Mrs. PAINE. Let's just move that across there. She was standing here
facing south.
Mr. JENNER. She was facing you?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes, she was.
Mr. JENNER. And the witness is now about a foot in from the north end
of the work bench and to, necessarily, the east work bench.
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. She was standing there facing and looking at you?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; she was.
Mr. JENNER. And you in turn--your back was to the overhead garage door,
which was in place?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. And you were facing north?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes--I translated the question, asking Marina if she
knew if Lee had a rifle, and she said, "Yes"--she had seen some time
previously--seen a rifle which she knew to be his in this roll, which
she indicated the blanket roll.
Mr. JENNER. When she said that, did she point to the blanket roll?
Mrs. PAINE. She indicated to me in her language. My best recollection
is that she did not point, so that I was the one who knew and then
translated.
Mr. JENNER. Now, she said she had seen a rifle in the blanket wrapped
package?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Which you had already noticed some time prior thereto?
Mrs. PAINE. And as she described this, I stepped onto the blanket.
Mr. JENNER. The wrapped package?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; and then translated to the police officers what she
had said.
Mr. JENNER. And when you stepped on the blanket wrapped package, did
you feel anything hard?
Mrs. PAINE. It seemed to me there was something hard in it.
Mr. JENNER. At that time when you stepped on it?
Mrs. PAINE. At that time.
Mr. JENNER. Did it seem like something hard in the sense of a rifle or
a tent pole or anything as bulky as that?
Mrs. PAINE. I think I would say nothing as irregular as a rifle.
Mr. JENNER. In any event, as I recall your testimony, one of the
policemen stooped down and picked up the blanket wrapped package about
in its center, having in mind its length?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. And when he did that, did the blanket remain firm and
horizontal?
Mrs. PAINE. It wilted.
Mr. JENNER. It drooped?
Mrs. PAINE. It folded.
Mr. JENNER. It just folded, and from that you concluded there was
nothing in the package?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. In the blanket?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. Is it your recollection that the four string wrappings were
still on the blanket?
Mrs. PAINE. That's my recollection.
Mr. JENNER. And you heard no crinkling of paper or otherwise?
Mrs. PAINE. No; I didn't.
Mr. JENNER. Now, Mrs. Paine, you testified last week before the
Commission that you keep a supply of wrapping paper?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Where do you normally keep it?
Mrs. PAINE. (At this point the witness, Mrs. Paine, left the area of
the garage and returned to the kitchen-dining room area.) I keep it as
I explained at the Commission hearings, in the bottom drawer of a large
secretary desk in the dining area.
Mr. JENNER. And you have just leaned down and taken a tube of what
looks like wrapping paper from that drawer, have you not?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; I have.
Mr. JENNER. And, is that the remains of the tube of wrapping paper that
you had in your home on November 22, 1963?
Mrs. PAINE. No, this is a new one, similar to the old one.
Mr. JENNER. Did you purchase it at the same place that you purchased
the previous wrapping paper?
Mrs. PAINE. I purchased the rolls at some dime store.
Mr. JENNER. Mr. Howlett, would you measure that wrapping paper?
Agent HOWLETT. It is 2 feet 6 inches.
Mr. JENNER. Now, would I have your permission to take about a yard of
this?
Mrs. PAINE. Take all you want.
Mr. JENNER. I would like to take enough of it so I will get a sheet
that is longer than it is wide. What did you say it was wide?
Agent HOWLETT. Two feet 6 inches.
Mr. JENNER. All right, would you hold one end of that, Mr. Howlett,
please. We will now measure this.
Agent HOWLETT. That is 3 feet 1 inch.
Mr. JENNER. And now, Mrs. Paine, do you have a scissors, and would you
please cut this?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; I do.
(At this point the witness, Mrs. Paine, cut the paper referred to.)
Mr. JENNER. We will mark the sheet of wrapping paper which we have just
cut from a roll of wrapping paper as "Ruth Paine Exhibit No. 272."
Would you mark that, please, Miss Reporter?
(At this point the reporter marked the paper referred to as "Ruth Paine
Exhibit No. 272," for identification.)
Mr. JENNER. Mrs. Paine, all I have to say is that this paper is
startlingly like the wrapping paper that I exhibited to you in the
Commission hearing last week.
Mrs. PAINE. It is wrapping paper for mailing books and other such
articles.
Mr. JENNER. It is a good weight. You have, I notice, now in your hand,
some sealing tape or paper sticky tape, am I correct?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. From where did you obtain that?
Mrs. PAINE. From the same bottom drawer.
Mr. JENNER. Did you have a supply of that sticky tape in your home on
November 22, 1963?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; this is the remainder of that.
Mr. JENNER. This is the remainder of a roll you had at that time?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. Would you cut a slip of that for us?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Off the record.
Miss Reporter, would you mark the strip of sticky tape I now hand you
as "Ruth Paine Exhibit No. 273"?
(Paper referred to marked by the reporter as "Ruth Paine Exhibit No.
273," for identification.)
Mr. JENNER. Mrs. Paine, you now have that bottom drawer of your desk
secretary open, and I see the remains of a ball of string.
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Two balls of string, one dark brown string and one white
string?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. As I recall your testimony with respect to the wrappings on
this package--the string was white string and not the dark brown string?
Mrs. PAINE. That's my recollection.
Mr. JENNER. Does your now seeing the remains of the additional string
you have uncovered from the bottom drawer of your secretary serve to
refresh your recollection, even further, as to whether that was about
the weight of the string on the blanket wrapped package?
Mrs. PAINE. It looks rather thin to me, rather thinner than the string
on the package, sir.
Mr. JENNER. All right. We will take a sample of that, and that will be
marked "Ruth Paine Exhibit No. 274."
(String referred to marked by the reporter as "Ruth Paine Exhibit No.
274," for identification.)
Mr. JENNER. You also have something that is really rope in your hand
now. Did you obtain that from that drawer?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; I did.
Mr. JENNER. Would you say that was too heavy or heavier?
Mrs. PAINE. I would say it is heavier; yes.
Mr. JENNER. All right, we will not bother with that in the record.
Mrs. Paine, you recall your testimony with respect to what I called the
Mexico note.
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. I forget the Commission exhibit number, but that will
identify it. It is a note you found one Sunday morning.
Mrs. PAINE. That's right--having already noticed it but not having read
it the previous day.
Mr. JENNER. And, is this the secretary to which you made reference, the
desk secretary--the piece of furniture from which you have obtained the
wrapping paper, the sticky paper, and the string I latterly described?
Mrs. PAINE. No; it is not.
Mr. JENNER. Where is that desk secretary located?
Mrs. PAINE. That desk secretary is in the living room.
Mr. JENNER. Is the desk secretary in the position now as it was on that
Sunday morning?
Mrs. PAINE. No; it is not.
Mr. JENNER. Would you locate in your living room where that desk
secretary was, if it is not here?
Mrs. PAINE. It was in the middle of the space between the--the middle
of the north wall of the living room.
Mr. JENNER. Now, the north wall of the living room presently has a sofa
or a couch?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. I take it, therefore, that sofa or couch was not in that
position?
Mrs. PAINE. That sofa has exchanged places with the small desk
secretary.
Mr. JENNER. And the desk secretary is now on the east wall of your
living room; is that correct?
Mrs. PAINE. That's correct.
Mr. JENNER. Please tell me where the television set was on the
afternoon of the day--on the afternoon of November the 22d when the
police called at your home?
Mrs. PAINE. It was then where it is now.
Mr. JENNER. And it is now located against the south wall of the living
room between the picture window facing on Fifth Street and the doorway
entering into your home?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. Now, you testified as I recall, that you and Marina were
sitting on the sofa looking at television. Where was the sofa located
at that time?
Mrs. PAINE. On the 22d, the sofa was where it is now, as is true of all
the other furniture in the room.
Mr. JENNER. So, that, therefore, I conclude that from the time on the
Sunday morning that you looked at the Mexico note and made a copy of it
and November 22, you had rearranged your furniture?
Mrs. PAINE. I rearranged it on the evening of the 10th of
November--that same day that I read the note.
Mr. JENNER. That was a Sunday?
Mrs. PAINE. That was.
Mr. JENNER. And Lee Oswald and your husband, Michael, assisted you?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. As I recall your testimony was that before they began to
move the furniture at your request you saw the Mexico note on top of
the secretary and you put it in one of the drawers of the secretary?
Mrs. PAINE. I opened the flip front and put it in there.
Mr. JENNER. Consequently, on the afternoon of November 22, 1963, when
you were looking at television, you and Marina were facing out--facing
toward Fifth Street?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Were the drapes on your picture window which I see on the
south wall, drawn back?
Mrs. PAINE. They were not closed.
Mr. JENNER. They were not closed?
Mrs. PAINE. They were covering perhaps a foot of the window on each
side.
Mr. JENNER. Were you so intent, you and Marina, from looking at the
television that you did not notice the police come in to your door?
Mrs. PAINE. I think we could not have seen them coming to the door.
Mr. JENNER. Why not?
Mrs. PAINE. We were sitting here. I was in the middle of the sofa and
Marina was to the west.
Mr. JENNER. She was to your right?
Mrs. PAINE. That's right.
Mr. JENNER. And you say you could not have seen them?