Mr. LANE. I don't think I ever said that to the Commission.
Mr. RANKIN. You are saying it now, are you not?
Mr. LANE. Yes; I am saying it now.
Mr. RANKIN. And you are not willing to have the Commission have the
recording to check the accuracy of your report about what the testimony
or statement was, is that right?
Mr. LANE. I am not in a position to give you that document. I have said
that several times; yes, sir. I don't understand why it is not possible
to call Mrs. Markham and to call me and to have us confront each other.
I think clearly the Commission would then secure the facts. I would be
happy to participate in such a confrontation. It seems to me to be the
order----
The CHAIRMAN. Wouldn't you then be violating your attorney-client
privilege just the same?
Mr. LANE. No; I don't have such a privilege--a relationship at the
present time. That relationship terminated, as I said, in March.
The CHAIRMAN. Well, you would freely discuss, though, the things that
occurred while the attorney-client privilege did prevail, or did exist?
Mr. LANE. No; I would merely ask Mrs. Markham a series of questions.
The CHAIRMAN. Oh, yes; you would like to make the inquisition your own,
but you are unwilling to testify before this Commission.
Mr. LANE. I don't think that an effort to represent a man who is
being tried in absentia, after he was killed in the custody of
police officers, is the same as asking for permission to conduct an
inquisition, with all due respect to you, Mr. Chief Justice.
The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Lane, you have manifested a great interest in Lee
Harvey Oswald and his relationship to this entire affair. According to
you, Mrs. Markham made a statement that would bear upon the probability
of his guilt or innocence in connection with the assassination. Mrs
Markham has definitely contradicted what you have said, and do you
not believe that it is in your own interest and in the interests of
this country for you to give whatever corroboration you have to this
Commission so that we may determine whether you or she is telling the
truth?
Mr. LANE. I have given you all the information that I am permitted to
give to you and to members of the Commission. I understand from Mr.
Rankin that Mrs. Markham denies that she ever talked with me. Is that
correct?
The CHAIRMAN. You needn't ask Mr. Rankin any questions. You won't
answer the questions of this Commission, and he is not under
examination by you at the present time.
Mr. LANE. I have answered questions. I spoke for about 85 pages,
without a single question being put to me, because I was anxious to
give to this Commission all the information in my possession.
The CHAIRMAN. Yes, but you did not give us all the information. You did
not tell us that you had a recording of what Mrs. Markham said to you.
Now, we ask you for verification of that conversation, because she has
contradicted you. You say that you have a recording, but you refuse to
give it to this Commission.
Mr. LANE. I am not in a position to give you that recording. I have
made that quite plain. Because of a matter which has arisen in the last
3 or 4 days, which I was made aware of yesterday for the first time, I
am not in a position to do that. Hopefully, I will be in a day or two.
The CHAIRMAN. We heard that when you were here in March--hopefully you
would be able to tell us who this informant of yours was in Dallas
concerning the so-called meeting between Jack Ruby and others in his
nightclub. And we have been pursuing you ever since with letters and
entreaties to give us that information so that we might verify what
you have said, if it is a fact, or disproving it if it is not a fact.
Here we pay your expenses from Europe, bring you over here, and without
telling us at all that you won't answer that question, you come before
the Commission and refuse to testify. Do you consider that cooperation?
Mr. LANE. Mr. Chief Justice, I believe I am the only citizen in this
country who has devoted 6 months to securing information at his own
expense. You talk about what it cost to go to Europe. I have gone to
Europe twice, and I have paid for those trips myself. I have traveled
all over this country. I have gone to Dallas five times. I have paid
for those trips myself, and I am not in a position financially to do
that, but I have done that to give you this information.
The CHAIRMAN. Were you getting evidence over in Europe?
Mr. LANE. No; I was discussing this case, because of the suppression
in this country of the facts. I felt it important that somehow the
American people be informed about what is taking place, and I found
that practically the only way to inform the American people is to speak
in Europe.
The CHAIRMAN. Have you charged admission for any of your speaking?
Mr. LANE. Have I charged admission?
The CHAIRMAN. Yes.
Mr. LANE. No; I have not charged admission.
The CHAIRMAN. Do you collect any money in this country at the speeches
that you made?
Mr. LANE. Did I, personally, collect any money?
The CHAIRMAN. Did you have money collected?
Mr. LANE. I collected no money.
The CHAIRMAN. Did you have any money collected?
Mr. LANE. I did not.
The CHAIRMAN. Was there money collected at that meeting--at those
meetings that you had?
Mr. LANE. I spoke at probably 40 different college campuses throughout
the United States.
The CHAIRMAN. Was money collected at those places?
Mr. LANE. To my knowledge, at none of those meetings was money
collected. At one or two or perhaps three other meetings, funds have
been collected for the purpose of paying the salary of the secretary of
this citizens committee of inquiry, and to pay the rent.
The CHAIRMAN. Who got the money?
Mr. LANE. The citizens committee of inquiry.
The CHAIRMAN. Who is the head of that?
Mr. LANE. I am the chairman of that.
The CHAIRMAN. Who else belongs to it?
Mr. LANE. Among others, Jessica Mitford, who is the author who wrote
"The American Way of Death," a best-selling book; Sterling Hayden, who
is an actor; a number of attorneys, some in California, some in New
York; and a number of others. I did not know that I was going to be
questioned about the makeup of the citizens committee. Otherwise, I
would have brought the entire membership list.
The CHAIRMAN. I didn't intend to ask you, but we are trying to get
information about these different things that you considered vital
in the assassination of the President. And it is a matter of great
concern to the Commission that you are unwilling to tell us about those
things that you considered bear upon the guilt or innocence of Lee
Harvey Oswald. And it handicaps us greatly in what we are trying to
do, because of the things that you do say when you are away from the
Commission, and then when you refuse to testify before us as to those
very things that you discuss in public.
Mr. LANE. I have not said anything in public, Mr. Chief Justice, that I
have not said first before this Commission, or at one time before this
Commission.
The CHAIRMAN. But, before your audiences, do you not claim to be
telling the truth and to be verifying the things that you tell them,
and then when you come here you refuse to give us the verification?
Mr. LANE. When I speak before an audience, I do hold myself out to be
telling the truth, just as when I have testified before this Commission
I have also told the truth.
Mr. RANKIN. Mr. Lane, you expressed a desire in your telegram to
examine the rifle. We have that here for you to see. Let the record
show that at this time the Commission is giving Mr. Lane an opportunity
to examine the rifle known as Commission Exhibit No. 139.
Mr. LANE. Thank you. May I comment upon the examination?
The CHAIRMAN. Yes; you may; if you saw anything of any significance
there, you may state it.
Mr. LANE. Yes. I would like to call to the attention of the Commission
the affidavit signed by a police officer, Seymour Weitzman, dated the
23d day of November 1963, the original of which was at one time in the
office of the district attorney of Dallas. In that document, Officer
Weitzman states he found, along with another person--a deputy sheriff,
I believe, or a deputy of some sort--the alleged murder weapon, on the
22d day of November 1963, on the sixth floor of the Book Depository
Building.
And in that affidavit Mr. Weitzman--Officer Weitzman--swears that the
murder weapon which he found, or the weapon which he found on that
floor, was a Mauser 7.65 millimeters. A Mauser, of course, is a German
weapon. The rifle which is before the Commission, and which is, I
assume, allegedly now the murder weapon, is, of course, not a German
Mauser 7.65 millimeters, but is an Italian carbine, 6.5 millimeters.
Although I am personally not a rifle expert, I was able to determine
that it was an Italian carbine because printed indelibly upon it
are the words "Made Italy" and "caliber 6.5." I suggest it is very
difficult for a police officer to pick up a weapon which has printed
upon it clearly in English "Made Italy, Cal 6.5," and then the next day
draft an affidavit stating that that was in fact a German Mauser, 7.65
millimeters.
The CHAIRMAN. Very well. Anything further? We will take a short recess,
then.
(Brief recess.)
The CHAIRMAN. Gentlemen, the Commission will come to order. There is
nothing further at this time. The meeting is adjourned.
(Whereupon, at 3:20 p.m., the President's Commission recessed.)