Mr. DEAN. All right.
Mr. GRIFFIN. And you went into the basement area and had the TV
interview and then went up to the third floor, did you talk with any of
the police officers who had been down there in the basement area?
Mr. DEAN. No, sir.
Mr. GRIFFIN. While you were in the jail office, before you came out,
did you talk to any of the officers who were there, who were in the
jail office; did you talk with them?
Mr. DEAN. No, sir.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, why were you going up to the third floor?
Mr. DEAN. I was going to Captain Fritz' office.
Mr. GRIFFIN. And what were you going to do up there?
Mr. DEAN. I was just going to see if Jack Ruby was in Captain Fritz'
office, or whether he was taken immediately to the jail. I didn't know
where he was taken to.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Why did you want to go up to see Jack Ruby?
Mr. DEAN. To see if they were--this was in my mind, to see if they were
going to go ahead and identify him, because I knew other pressmen and
other people were going to be asking me, since I had this interview,
and see if--did he want me to go ahead and identify him or do what I
did in the initial interview, say that this information will have to
come from Captain Fritz' office. It really wasn't significant. I knew
that I would be talked to at later times all during the day and pressed
for the identity of this man, and I wanted to ask them there did they
want us to release it or want them to keep it and release it themselves.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You had already told the newsmen?
Mr. DEAN. Yes, sir. I had already told the newsmen this. I didn't
identify the man.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You had already told the newsmen that the man who shot
Oswald was Ruby?
Mr. DEAN. No, sir. I didn't. I didn't identify the man. They asked me
did I recognize this man. I said "Yes." And they asked me could I tell
them who he was, and I said I had rather not, and I did not identify
him as Ruby. I identified him as a businessman in the city of Dallas,
but I did tell them that I recognized the man by sight.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, when you got up on the third floor, where did you see
Chief Curry?
Mr. DEAN. Just as I got off of the elevator.
Mr. GRIFFIN. And did you ask him to discuss this problem with you?
Mr. DEAN. No, sir. He immediately introduced--said, "This is Mr.
Forrest V. Sorrels, head of the Secret Service in Dallas, and take my
keys and take him to the fifth floor to interview Ruby."
Mr. GRIFFIN. You got up to the fifth floor, who was with Ruby?
Mr. DEAN. Detective Archer, D. R. Archer, Detective T. D. McMillon and
Detective B. S. Clardy is the three, and that's the only three I can
recall standing there. I think that was all that was with him.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was there a jailer there?
Mr. DEAN. Not standing there necessarily by him. There, of course, are
jailers all over the floor, and you know, there were--not particularly
around him though. The only ones I can recall standing close to Ruby
was those three detectives.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What state of dress or undress was Ruby in at that time?
Mr. DEAN. He was stripped to his shorts.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, what did you do when you got up there?
Mr. DEAN. I walked immediately to him. I heard--well, immediately
I told him, I said, "This is Mr. Forrest V. Sorrels"--started the
introduction, and Ruby stopped me and he said, "I know who he is. He is
with the FBI." Mr. Sorrels then informed him. He said, "No. I am not
with the FBI. I am with the Secret Service." And then he again told
him, "I want you to know that I am not with the FBI. I am with the
Secret Service." And so Ruby said something to the effect, "Well, I
knew that you were working for the Government."
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you remember Ruby making any remark to Sorrels to the
effect, "Are you with the newspapermen"?
Mr. DEAN. Yes, sir. I recall most all of that conversation.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Tell us what that conversation was.
Mr. DEAN. After Sorrels had identified himself as a Secret Service man,
he said, "I want to ask you some questions." And then Ruby asked him,
"Is this for the magazines or press?" And he said, "No. It's for my
information, as an agent." And he said, "Okay. I will answer all your
questions."
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you remember any discussion with him, anything Sorrels
said about his acquaintanceship in the Jewish community?