The testimony of Louis D. Miller was taken at 3:55 p.m., on March 24,
1964, in the office of the U.S. attorney, 301 Post Office Building,
Bryan and Ervay Streets, Dallas, Tex., by Mr. Burt W. Griffin,
assistant counsel of the President's Commission.
Mr. GRIFFIN. I will swear you in, Mr. Miller.
Mr. MILLER. Before we do that, what are we doing here?
Mr. GRIFFIN. We are taking your deposition.
Mr. MILLER. I'd like to understand what we are doing here first.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, all right. I'll be happy to explain it to you. First
of all so that we can get the record straight, my name is Burt Griffin,
and I am a member of the advisory staff of the general counsel of the
President's Commission to investigate the assassination of President
Kennedy. And the Commission has been appointed under Executive Order
11130, issued November 29, 1963, by President Johnson, under joint
resolution of Congress No. 137, to investigate the facts surrounding
the assassination of President Kennedy and the subsequent violent death
of Lee Harvey Oswald, and the other circumstances that were attendant
on these two offenses. Now, I have been authorized, under the rules
of the Commission, to take your sworn deposition, and Chief Curry has
a copy of that authorization. I will be happy to show it to you if
you care to see it. Our particular interest in your testimony is to
determine what facts you know about the death of Lee Harvey Oswald,
but also to determine any other pertinent facts that you may know about
the general inquiry which the Commission is authorized to go into. Now,
you are here today because we have made a request from the General
Counsel on the Commission staff, and pursuant to the rules adopted by
the Commission, and we have made the request to Chief Curry. Now, you
are entitled to a 3-day written notice prior to having this deposition
taken, and if you would like that we would be happy to do that. We had
presumed that probably the police officers would prefer to have the
notice waived. You are also entitled to have an attorney present during
this interrogation. Now, I have no objection in any way you want to
handle this. I want you to be perfectly frank in telling us, because we
have gone ahead, as I said, simply on the assumption that you probably
would prefer to waive these matters, but if you would like to have
the written notice and would like to have a copy of the authorizing
resolution, or would like to have an attorney present during this
deposition we would be happy----
Mr. MILLER. No; I just want to understand what is going on.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, do you have any question that you want to ask me
about it? I have given you a general statement here.
Mr. MILLER. What will this deposition be used for?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, this deposition will be made a part of the
Commission's files. It will not be turned over to any member of the
police department. These files will remain in the possession of the
Commission, and on the basis of all of the investigation which we are
conducting here, why, there will be a report written. Now, I can't tell
you what is going to happen to the files after--and that means this
deposition--after the Commission issues its report. I would like to be
able to give you the assurance that it will be impossible for anybody
to ever see this deposition. I can't, in honesty, tell you that,
because I don't know that that is true. On the other hand, I don't know
that it is not true, but basically, it will be used to write a report,
and your testimony that you would give would be one of probably close
to 250, maybe 500 depositions that are going to be taken during this
period. I think 500 might be a pretty fair estimate, together with
thousands, and probably approaching ten thousand pages of investigative
reports and other documents also in addition to all these investigative
reports. That is where it is all going to wind up. But, I can assure
you of this: That no copies of this are going to be turned over to any
member of the police department or any official of the State of Texas
as such. Now, whether or not the thing will be accessible because they
are all deposited in the archives, and years from now somebody could go
and look at them, I don't know the answers to that.
Mr. MILLER. Well, is what you want from me a statement of what happened
down there? Is that what you are getting at?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Yes; but let me tell you this, too, that if you feel that
you would prefer to talk about this thing off the record and that you
think you would have important information to give us that you prefer
to be kept--to have some assurances that your confidences would be kept
completely, I would be happy to defer this deposition and do it in such
a way that no one would know the reason for it, and I would check with
our people in Washington to see if there weren't some arrangements
which could be made for it, because we are most concerned with getting
the truth, and as much information--I wasn't suggesting that you
wouldn't tell the truth, that we all know, and I would appreciate if
there were better circumstances under which we could do this. I would
inquire into it and I would make this a matter of complete confidence
between us.
Mr. MILLER. Well, there is nothing that I know that possibly a hundred
other people don't know, so, that part don't bother me, but I don't
understand coming down and giving a statement, that I am supposed to
stand, and swearing, and all that part of it.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, this is just as--I am sure you have testified before
grand juries.
Mr. MILLER. I sure have.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Of course, you have been sworn when you testified there.
Only they don't have a court reporter in the grand jury. I don't know
about Texas, but in Ohio we don't have a court reporter present. I do
have the feeling in talking to you that maybe you would like to do this
under some other circumstances, and I would be happy to explore this.
Mr. MILLER. I understand that you want a statement from me.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, I am going to examine you.
Mr. MILLER. And I'll be more than glad to tell anything I know about
it, but I don't understand swearing in. This is not a court.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Not a court in the sense that anybody is on trial, but it
is a--let me explain this to you, that we have authority to administer
the oath, and we have authority to punish for all consequences in
violation of the oath. The contempt provision of the Federal Code
applies to this proceeding. We also have authority--I don't have this
authority personally, but there is a provision granted that we can
grant immunity from prosecution. If you feel that there will be some
evidence that you wouldn't want to give for one reason or another, we
have authority to grant immunity from prosecution. I don't have that
authority here, but--and I do want to make it clear that you can have
a right to have an attorney present, and many of the witnesses do
have attorneys. Now, on the other extreme, if you would like to have
a public hearing, we will open the hearing up to the public, but we
haven't done it as a matter of routine except upon request, because we
thought that most people prefer not to have it conducted in public, but
that has been done, and we can do that.
Mr. MILLER. I still don't understand the reason of it. Are you going to
use this thing to try to prosecute me?
Mr. GRIFFIN. No.
Mr. MILLER. What are you going to use it for?
Mr. GRIFFIN. We have no authority to prosecute anyone except for
perjury before the Commission. Now, we--our instructions are--let me
get a copy of the resolutions. Let me suggest that we handle it this
way. I have got a copy here of the resolutions, Executive order signed
by President Johnson, and the joint resolutions of Congress. The rules
of the Commission and a memorandum dated March 20, 1964, from Mr.
Rankin, who is the General Counsel of the Commission authorizing Mr.
Hubert and me to administer your oath and take your deposition. Now,
I think that what I prefer to do here so that you can be sure what
you want to do, and I don't want to put you under any pressure. Now,
I would like to give you this and have you try to find another room
out here and look at this, and read it over, and think about this and
ponder it as long as you want, and I want to give you assurance that
I am going to call another--I am going to call Officer Montgomery in
here and proceed with him. I am not going to tell him that I have not
completed your deposition or anything like that. I want to be sure that
as far as anybody is concerned whatsoever, what has transpired here is
completely routine so that any decision you make, I can give you as
much assurance as possible----
Mr. MILLER. All I wanted to know is the purpose of the thing.