?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you know that Earlene Roberts, that I am talking about,
is the sister of Bertha Cheek?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. If she’s her sister, I was trying to think if I ever
met Bertha’s sister. I talked to her on the phone once. Bertha told me
she had two sisters, I believe, wait a minute—Earlene Roberts is the
one that lives in California, I believe, I believe it is, and Bertha
went out to see her, maybe, when Bertha went out to California 4 or
5 days on some business, and then I was helping her remodel the home
over there and painting then, and I think I had to call her and I think
Earlene Roberts was the person I called in California, I think.
Mr. HUBERT. You called the person in California for Cheek?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. To talk to Bertha when she was out there.
Mr. HUBERT. That was when?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Maybe October—maybe November.
Mr. HUBERT. It was after you were negotiating with her?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Yes, but I don’t remember the exact date. I knew that
name sounded real familiar.
Mr. HUBERT. Bill DeMar, or have you heard of him?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. You will have to associate it with something for me.
Mr. HUBERT. Well, he was an MC at Jack’s Carousel Club.
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Well, I don’t know that man. I saw him—he did a song
or something while I was there, but I don’t know him, if that’s who it
is—I don’t know him.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you remember the story in the Press after Ruby shot
Oswald that he said that he had seen him at the Carousel?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. I never knew of that—I never knew that.
Mr. HUBERT. Have you been interviewed by anybody of the Commission’s
staff other than myself?
Mr. LITCHFIELD. No, sir; the only people I have talked to is the Dallas
Police Force and to two FBI agents, and I didn’t have any knowledge
that you would talk to me until yesterday. They called long distance
for me and he called me this morning—I bowl in a scratch league on
Thursday night and he told me I had to be here at room 301 at 3 p.m.
Mr. HUBERT. Well, we pushed it up a little bit for you.
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Yes, Mr. Sorrels called me this morning and asked me if
I could make it earlier, and I said “I will leave on the flight 11:45
and I am booked definite at 5:15 going back and on a standby on this
one here.”
Mr. HUBERT. Well, you can make the 5:15 now, because you are through
right now.
Mr. LITCHFIELD. Thank you very much. I enjoyed it. I will get to see my
wife for a while.
Mr. HUBERT. Thank you very much.