Senator COOPER. What was the number of the photograph which you just
referred to?
Mr. JENNER. 438. 438 is view looking northeast showing the Paine home
at the left and the Randle home at the far right. Directing your
attention to Commission Exhibit 448, is that an accurate photograph
showing a view of the Randle home looking West Fifth Street?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Is Commission Exhibit 438 an accurate photograph showing a
view looking west along Fifth Street to your home?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes; it is.
Mr. JENNER. And is the arrow that appears on that photograph--does that
point to your home?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Is Commission Exhibit No. 450, which I now show you, an
accurate photograph of the intersection of Westbrook Drive and West
Fifth Street viewed from immediately outside the Randle kitchen window?
Mrs. PAINE. It looks to be exactly that.
Mr. JENNER. I now show you Commission Exhibit No. 440 entitled "Paine
and Randle homes, Irving, Tex." which purports to be, and I believe is,
a scale drawing of the area in Irving, Tex., along West Fifth Street
and Westbrook Drive, in which your home at 2515 West Fifth Street is
shown in outline, and the location and form of the Randle home down the
street and on the corner is likewise shown.
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Is that accurate?
Mrs. PAINE. That is accurate.
Senator COOPER. Are you going to make part of the record these exhibits
which she has identified?
Mr. JENNER. Yes; I am about to offer these and I would ask Mr. Redlich
if he would assemble the exhibit numbers so I can make the offer,
please.
Mrs. Paine, now that you have had a rest over night, we would like to
return to the late afternoon and the evening of November 21. Did Lee
Harvey Oswald come to Irving, Tex., at anytime that day?
Mrs. PAINE. He came some time shortly before 5:30 in the evening on the
21st.
Mr. JENNER. Had either you or Marina, I limit it to you first, had you
had any notice or intimation whatsoever that Lee Harvey Oswald would
appear on that day?
Mrs. PAINE. Absolutely none.
Mr. JENNER. And his appearance was a complete surprise to you?
Mrs. PAINE. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. Did anything occur during the day or during that week up to
the time that you saw Lee Harvey Oswald that afternoon that impressed
you or led you to believe that Marina had any notion whatsoever that
her husband would or might appear at your home on that day?
Mrs. PAINE. Nothing. I rather had the contrary impressions.
Mr. JENNER. Now, what was your first notice, what was the circumstances
that brought your attention to the fact that Lee Harvey Oswald was in
Irving, Tex., that afternoon.
Mrs. PAINE. I arrived home from the grocery store in my car and saw he
was on the front lawn at my house.
Mr. JENNER. You had had no word whatsoever from anybody prior to that
moment?
Mrs. PAINE. No word whatsoever.
Mr. JENNER. Now where was he? And we may use the exhibits we have just
identified. Mr. Chairman, I offer in evidence the photographs and the
floor plans and the area outlines the witness has just identified and
testified about as they are Commission Exhibit Nos. 429 through 448
both inclusive, and 450 and 452.
Senator COOPER. The exhibits offered will be received in evidence.
(Commission Exhibits Nos. 429 through 448 both inclusive, and 450 and
452 were received in evidence.)
The CHAIRMAN. Senator Cooper, at this time I am obliged to leave for
our all-day conference on Friday at the Supreme Court, and I may be
back later in the day, but if I don't, you continue, of course.
Senator COOPER. I will this morning. If I can't be here this afternoon,
whom do you want to preside?
The CHAIRMAN. Congressman Ford, would you be here this afternoon at all?
Representative FORD. Unfortunately Mr. McCloy and I have to go to a
conference out of town.
The CHAIRMAN. You are both going out of town, aren't you?
Senator COOPER. I can go and come back if it is necessary.
The CHAIRMAN. I will try to be here myself. Will Mr. Dulles be here?
Mr. McCLOY. He is out of town.
The CHAIRMAN. If you should not finish, Mr. Jenner, will you phone me
at the Court and I will try to suspend my own conference over there and
come over.
Senator COOPER. I will be here anyway all morning and will try to come
back this afternoon.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much. Mrs. Paine, I want to thank you for
coming and for being so patient with our long questioning.
Mrs. PAINE. I am glad to do what I can.
The CHAIRMAN. You know that it is necessary.
Mrs. PAINE. Indeed.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.
Mr. JENNER. You might use the ruler, and I have set the floor plan and
the area plan of your home, Mrs. Paine, Exhibit 430, on the blackboard.
As you testify, it might be helpful to point to those areas. Now in
which direction were you coming?
Mrs. PAINE. I was coming from the east.
Mr. JENNER. From the east?
Mrs. PAINE. Along West Fifth.
Mr. JENNER. You were going west. Your home is on the right-hand side.
Mrs. PAINE. That is right.
Mr. JENNER. When did you first sight, where were you when you first saw
Lee in your courtyard?
Mrs. PAINE. Just past the corner of Westbrook and Fifth.
Mr. JENNER. That area is open from that point to your home; is it?
Mrs. PAINE. The area of the front yard; yes.
Mr. JENNER. Your home is well set back from the street or sidewalk?
Mrs. PAINE. Moderately set back.
Mr. JENNER. What would you judge that distance to be?
Mrs. PAINE. Two car lengths from the opening of the garage to the
sidewalk.
Mr. JENNER. Now where was Lee Oswald when you first saw him?
Mrs. PAINE. He was on the grass just to the east of the driveway.
Mr. JENNER. Near the driveway just to the east, but he was out in front
of your home?
Mrs. PAINE. That is correct.
Mr. JENNER. What did you do then? You proceeded down the street?
Mrs. PAINE. I parked my car, yes; parked my car in its usual position
in the driveway.
Mr. JENNER. In your driveway?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Up close to the garage opening?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. And that left you then, you were on the left side or the
driving side of your automobile. You got out, did you?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Which way? Did you get out to your left or did you swing
across the seat and get out at the right hand door?
Mrs. PAINE. I got out on the driver's side, on the left.
Mr. JENNER. Then what did you do? First tell us what you did. Did you
go into your home directly? Did you walk around?
Mrs. PAINE. No. I greeted Lee and Marina, who were both on the front
lawn.
Mr. JENNER. Was their daughter June out in front as well?
Mrs. PAINE. Their daughter June was out in front. It was warm. Lee was
playing with June.
Mr. JENNER. How was he attired?
Mrs. PAINE. I don't recall specifically.
Mr. JENNER. You said that he normally wore a T-shirt.
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. Was he in a T-shirt or shirt?
Mrs. PAINE. I'd be fairly certain he didn't have a jacket on, but that
whatever it was was tucked in.
Mr. JENNER. Do you remember the color of his trousers?
Mrs. PAINE. No.
Mr. JENNER. Now at that point you were surprised to see him?
Mrs. PAINE. I was.
Mr. JENNER. What did you say to him?
Mrs. PAINE. I don't recall.
Mr. JENNER. But you do recall greeting him?
Mrs. PAINE. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. You don't recall that you evidenced any surprise that he
was there?
Mrs. PAINE. Oh, I think I did.
Mr. JENNER. Had there ever been an occasion prior thereto that he had
appeared at your home without prior notice to you and permission from
you for him to appear?
Mrs. PAINE. There had been no such occasion. He had always asked
permission prior to coming.
Mr. JENNER. And there never had been an exception to that up to this
moment?
Mrs. PAINE. No exception.
Mr. JENNER. May we have the time again? You say it was late in the
afternoon, but can you fix the time a little more?
Mrs. PAINE. It was getting on toward 5:30.
Mr. JENNER. Did you tarry and talk with Lee and Marina?
Mrs. PAINE. I remember only that Marina and I were still on the grass
at the entryway to the house when she spoke of her embarrassment to me
in an aside, that is to say, not in Lee's hearing, that she was sorry
he hadn't called ahead and asked if that was all right. And I said
"Why, that is all right."
Mr. JENNER. Nothing was said by her as to why he had come out?
Mrs. PAINE. Nothing.