Mr. GRIFFIN. Is it a solid thing or is it a metal set----

Mr. NEWMAN. Just made of pipes.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Is it any different from the railings that's along the

Commerce Street ramp?

Mr. NEWMAN. Same type railing, I believe.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Same type of railing. And the railing that's marked in

solid on the other side of the entrance to the garage next to the chief

parking area, which I will also label rail, that's the same kind of

railing as the ones over near the TV cameras?

Mr. NEWMAN. Yes.

Mr. GRIFFIN. So, your vision from where you were standing was not

substantially obstructed by any permanent parts of the building, from

where the marked curb on the ramp is, all the way down, perhaps to

this, all the way down to this railing here [indicating]?

Mr. NEWMAN. It was somewhat obstructed by these columns, but nothing to

keep me from getting an overall view of the area.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, what do you recall happening after the automobile

drove out of the drive and went up the Commerce Street ramp?

Mr. NEWMAN. I don't recall anything until I heard that "Here he comes,"

called out.

Mr. GRIFFIN. What did you do when you heard the "Here he comes"?

Mr. NEWMAN. I looked up in that direction.

Mr. GRIFFIN. And what did you see when you looked up in that direction?

Mr. NEWMAN. All I saw was the newsmen congregating to that area.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Where did they seem to be pushing in from?

Mr. NEWMAN. Well, they were making a round in this general area in here

[indicating].

Mr. GRIFFIN. You are indicating the area up in the ramp, Main Street

ramp?

Mr. NEWMAN. Yes.

Mr. GRIFFIN. How deep were they in the Main Street ramp, by that time?

Mr. NEWMAN. I would guess two or three, but that's just a guess.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, does that include policemen, also?

Mr. NEWMAN. You mean the number of people?

Mr. GRIFFIN. Yes.

Mr. NEWMAN. Yes.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Would you say the total number of people was two or three

deep there?

Mr. NEWMAN. Uh-huh.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Was it solid across from this wall to the railing?

Mr. NEWMAN. Well, I couldn't see that much detail.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, as you looked over in that direction, after you heard

"Here he comes," and you saw this milling around, what is the next

thing that you remember seeing?

Mr. NEWMAN. Well, like I said, I saw these people congregating to this

area. I did see a man come down this ramp [indicating].

Mr. GRIFFIN. You saw a man come down the ramp?

Mr. NEWMAN. That's right.

Mr. GRIFFIN. When did you see him come down the ramp?

Mr. NEWMAN. It was just immediately after that was called out.

Mr. GRIFFIN. And whereabouts did you first see him when he was on the

ramp?

Mr. NEWMAN. Oh, I would say in about the location of this arrow

[indicating].

Mr. GRIFFIN. You want to put a mark there?

Mr. NEWMAN. [Indicating].

Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, what did you see that man do?

Mr. NEWMAN. He just ran down in here [indicating].

Mr. GRIFFIN. Did he seem to run down into the center or to one side or

what?

Mr. NEWMAN. From the angle I was looking, I couldn't tell.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, did you see that man--how that man was dressed?

Mr. NEWMAN. No.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you see that man emerge?

Mr. NEWMAN. No.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you see Jack Ruby move forward at Lee Oswald?

Mr. NEWMAN. No; I didn't.

Mr. GRIFFIN. As you were standing here, could you see the areaway here

[indicating]?

Mr. NEWMAN. I don't think I could because of the car that was parked

here. I don't recall seeing the area. I don't recall not seeing it. I

don't much think I could, though, because there was a car parked right

here [indicating].

Mr. GRIFFIN. All right. I am going to mark this in pencil. Is that

about where this car was [indicating]?

Mr. NEWMAN. I would say it was just about that location [indicating].

Mr. GRIFFIN. All right. And is the way we have got this drawn here at

this point, with the one pencil mark in there, the way the area from

here on up, all the way up to here and the whole building appeared at

the time Oswald was shot, from this spot [indicating]?

Mr. NEWMAN. That's the way it appeared to me.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Can you tell us anything about that area there

[indicating]?

Mr. NEWMAN. No. I do remember one thing, now, that was--some half hour

before that, where another automobile was parked, if you are interested.

Mr. GRIFFIN. Yes; I am.

Mr. NEWMAN. It was parked, I would say, approximately here. I will mark

this "second auto"; is that all right [indicating]?

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