Mr. RANKIN. So you think it had to be sometime between April 10 and
April 24?
Mrs. OSWALD. This may be 10 days or more. I think it was closer to the
time when my husband left for New Orleans than it was to the incident
of General Walker. I think it was less than a week before my husband
left for New Orleans. I did not think up this incident with Nixon
myself.
Mr. RANKIN. What do you mean by that, Mrs. Oswald?
Mrs. OSWALD. I had forgotten entirely about the incident with Vice
President Nixon when I was here the first time. When you asked me the
questions about it, then I remembered it. I wasn't trying to deceive
you the first time.
Mr. RANKIN. What did your husband say that day about Richard Nixon,
when he got this gun and dressed up. Did he tell you anything about him?
Mrs. OSWALD. No; I just didn't know what to do, you know.
Mr. RANKIN. How did you know he was interested in doing something about
Mr. Nixon at that time?
Mrs. OSWALD. My husband just said that Nixon is coming to Dallas.
Mr. RANKIN. Then what did you do?
Mrs. OSWALD. First I didn't know what to do. I wanted to prevent him
from going out.
Mr. RANKIN. Did you say anything to him?
Mrs. OSWALD. I called him into the bathroom and I closed the door and I
wanted to prevent him and then I started to cry. And I told him that he
shouldn't do this, that he had promised me.
Mr. RANKIN. Are you referring to his promise to you that you described
in your prior testimony after the Walker incident?
Mrs. OSWALD. Yes; that was the promise.
Mr. RANKIN. Do you recall the bathroom, how the door closes? Does it
close into the bathroom on Neely Street or from the outside in?
Mrs. OSWALD. I don't remember now. I don't remember. I only remember
that it was something to do with the bathroom.
Mr. RANKIN. Did you lock him into the bathroom?
Mrs. OSWALD. I can't remember precisely.
Mr. RANKIN. Do you recall how the locks were on the bathroom door there?
Mrs. OSWALD. I can't recall. We had several apartments and I might be
confusing one apartment with the other.
Mr. RANKIN. Is it your testimony that you made it impossible for him to
get out if he wanted to?
Mrs. OSWALD. I don't remember.
Representative FORD. Did he try to get out of the bathroom?
Mrs. OSWALD. I remember that I held him. We actually struggled for
several minutes and then he quieted down. I remember that I told him
that if he goes out it would be better for him to kill me than to go
out.
Mr. DULLES. He is quite a big man and you are a small woman.
Mrs. OSWALD. No; he is not a big man. He is not strong.
Mr. DULLES. Well, he was 5 feet 9, and you are how tall?
Mrs. OSWALD. When he is very upset, my husband is very upset he is not
strong and when I want to and when I collect all my forces and want to
do something very badly I am stronger than he is.
Mr. DULLES. You meant mentally or physically?
Mrs. OSWALD. I am not strong but, you know, there is a certain balance
of forces between us.
Mr. DULLES. Do you think it was persuasion, your persuasion of him or
the physical force or both that prevented him from going?
Mrs. OSWALD. I don't think it was physically, physical prevention
because if he--I couldn't keep him from going out if he really wanted
to. It might have been that he was just trying to test me. He was the
kind of person who could try and wound somebody in that way. Possibly
he didn't want to go out at all but was just doing this all as a sort
of joke, not really as a joke but rather to simply wound me, to make me
feel bad.
Mr. McKENZIE. Mr. Rankin, if I may interpose here for a moment. Mrs.
Oswald has been interrogated at length by the FBI in connection with
this particular incident--the Nixon incident. I feel confident that the
FBI has made a written report insofar as her testimony is concerned in
their interrogation, but for purposes of the record I have no objection
whatsoever for the FBI report to be included in the record as part of
the record.
Mr. RANKIN. Thank you, Mr. McKenzie. We will incorporate those reports
as a part of the record in regard to this incident, if that is
agreeable to the Commission.
Mr. McKENZIE. The reason I say that is because of the fact that those
interrogations were conducted at an earlier date and closer to the
actual incident, the state of time to the actual incidents than her
interrogation here today, and insofar as dates are concerned I think
that her mind would be clearer on those dates, and I likewise know that
at that time a Russian interpreter was there.
Mr. RANKIN. Mr. McKenzie, I think with the members of the Commission
here that I want to ask a number of questions about this incident
because of its importance so they can observe the witness as well as
have the benefit of her testimony.
Mr. McKENZIE. Mr. Rankin, in no way am I suggesting otherwise but if it
would help the Commission in evaluating her testimony and evaluating
the evidence that it has had heretofore in prior testimony we have no
objection to those reports being a part of the record in any way.
Mr. RANKIN. Thank you.
Mrs. OSWALD. I might be mistaken about some of the details of this
incident but it is very definite he got dressed, took a gun, and then
didn't go out. The reason why there might be some confusion in my mind
about the details because it happened in other apartments in which we
lived that we quarreled and then I would shut him in the bathroom, and
in this particular case it may not have happened quite that way, but
there is no doubt that he got dressed and had a gun.
Mr. RANKIN. Do you remember what you said to him and what he said to
you at that time?
Mrs. OSWALD. I don't remember now but I told the FBI precisely.
Mr. RANKIN. And were your reports to the FBI in regard to this incident
accurate, truthful, and correct?
Mrs. OSWALD. They were correct as far as I could remember. The only
detail as far as my memory served me--the only detail which might be
confused is the one with the bathroom.
Mr. RANKIN. Had your husband said anything before or did he say
anything at that time in regard to Mr. Nixon showing any hostility,
friendship, or anything else?
Mrs. OSWALD. Showing any hostility or friendship toward Mr. Nixon?
Mr. RANKIN. Yes; toward Nixon.
Mrs. OSWALD. I don't remember him saying anything--I don't remember but
he didn't tell me. I don't remember him saying anything of that sort. I
only remember the next day he told me that Nixon did not come. Excuse
me.
Mr. RANKIN. Yes.
Mrs. OSWALD. The FBI suggested that possibly I was confused between
Johnson and Nixon but there is no question that in this incident it was
a question of Mr. Nixon. I remember distinctly the name Nixon because
I read from the presidential elections that there was a choice between
President Kennedy and Mr. Nixon.
Representative FORD. Where did your husband get the pistol that
morning; do you remember?
Mrs. OSWALD. What, where?
Representative FORD. Where.
Mrs. OSWALD. My husband had a small room where he kept all that sort of
thing. It is a little larger than a closet.
Representative FORD. Did you see him go in and get the pistol?
Mrs. OSWALD. I didn't see him go into the room. I only saw him standing
before the open door and putting the pistol in his pocket.
Representative FORD. Do you recall which pocket he put the pistol in?
Mrs. OSWALD. It was not in a pocket. He put it in his belt.
(Discussion off the record.)
Mr. DULLES. Had you and your husband ever discussed Mr. Nixon at a
previous, at any previous time?
Mrs. OSWALD. No. No.
Mr. RANKIN. What else happened about this incident beyond what you have
told us?
Mrs. OSWALD. He took off his suit and stayed home all day reading a
book. He gave me the pistol and I hid it under the mattress.
Mr. RANKIN. Did you say anything more than you have told us to him
about this matter at that time?
Mrs. OSWALD. I closed the front door to the building that day and when
we were quarreling about--when we were struggling over the question of
whether or not he should go out I said a great deal to him.
Mr. RANKIN. What did you say to him then?
Mrs. OSWALD. I don't remember.
Mr. RANKIN. Just tell us in substance?
Mrs. OSWALD. I really don't remember now. I only remember that I told
him that I am sorry of all these pranks of his and especially after the
one with General Walker, and he had promised me, I told him that he had
promised me----
Mr. RANKIN. Did he say anything in answer to that?
Mrs. OSWALD. I don't remember.
Mr. DULLES. As I recall, in your previous testimony there was some
indication that you had said that if he did the Walker type of thing
again you would notify the authorities. Did that conversation come up
at this time with your husband?
Mrs. OSWALD. Yes; I said that. But he didn't go at that time and after
all he was my husband.
Mr. DULLES. Does--do you mean you said it again at the time of the
Nixon incident?
Mrs. OSWALD. Yes; I told him that but you must understand that I don't
speak English very well, and for that reason I used to keep a piece of
paper with me, and I had it, you know, what piece of paper I am talking
about. At that time I didn't know how to go in police station: I don't
know where it was.
Mr. McKENZIE. Was that the passport?