The following discussion took place on the paper read by Sir Frederick
Young, on South Africa, at the opening meeting of the Session of the
Royal Colonial Institute, on November 12th, at which the Marquis of Lome
presided:--
PROFESSOR H.G. SEELEY: In common with you all, I have listened with
great pleasure to this interesting and wide-reaching address. I
have not myself been so far afield. My observations were limited to
Cape Colony; and the things which I saw in that Colony were
necessarily, to a large extent, different from those recorded by
Sir Frederick Young. On landing at Cape Town I naturally turned to
what the people of South Africa were doing for themselves, and
confess I was amazed when I saw the great docks, by means of which
the commerce of South Africa is being encouraged, and by which it
will hereafter be developed. I was impressed, too, with the
educational institutions, the great Public Library, worthy of any
town, the South African Museum, the South African College, and the
various efforts made to bring the newest and best knowledge home to
the people. But perhaps in Cape Town, the thing which impressed me
as most curious was the new dock, in process of construction by
excavating stone for the breakwater and other purposes. This work
was carried on by coloured convict labour. The convicts thus become
trained in useful manual work, as well as in habits of obedience,
and when they are discharged, are not only better men, but people
in whose work employers of labour have confidence. I learned that
the great public mountain roads in Cape Colony have thus been
constructed by convict labour, at a comparatively small cost, while
the convict acquires skill and useful training. Going up country,
my attention, among other matters, was turned to the distribution
of mineral wealth and difficulties of water supply, for, as Sir
Frederick Young has remarked, the water supply is one of the great
problems which all persons have to consider in South Africa. The
season during which rain falls is short, and the rain drains
rapidly down comparatively steep inclined surfaces, so that science
of many kinds has to be enlisted to conserve the water, and turn
the supply to account. I found the rocks of much of the country
have been curiously compressed and hardened and thrown into
parallel irregular folds, and that these rocks were afterwards worn
down by the action of water, at a time when the land was still
beneath the ocean, with the result that many basin-shaped
depressions are preserved and exposed, each of which holds a
certain amount of water. Just as we never dream of putting down a
well in this country without knowing the positions of the
water-bearing strata, so it is hopeless to bore profitably for
water in the Colony till the districts are defined over which the
water-bearing basins are spread. Nothing arrests the escape of
water in its course through the rocks more efficiently than
intrusive sheets of igneous rock which rise to the surface, but
until the distribution of these dykes is systematically recorded it
will not be possible to open out all the water which is preserved
underground. There is no doubt that by utilising geological facts
of this nature, a better water supply may be obtained, which will
enable more land to be brought under cultivation, and larger crops
to be raised. I may say that the Colonial Government is fully aware
of the importance of following out such lines of work, and steps
are being taken to give effect to such exploration. Vegetation,
however, by its radiating power, must always be one of the chief
aids to improved water supply. In the matter of mineral wealth,
Cape Colony is not so rich as some adjacent lands. It contains
coal, but the individual beds of coal are thin, and owing to this
thinness the coal necessarily alternates with shale, which is more
conspicuous than in the coal fields of Britain. I remember that
Professor Sedgwick, my old master in geology, told me that in his
youth seams of coal only some four to six inches thick were worked
on the sides of hills in Yorkshire, and that the coal was carried
on horseback over the country to supply the wants of the mountain
population. Cape Colony is in a far better state than that. In the
Eastern Province the beds of coal are frequently a foot or two or
more in thickness. They crop out on the surface with a slight dip
near to the railway, and although only worked at present in a few
pits (as at Cyphergat, Fairview, Molteno--I did not visit the
Indwe)--the coal-bearing rocks certainly extend over a much wider
area of country than that which has been explored. One of the happy
results at which I arrived in my short visit to this district was
to find that there are certain extinct forms of reptilian life
associated with these coal beds, by means of which the geological
horizon upon which the coal occurs may be traced through the
country; so that there is a prospect of this mineral being followed
along its outcrop in the Eastern Province with comparative ease by
this means. It is desirable on all accounts that coal should be
burned rather than timber, since the destruction of wood is harmful
to the supply of water. With regard to the gold of Cape Colony, I
have not the requisite knowledge to speak with the same confidence.
The quantity in any district is probably small: the amount is great
in the aggregate, but very widely diffused. Gold appears to be
present in small amounts in almost all the volcanic rocks, so that
as those rocks decay and new mineral substances are formed out of
the decomposed products, the gold which they contained is often
preserved and concentrated in thin and narrow veins of zeolitic
minerals, which extend over the surface of these volcanic rocks. To
what extent these zeolites may be hereafter worked with profit it
is impossible at present to say, for much may depend upon water
supply, by means of which the ore would be crushed and washed, and
much on the varying quantities of gold present in samples from
different localities. On the whole, the utilisation of science in
the service of man, especially in relation to metals, coal, and
water supply, if systematically carried out, will, I believe, be an
element of future prosperity to Cape Colony, and enable the Colony
to minister to the welfare of adjacent lands.
Mr. J.X. MERRIMAN: I am sure South Africans are very grateful
indeed to the amiable and kindly critic in the person of Sir
Frederick Young. It is no new thing to Colonists to owe him a debt.
All those present will acknowledge the great things he has done for
the Colonies in connection with the Royal Colonial Institute. Sir
Frederick Young is a man who has been content to look after small
things, and the result is this Institute has been worked up by the
individual efforts of Colonists and others to its present
flourishing condition. I hope the Institute will long flourish,
and never be absorbed by anything under more magnificent
auspices--in other words, that you will "paddle your own canoe." It
is good sometimes to have a plain statement from a plain man. South
Africa suffers under a plague of experts who, after spending a few
weeks there, tell us exactly what we ought to do; and we don't like
it. I wish I could speak to you as a sort of amiable critic, but I
have the misfortune to belong to that much-despised class the local
politician, and I notice that, when anybody says anything about the
Colonies in England, all unite in kicking the local politician. In
order not to sail under false colours, I state frankly that I
belong to that class. Of course, South Africa is creating a deal of
interest at the present time. People who come to fortunes usually
do excite a great deal of interest among relations who may in times
gone by have given them the cold shoulder. There can be no doubt as
to the material prosperity of South Africa at the present time, and
still less doubt as to the future. The gold fields of Witwatersrand
are unique in the world. This is not my own statement, but the
statement of eminent mining engineers from America. For thirty
miles and more you have a continuous stretch of reef, which gives
throughout a uniform yield per ton, and which has been proved to
the depth of some hundred feet, and may--there is every reason to
believe--go to unknown depths. The reefs are now being worked in
the most economical manner. When proper appliances for mining are
used, and when we get the stock-jobbers off our backs, I believe a
career of prosperity will open of which few people dream. From
another point of view, to those who love the country and make their
home there, there cannot but be a seamy side to the picture. Great
wealth brings other things in its train. It has brought into South
Africa a great spirit of gambling. People neglect the honest
industries of the country: they leave their farm work, and rush off
to make fortunes in a minute. Everybody--from the king to the
beggar--is gambling in gold shares. Everybody neglects his
business, and talks about nothing else. I ask whether this is a
wholesome state of society? Is it not a state of society to which
we may look with some degree of apprehension? I believe myself that
things will work round, but, undoubtedly, the state of affairs is
serious. After all, there is something which goes to build up a
country besides material wealth, and I am not sure that gambling in
gold shares is exactly the thing which is wanted. Of course, there
have been other countries where these vast increases of material
wealth have occurred--California and Australia--but there the
conditions were different. They were new countries, which attracted
large numbers of white men, and, when they found the gold fields
did not pay, they made homes for themselves on the land.
Unfortunately, that state of affairs does not exist at the present
time in South Africa, and that brings us face to face with the
great problem on which Sir Frederick Young has touched--the great
problem which we have always before us--viz., how two races utterly
alien to each other, the black and the white, are to live and
increase side by side. South Africa is the only country in the
world where that problem exists, excepting the Southern States of
North America. This is a great question, on which the future of
South Africa depends. Unfortunately, the white men do not work in a
country where the black race flourishes. If the white man does not
become a "boss," he sinks to the level of a mean white man. The
difficulty is to get a state of society in which the white race
shall flourish side by side with the black; and when people talk
about the "local politicians," the "average Cape politician," and
the like, they should remember we have to deal with this enormous
problem--that we are anxious to do justice to the "black," and at
the same time we are naturally anxious to see the European
population flourish. I believe the gold fields will attract a
large European population. The wages are enormous. There are 20,000
black men, without a stitch upon them, earning as much as eighteen
shillings a week a-piece, and getting as much food as they can eat,
in the mines of Johannesburg. People talk about the treatment of
the blacks. Nobody dares to treat them badly, because they would
run away. There is a competition for them, and the black man has an
uncommonly rosy time of it. The white men naturally won't work
under the same conditions as the blacks. I saw a letter from an
operative cautioning his fellow artisans against going out. He
says, "We get thirty shillings a day, but it is a dreadful place to
live in." I ask the operatives in England to mistrust that
statement. ("What is the cost of living?") You can live at the club
very well indeed for £10 a month--the club, mind you, where the
aristocracy live. It is idle to tell me the honest artisan cannot
live. In addition to the black and white population, there is
another problem, and that is, the influx of Arabs, who creep down
the East Coast through the door of Natal. They are gradually
ousting the English retail trader. You may go to up-country towns,
and in whole streets you will see these yellow fellows, sitting
there in their muslin dresses, where formerly there were English
traders. In places where we want to cultivate the English
population, that is a very serious thing. Our yellow friends come
under the garb of British subjects from Bombay, and are making
nests in the Transvaal and elsewhere by ousting the English retail
trader. Sir Frederick Young has alluded to State colonisation. I am
sorry to differ from so amiable a critic of our ways, but, as one
who has had a little experience, I can tell him that you may send
Colonists out, but you cannot as easily make them stay there. If
they make their fortunes, they come home to England to spend them.
If they are poor, and bad times come, the black man crowds them
out, and off they go to Australia. You can depend on a German
peasant settling, but bring an Englishman or a Scotchman, and he
wants to better himself. In that he is quite right, but he does not
see his way on a small plot of ground, and off he goes down a mine,
or something of that sort. There are great difficulties in the way
of State-aided emigration. We do not want the riff-raff; we don't
want the "surplus population." It is one of the greatest
difficulties to get decent, steady Englishmen to settle on the
land. It is the people who settle on the land who make a country,
and if Sir Frederick Young can give us a receipt for making English
people settle there he will confer one of the greatest possible
benefits on South Africa. Sir Frederick Young departed from the
usual custom on such occasions by touching on politics. I am glad
he did, because more interest is given to the discussion, and there
is nothing like good, healthy controversy. Sir Frederick Young is
greatly concerned that there should be a settled policy for South
Africa. All I can say is, in Heaven's name, don't listen to a syren
voice of that kind. So surely as you have a settled policy--some
great and grand scheme--so surely will follow disaster and
disgrace. The people of South Africa may be very stupid, but they
are very much like other people--determined to make their policy
themselves, and the policy of South Africa is not going to be
framed in Downing Street. I cannot help thinking Sir Frederick
Young did injustice to some of my friends who have been at the head
of affairs. "The mournful mismanagement of South African affairs,"
he says, "during the last twenty-five years, and most especially
during the last decade, has been truly lamentable, and cannot fail
to awaken the saddest feelings on the part of every loyal Briton
and true-hearted patriot." But have affairs been mismanaged for the
last twenty-five years? The revenue twenty-five years ago was
£500,000. It is now nearly £4,000,000. For twenty-five years, under
the beneficent rule of Downing Street, we had not a mile of
railway. Now we have 2,000 miles. Twenty-five years ago there was
no national feeling at all. Now there is a strong South African
feeling, which is destined to grow and build up a South African
policy. As to the talk about a settled and firm policy, Sir Philip
Wodehouse was the last Governor who had a grand scheme from Downing
Street. A more honest, conscientious, and able man did not exist;
but his policy was a failure. Then came my friend Sir Henry Barkly.
His policy was distinctly opposite. It was a true policy for South
Africa. It was a policy of _laissez-faire_. The result was, things
went on as merrily as a marriage bell, Dutch and English drew
together, the natives were quiet, South Africa was prosperous, and
everything went on as happily as possible till Mr. Froude and Lord
Carnarvon hit on the grand scheme of uniting South Africa. From
that day our misfortunes began. One of the most able, courteous,
and high-minded gentlemen in the British service--Sir Bartle
Frere--was sent to carry out this firm policy. What was the result?
Failure. I will say nothing more about it. Then Sir Hercules
Robinson reverted to the _laissez-faire_ policy. South Africa was
under a shade--nobody would look at us. But now we are gradually
righting ourselves, and getting into a prosperous condition. Now
are being raised again the cries for a grand policy. I caution you
against them. Let us manage our own affairs. _Laissez faire,
laissez aller_--that is our policy for South Africa. There are no
nostrums required. The one thing required is the gradual bringing
of the Dutch and English together. There are no two races more
fitted to unite. You know how like they are to Englishmen. The Boer
is as like the English farmer as possible. There are no people more
fond of manly sports than the Dutch; they enter into them
heartily, and in the cricket and football fields they are among the
best players. They are as fond of riding and shooting as Englishmen
are. In fact, the Dutch and the English are as like as Heaven can
make them, and the only thing that keeps them apart is man's
prejudice. The one thing to do is to bring them together. How can
you help that end? Not by girding at them, and writing against Boer
ways, but by recognising the fact that they have been pioneers in
South Africa, and that they are the only people who will settle on
the land. I see there is a great agitation about Swaziland, which
is entirely surrounded by the Transvaal Republic. ("No.") Well,
except as to Tongaland, and I am not going to say anything about
that. The cry is got up, "Don't hand it over to the Boers." In
whose interest is that cry got up? It is in the interest of a few
speculators, and not in the interest of the capitalists, who have
£108,000,000 invested in the Transvaal, and yet are not afraid to
trust the Boers with Swaziland. This girding at the Dutch is
resented, and does incalculable harm. People at home have very
little idea how much influence public opinion in England has in
South Africa. Sir Frederick Young has alluded to President Kruger,
who won't put down prize fights because he might be thought to be
oppressing the Englishman! All I ask is, don't let your talk about
union with the Dutch be mere lip service. Trust them; work hand in
hand with them. Unless you do you will make little progress in
South Africa. By that I mean political progress. The material
progress of South Africa is now secured; therefore my advice
is--cultivate the Dutch, because, unless they are our friends, we
shall be a divided people, and our black and yellow brethren will
get the best of us. Our true policy is, _Laissez faire, laissez
aller_.
Sir G. BADEN-POWELL, K.C.M.G., M.P.: My friend, Mr. Merriman, has
made a speech of the utmost value to South Africa, and it is a
very fitting, I will not say reply, but comment, on the address to
which we have listened with such pleasure; but Mr. Merriman, with
his strong arguments and apt illustrations, came at the end to the
conclusion at which Sir Frederick Young had arrived. I have not
much to add, but I think we have heard from Sir Frederick Young a
view of South African affairs on the political side which, I may
tell you frankly, differs diametrically from my own. I have heard
from Mr. Merriman a view of affairs in which I cordially concur,
but from neither have I heard of that third aspect which, I think,
is necessary to complete the view. Sir Frederick Young has told us
that for twenty-five years, certainly during the last ten years,
South Africa has been mismanaged. I must confess I was sorry to
hear the strong language he used, because one cannot but remember
that for the greater part of the last twenty years most of the
affairs of South Africa have been in the hands of free
self-governing communities. Cape Colony has been under Responsible
Government since 1873, and the Free State and the Transvaal have
always been self-governing. I agree with Mr. Merriman that for the
last twenty-five years affairs in South Africa have progressed,
with one signal and fatal exception, and that was the policy under
which we took over and then gave back the Transvaal. Omitting that,
I think we have but little to be sorry for in the history of South
Africa. There have been troubles, but I, for one, think that all
difficulties, would have been avoided if the phrase "Imperial aid"
had been substituted for that of "Imperial interference" in the
affairs of South Africa. It is the aid which has been given by the
Mother Country which has resulted in developing the material
resources, and, above all, in establishing the security from native
attack of various European States in South Africa. Sir Frederick
Young spoke of the attitude towards the Imperial Government. I
could wish he had been in Cape Town on the day Sir Charles Warren
landed, and seen the ovation he received from all classes. Let me
add this--that the Bechuanaland expedition, which was led by Sir
Charles Warren, and in which I had the good fortune to take part,
cost the Mother Country perhaps £1,500,000, but in the discussions
in Parliament or in the press as to the future of Bechuanaland, the
fact is seldom mentioned that Bechuanaland was acquired for the
Empire at the cost of the British taxpayer. Let me remind you of
another fact, which the Cape Colonist well knows--that when the
Imperial Government wished, from wise motives of economy, to extend
the Cape system of railways to Kimberley, at a time when the Cape
Ministers were not prepared to carry out the extension, the British
Parliament advanced a loan of £400,000, at a low rate of interest,
for that object. Another instance I could quote, in connection with
the history of that interesting native territory--Basutoland. You
remember how that country was handed over to the Cape Colonists,
and that for various reasons the management of the Basutos got
beyond their power, the result being that the Imperial Government
went to the aid of the Cape Colony and took back Basutoland. I
mention these cases because they illustrate an aspect of affairs
which is, I think, apt to be neglected. We at home--and certainly
those who have enjoyed the kind hospitality of their brethren in
South Africa--wish to do all we can to aid our fellow-countrymen in
that part of the globe. We do not wish to interfere, and I should
like to see this put forward as the grand and final policy of South
Africa--that we are ready to aid that portion of the Empire, but
set our faces against interference. In conclusion, I will add that
I am sure all of us congratulate Sir Frederick Young on having so
successfully accomplished his arduous journey, returning to us, as
he does, in better health than when he left. If you wish to renew
your youth, and grow younger instead of older, follow his
example--make a trip through South Africa, sleeping in the open
veldt.
Dr. SYMES THOMPSON: Another year's experience has confirmed and
strengthened my conclusions as to the remarkable salubrity of the
South African climate in cases of chest disease and of nerve wear,
which I laid before the Royal Colonial Institute in November last.
While regarding the neighbourhood of Cape Town and Grahamstown as
beneficial for a short sojourn, among the upland stations I would
call attention to Middelburg and Tarkestad. Hotel accommodation and
adequate comfort for invalids, as regards food, quarters,
attention, occupation, and amusement, are still most deficient.
During the recent drought the dust storms proved very trying to the
eyes and to the bronchial membranes at Kimberley, and at
Johannesburg the dangers were great. I rejoice to learn that Sir
Frederick Young has found his winter trip so health-giving, and
believe that a similar expedition might prove of immense value to
many Englishmen who are overwrought in body or in mind.
The CHAIRMAN (the Right Hon. the Marquis of Lorne, K.T., G.C.M.G.):
I propose a hearty vote of thanks to Sir Frederick Young for his
kindness in reading the Paper. I was extremely interested myself,
as I think you all were. In his political observations, and in
speaking of a firm policy, I think that, after all, what the reader
of the Paper meant was firmness in allowing each nationality to
develop itself as it best might, with aid from home. I think that
is the sense of his observations, and I am sure we are obliged to
him, not only for speaking of more personal matters, but also for
telling us the actual impressions he derived from the journey. I
entirely agree with Mr. Merriman--and I believe Sir Frederick Young
does--that, finding ourselves in South Africa with the Dutch, we
must work with them and through them. I hope the Dutch will allow
themselves to be helped in one matter which Sir Frederick Young
impressed on President Kruger--apparently not with great
results--viz., in the matter of railways, and that they will allow
railways to pierce the Transvaal. I am sure he is a man of too much
intelligence very much to object to railways. That policy would be
too much like that of the Chinese. I remember, when I was at the
head of a society in London, asking the representative of China to
come and listen to a paper in regard to railways through Siam. He
said solemnly--"Chinese not like railways." I said this railway
would not go through the Imperial dominions--that it would only be
at a respectful distance. Again my remarks were interpreted to him,
and again, after a long pause, he solemnly replied--"Chinese don't
like railways near frontier." I am sure President Kruger will not
fritter chances away in that manner, and that he will allow us to
help him.
SIR FREDERICK YOUNG, K.C.M.G.: I feel extremely flattered by the
compliment which our noble Chairman has been good enough to pay me.
It was really most gratifying to me to be able to take the
interesting and instructive tour from which I have recently
returned, and the only difficulty and hesitation I felt as to
giving an account of what I saw was that I saw so much that I did
not know how I could crowd a tithe of it in the reasonable
dimensions of a paper. I was a little in dread, I confess, when so
astute and able a politician as Mr. Merriman rose to make his
criticisms; but I wish him to understand, as well as you, that the
view I put forward--perhaps I did not explain myself as clearly as
I ought to have done--was that advocated by Mr. Merriman himself,
namely, that South Africa should be allowed to frame her own
policy. That is the sum and substance of what I wished to say on
that point. As the noble Marquis has been so kind as to act as my
interpreter, I need not take up more of your time by enlarging on
this question. I have now the greatest possible pleasure in asking
you to join with me in thanking the noble Marquis for having, as
one of our Vice-Presidents, been so kind as to preside on this
occasion.
[Illustration: Decorative]
[Illustration: Decorative]