The title of the bill on spirituous liquors being read, was postponed:
then the preamble was read, importing, "that whereas great
difficulties and inconveniencies had attended the putting the act 9
Geo. II. in execution, and the same had not been found effectual to
answer the purposes intended," the commons being desirous to raise the
necessary supplies in the easiest manner, do grant the rates on
spirituous liquors, hereafter mentioned, and repeal the present rates.
Lord HERVEY spoke to the effect following:--My lords, notwithstanding
the specious arguments which were used to influence the house to
permit this bill to escape the censure it deserved, and be admitted to
a farther examination in a committee, I am still confident that
nothing can justly be offered in its defence; and am not afraid to
declare my opinion, that it is not approved even by those who
vindicate it; of whom I cannot but believe, from long experience of
their judgment and their knowledge, that they consider it only as an
_easy manner_ of raising money, as an expedient rather necessary than
eligible, and such as only the exigencies of the government could have
prevailed upon them to propose; for nothing is more evident, than that
it cannot answer the purposes of the former bill.
This, however harsh it may appear, and however inconsistent with that
delicacy with which the debates of this august assembly have generally
been carried on, must surely be pardoned on this occasion, if for no
other reason, at least for this, that it is not easy to forbear it, it
is impossible wholly to suppress it in the mind; and to forbear to
speak what cannot but be thought, is no part of the duty of a publick
counsellor.
The conduct of those whose station subjects them to the resentment of
the ministry, or who may be reasonably imagined to expect favours from
them, has, throughout all our deliberations on this bill, been such as
evidently discovers their only care to be the imposition of a new tax,
and the establishment of a new fund. They do not seem to urge
seriously any other argument than the necessity of raising money, or
to oppose the objections that have been offered, for any other reason,
than because they have a tendency to obstruct the supplies.
No other argument can, indeed, be urged in vindication of a bill which
every principle of policy or justice must incite us to condemn; a bill
by which the sense of morality and religion will be extinguished, and
the restraints, of law made ineffectual; by which the labourer and
manufacturer will be at once debilitated and corrupted, and by which
the roads will be filled with thieves, and the streets with beggars.
It appears, my lords, from the papers on the table, that seven
millions of gallons are every year distilled; and experience shows us,
that the quality of the liquor is such, that a quarter of a pint is
sufficient to intoxicate the brain. Upon this computation, my lords,
it is reasonable to believe, that a twentieth part of the labouring
hands of this nation are detained from their proper occupations by
this kind of drunkenness; and, consequently, that a twentieth part of
the trade is every year lost, or, perhaps, a twentieth part of our
people every year hurried to the grave, or disabled from contributing
to the publick good.
These, my lords, are no doubtful facts, or conjectural calculations,
they are confirmed by the most incontestable evidence, and established
by all the demonstration of arithmetick; and therefore your lordships
are in no danger of errour from either ignorance or uncertainty, but
must determine, if you approve this bill, in opposition to all the
powers of conviction, and must set aside testimony and reason at the
same time.
These facts, my lords, are so plain, that the warmest advocates for
the bill have tacitly acknowledged them, by proposing that, if it be
found ineffectual, it shall be amended in the next session. What
effect this proposal may have upon others, I know not; but for my
part, I shall never think it allowable to sport with the prosperity of
the publick, or to try experiments by which, if they fail, the lives
of thousands must be destroyed.
Such a scheme, my lords, very ill becomes those to whom their
ancestors have transmitted the illustrious character of guardians of
the people; for surely such cruelty was never practised by the utmost
wantonness of tyranny, or the most savage rage of invasion. No man
ever before conceived the design of scattering poison for a certain
period of time among the people, only to try what havock it would
make.
What will be the effects of unrestrained and licensed debauchery may
be known, without the guilt of so dreadful an experiment, only by
observing the present conduct of the people, even while they are
hindered from the full enjoyment of their pleasures, by the terrours
of a penal law. Whoever shall be so far touched with the interest of
the publick, as to extend his inquiries to the lowest classes of the
people, will find some diseased, and others vitiated; he will find
some imprisoned by their creditors, and others starving their
children; and if he traces all these calamities and crimes to their
original cause, will find them all to proceed from the love of
distilled liquors.
I know, my lords, that in answer to all these expostulations, and a
thousand more, it will be urged by the ministers and their friends,
that there is no other method to be found of raising the supplies, and
that the demands of the government must be satisfied at whatever rate,
and by whatever means.
Though I am very far from approving this assertion, I do not wonder at
its prevalence among those who are enriched by every tax, and whose
only claim to the preferments which they enjoy arises from their
readiness to concur in every scheme for increasing the burdens of the
publick; and, therefore, shall never expect their approbation of any
proposal, by which a new tax may be retarded. Yet I cannot but declare
that, in my opinion, we ought to suspend our proceedings, that the
commons may discover what danger their negligence, precipitation, or
blind compliance, has brought upon the nation; and that the people
may, by so signal a proof of our disapprobation, be alarmed against
any attempt of the same kind under any future administration.
This, my lords, will be considered, not only by posterity, but by all
the wise and honest men of the present time, as a proof of our regard
for virtue, and our attention to the publick welfare. This conduct
will be secretly approved, even by those who may think themselves
obliged to oppose it in publick; and, as it will be moderate and
decent, may probably preserve the nation without irritating the other
house.
I therefore move, my lords, that instead of proceeding in the
superfluous forms of a committee, we should resume the house, and
endeavour to obtain farther information.
After a short silence, lord CHOLMONDELEY spoke to this effect:--My
lords, the observations which, though sufficiently explained and
enforced in the late debate, the noble lord has been pleased to repeat
on this occasion, are in themselves, indeed, sufficiently pertinent,
and have been urged by his lordship with uncommon spirit and elegance;
but he ought to have reflected, that general declamations are improper
in a committee, where the particular clauses of the bill are to be
separately considered.
I propose, therefore, that instead of wasting that time, of which the
exigencies of the publick now require an uncommon frugality, in
useless rhetorick, and untimely vehemence, we should proceed to
examine in order the distinct paragraphs of this bill, by which it may
more easily appear, whether it ought to be rejected or approved.
It cannot, indeed, be proposed, that any of the clauses shall be
amended in this committee; for the claims of the commons, and the
obstinacy with which they have always adhered to them, on whatever
they are founded, is well known. I am old enough to remember the
animosities which have arisen between the two houses, from attempts to
adjust this part of their pretensions; animosities which at this time
may be not only dangerous to ourselves, but fatal to a great part of
mankind, and which it ought, therefore, to be our utmost care not to
excite.
Lord AYLESFORD:--My lords, though the consideration of the distinct
paragraphs of the bill be, as the noble lord has very justly observed,
the proper business of the committee; yet since, as he has likewise
observed, the present state of our affairs requires unusual
expedition, I think we may very properly spare ourselves the trouble
of considering paragraphs which we cannot amend; and which are in
themselves so clear and so obvious, that they may be understood in
their full extent upon a cursory perusal.
But, my lords, though I think it not proper to follow our usual method
of considering the paragraphs distinctly, which can only drive the
bill forward towards the third reading, as it has already been forced
into the committee; yet I think it not necessary to irritate the other
house, alarm our allies, or encourage our enemies, by rejecting that
bill by which it is intended that the supplies shall be raised. There
is an easy and moderate method, by which the same end may be attained
without any disturbance of the publick, any impediment of the schemes
of the government, or any just offence to the commons.
Instead of passing or rejecting this bill, of which the first is
absolutely criminal, and the second perhaps improper, let us only
delay it, by which we shall give the commons time to reflect upon it,
to reexamine it, and discover, what they, perhaps, have not hitherto
suspected, its destructive tendency. Nor can it be doubted, but the
observations which will arise from the necessity of inquiring into the
reasons of our conduct, will soon induce them to form another bill,
not liable to the same objections; I, therefore, second the noble
lord's motion to resume the house.
Lord ISLAY:--My lords, if we consider the pretensions of the commons,
and the stubbornness with which they have hitherto adhered to them, we
shall easily find the impropriety of the noble lord's motion, and
foresee the inefficacy of the methods which he so warmly recommends.
The alarm which he supposes us to give the commons by postponing the
bill before us, the observations which they will make upon our
conduct, the new informations which they will receive, and the new
bill which they will send, are merely imaginary. They will not
consider themselves as concerned in the delay or expedition of our
procedure, but will suppose us to act upon our own reasons, which it
is not necessary for them to examine, and will by no means send
another bill for supplies, till they are informed that this is
rejected.
Thus, my lords, we shall only retard the supplies, without altering,
or being able to alter, the method of raising them; and at last pass
that bill, without examination, which we now neglect to examine, lest
we should pass it; or, perhaps, irritate the commons by the novelty of
our conduct, which, if they should resolve to consider it, they will
probably consider only to censure.
Lord AYLESPORD:--My lords, I am no stranger to the claims of the
commons to the sole and independent right of forming money bills, nor
to the heat with which that claim has been asserted, or the firmness
with which it has always been maintained in late senates. Nor am I
ignorant, that by contesting this claim, we have sometimes excited
disputes, which nothing but a prorogation of the senate could appease.
I know, my lords, and allow, that by acting in any unusual manner with
regard to bills of this kind, we may excite the resentment of the
commons, and that some interruption of the publick business may, for
want of candour and moderation, possibly ensue.
But, my lords, I cannot think the possibility of an ill consequence an
argument sufficient to show the unreasonableness of my proposal; for
the inconveniencies that may arise from postponing the bill, are only
possible, but the calamities that we shall bring upon our country by
passing it are certain.
But we are likewise to consider, my lords, that these events, of which
it can only be said that they may happen, may also not happen. When I
reflect that the house of commons is an assembly of reasonable beings,
that it is filled by the representatives of the British people, by men
who will share the calamities of the publick, and whose interest it
is, equally with ours, to prevent the destruction of our commerce, the
decay of our manufactures, the corruption of the present age, and the
ruin of posterity, I cannot but hope that they will apply themselves
to a candid review of the bill which they have sent, and without heat,
jealousy, or disputes, explain it as they may do by another, which
will be no deviation from the rules which they have established for
themselves, and by which they may secure the happiness of their
country without receding from their own pretensions.
The duke of BEDFORD:--My lords, the proposal made by the noble lord
appears to me so prudent and equitable, so moderate and so seasonable,
and, in my opinion, suggests so easy a method of reconciling the
pretensions of the commons with the necessity of amending the bill,
that I cannot but think it worthy of the unanimous approbation of your
lordships.
I am very far from conceiving the commons to be an assembly of men
deaf to reason, or imagining them so void of all regard for the
happiness of the publick, as that they will sacrifice it to an
obstinate adherence to claims which they cannot but know to be in
themselves disputable, and of which they must at least allow that they
are only so far just as they contribute to the great end of
government, the general good.
But lest they should, by any perverse and unseasonable obstinacy,
attend more to the preservation of their own power than to the
promotion of the happiness of their constituents, a method is now
proposed, by which the errours of this bill may be corrected, without
any concession of either house. The commons may easily be informed of
the dangers which are justly dreaded from this bill; and may,
therefore, prepare another, by which a tax of the same kind may be
laid, without a general license of drunkenness; or if a method of
laying a duty upon these liquors, which may at once hinder their
excessive use, and increase the revenue of the government, cannot be
discovered, they may raise the supplies for the year by some other
scheme.
Lord CARTERET:--My lords, as the expedient proposed by these noble
lords, however it may be recommended, as being at once moderate and
efficacious, has, in reality, no other tendency than to procure an
absolute rejection of this bill, it is proper to consider the
consequences which may be reasonably expected from the measures which
they have hitherto proposed.
In order to the effectual restraint of the common people from the use
of these pernicious liquors, they assert the necessity of imposing a
very large duty to be paid by the distiller, which might, indeed,
produce, in some degree, the effect which they expect from it, but
would produce it by giving rise to innumerable frauds and
inconveniencies.
The immediate consequence of a heavy duty would be the ruin of our
distillery, which is now a very extensive and profitable trade, in
which great multitudes are employed, who must instantly, upon the
cessation of it, sink into poverty. Our stills, my lords, not only
supply our natives with liquors, which they used formerly to purchase
from foreign countries, and therefore increase, or at least preserve
the wealth of our country; but they likewise furnish large quantities
for exportation to Guernsey, Jersey, and other places. But no sooner
will the duty proposed to be laid upon this liquor take place, than
all this trade will be at an end, and those who now follow it will be
reduced to support themselves by other employments; and those
countries in which our spirits are now drank will be soon supplied
from other nations with liquors at once cheaper and more pleasant.
It may be proposed, as an expedient for the preservation of our
foreign trade, that the duty shall be repaid upon exportation; but the
event of this provision, my lords, will be, that great quantities will
be sent to sea for the sake of obtaining a repayment of the duty,
which, instead of being sold to foreigners, will be privately landed
again upon our own coasts.
Thus, my lords, will the duty be collected, and afterwards repaid; and
the government will suffer the odium of imposing a severe tax, and
incur the expense of employing a great number of officers, without any
advantage to the publick. Spirits will, in many parts of the kingdom,
be very little dearer than at present, and drunkenness and debauchery
will still prevail.
That these arts, and a thousand others, will be practised by the
people to obtain this infatuating liquor, cannot be doubted. It cannot
be imagined that they will forbear frauds, who have had recourse to
violence, or that those will not endeavour to elude the government,
who have already defied it.
Every rigorous law will be either secretly evaded, or openly violated;
every severe restraint will be shaken off, either by artifice or vice;
nor can this vice, however dangerous or prevalent, be corrected but by
slow degrees, by straitening the reins of government imperceptibly,
and by superadding a second slight restraint, after the nation has
been for some time habituated to the first.
That the government proceeds by these easy and gentle methods of
reformation, ought not to be imputed to negligence, but necessity; for
so far has the government been from any connivance at this vice, that
an armed force was necessary to support the laws which were made to
restrain it, and secure the chief persons of the state from the
insults of the populace, whom they had only provoked by denying them
this pernicious liquor.
Since, therefore, my lords, all opposition to this predominant
inclination has appeared without effect, since the government
evidently wants power to conquer the united and incessant struggles
for the liberty of drunkenness, what remains but that this vice should
produce some advantage to the publick, in return for the innumerable
evils which arise from it, and that the government should snatch the
first opportunity of taxing that vice which cannot be reformed?
This duty arises, indeed, from a concurrence of different causes, of
just designs in the government, and of bad inclinations in the people.
The tax is just, and well meant; but it can be made sufficient to
support the expenses to which it is appropriated, only by the
resolution of the populace to continue, in some degree, their usual
luxury.
I am far, my lords, from thinking this method of raising money
eligible for its own sake, or justifiable by any other plea than that
of necessity. If it were possible at once to extinguish the thirst of
spirits, no man who had any regard for virtue, or for happiness, would
propose to augment the revenue by a tax upon them.
But, my lords, rigour has been already tried, and found to be vain; it
has been found equally fruitless to forbid the people to use spirits,
as to forbid a man in a dropsy to drink. The force of appetite long
indulged, and by indulgence made superiour to the control of reason,
is not to be overcome at once; it cannot be subdued by a single
effort, but may be weakened; new habits of a more innocent kind may in
time be superinduced, and one desire may counterbalance another.
We must endeavour, my lords, by just degrees, to withdraw their
affections from this pernicious enjoyment, by making the attainment of
it every year somewhat more difficult: but we must not quicken their
wishes, and exasperate their resentment, by depriving them at once of
their whole felicity. By this method, my lords, I doubt not but we
shall obtain what we have hitherto endeavoured with so little success;
and I believe that though, in open defiance of a severe law, spirits
are now sold in every street of this city, a gentle restraint will, in
a short time, divert the minds of the people to other entertainments,
and the vice of drinking spirits will be forgotten among us.
Lord HERVEY then rose up again, and spoke to the effect following:--My
lords, though I have always considered this bill as at once wicked and
absurd, I imagined till now that the projectors of it would have been
able to have argued, at least, speciously, though not solidly, in
defence of it; nor did I imagine it to have been wholly indefensible,
till I discovered how little the extensive knowledge, the long
experience, and the penetrating foresight of the noble lord who spoke
last, enabled him to produce in vindication of it.
His lordship's argument is reducible to this single assertion, that
the drinking distilled liquors cannot be prevented; and from thence he
drew this inference, that since it is a point of wisdom to turn
misfortunes to advantage, we ought to contrive methods by which the
debauchery of the people may enrich the government.
Though we should suppose the assertion true in any sense below that of
absolute physical impossibility, the inference is by no means just;
since it is the duty of governours to struggle against vice, and
promote virtue with incessant assiduity, notwithstanding the
difficulties that may for a time hinder the wisest and most rigorous
measures from success. That governour who desists from his endeavours
of reformation, because they have been once baffled, in reality
abandons his station and deserts his charge, nor deserves any other
character than that of laziness, negligence, or cowardice.
The preservation of virtue where it subsists, and the recovery of it
where it is lost, are the only valuable purposes of government. Laws
which do not promote these ends are useless, and those that obviate
them are pernicious. The government that takes advantage of wicked
inclinations, by accident predominant in the people, and, for any
temporary convenience, instead of leading them back to virtue, plunges
them deeper into vice, is no longer a sacred institution, because it
is no longer a benefit to society. It is from that time a system of
wickedness, in which bad ends are promoted by bad means, and one crime
operates in subordination to another.
But, my lords, it is not necessary to show the unreasonableness of the
inference, because the assertion from which it is deduced cannot be
proved. That the excessive use of distilled liquors cannot be
prevented, is a very daring paradox, not only contrary to the
experience of all past times, but of the present; for the law which is
now to be repealed, did in a great degree produce the effects desired
from it, till the execution of it was suspended, not by the inability
of the magistrates, or obstinacy of the people, but by the artifice of
ministers, who promoted the sale of spirits secretly, for the same
reason which incites our present more daring politicians to establish
the use of them by a law.
The defects of this law, for that it was defective cannot be denied,
were in the manner of levying the duty; for had half the duty that was
demanded from the unlicensed retailers, been required from the
distiller, there had been no need of informations; nor had we been
stunned with the dismal accounts of the rage and cruelty of the
people, or the violent deaths of those who endeavoured to grow rich by
commencing prosecutions. The duty had been regularly paid, the liquors
had been made too dear for common use, and the name of spirits had
been in a short time forgotten amongst us.
From this defect, my lords, arose all the difficulties and
inconveniencies that have impeded the execution of the law, and
prevented the effects that were expected from it, and by one amendment
they might be all removed.
But instead of endeavouring to improve the efficacy of the remedy
which was before proposed for this universal malady, we are now told,
that it was too forcible to take effect, and that it only failed by
the vigour of its operation. We are informed, that the work of
reformation ought not to be despatched with too much expedition, that
mankind cannot possibly be made virtuous at once, and that they must
be drawn off from their habits by just degrees, without the violence
of a sudden change.
What degrees the noble lord proposes to recommend, or what advantage
he expects from allowing the people a longer time to confirm their
habits, I am not able to discover. He appears to me rather to propose
an experiment than a law, and rather to intend the improvement of
policy, than the safety of the people.
This experiment is, indeed, of a very daring kind, in which not only
the money but the lives of the people are hazarded: their money has,
indeed, in all ages been subject to the caprices of statesmen, but
their lives ought to be exempt from such dangerous practices, because,
when once lost, they can never be recovered. By this bill, however, it
is contrived to lay poison in the way of the people, poison which we
know will be eagerly devoured by a fourth part of the nation, and will
prove fatal to a great number of those that taste it; nor of this
project is any defence made, but, that since the people love to
swallow poison, it may be of advantage to the government to sell it.
It might not be improper, my lords, to publish to the people, by a
formal proclamation, the benevolent intentions of their governours;
and inform them, that licensed murderers are to be appointed, at whose
shops they may infallibly be destroyed, without any danger of legal
censures, provided they take care to use the poison prescribed by the
government, and increase, by their death, the publick revenue.
That money only is desired from this bill, is not only obvious from
the first perusal of it, but confessed even by those who defend it;
but not one has continued to assert, that it will produce a
reformation of manners, or recommended it otherwise than as an
experiment.
For this reason, my lords, I still think my motion for postponing the
bill very reasonable, nor do I make any scruple to confess that I
propose, by postponing, only a more gentle and inoffensive method of
dropping it, that some other way of raising the supplies may be
attempted, or that the duty may be raised to three shillings a gallon;
the lowest tax that can be laid with a design of reformation.
This method, my lords, or any other by which another bill may be
procured, should be pursued; for whatever schemes the commons may
substitute, the nation can suffer nothing by the change, they cannot
raise money in any other manner, but with less injury to the publick;
since the greatest calamity which wrong measures can possibly produce,
is the propagation of wickedness, and the establishment of debauchery.
Lord BATH then spoke, in substance as follows:--My lords, that this
bill is, with great propriety, called an experiment, I am ready to
allow, but do not think the justness of that expression any forcible
argument against it; because I know not any law that can be proposed
for the same end, without equally deserving the same appellation.
All the schemes of government, my lords, have been perfected by slow
degrees, and the defects of every regulation supplied by the wisdom of
successive generations. No man has yet been found, whose discernment,
however penetrating, has enabled him to discover all the consequences
of a new law, nor to perceive all the fallacies that it includes, or
all the inconveniencies that it may produce; the first essay of a new
regulation is, therefore, only an experiment made, in some degree, at
random, and to be rectified by subsequent observations; in making
which, the most prudent conduct is only to take care that it may
produce no ill consequences of great importance, before there may be
an opportunity of reviewing it.
This maxim, my lords, is, in my opinion, strictly regarded in the
present attempt, which in itself is an affair of very great
perplexity. The health and virtue of the people are to be regarded on
one part, and the continuance of a very gainful and extensive
manufacture on the other; a manufacture by which only, or chiefly, the
produce of our own nation is employed; and on which, therefore, the
value of lands must very much depend.
Manufactures of this kind, my lords, ought never to be violently or
suddenly suppressed. If they are pernicious to the nation in general,
they are, at least, useful to a very great part, and to some, who have
no other employment, necessary; and in the design of putting a stop to
any detrimental trade, care is always to be taken that the
inconvenience exceed not the benefit, and time be allowed for those
that are engaged in it to withdraw to some other business, and for the
commodities that are consumed by it, to be introduced at some other
market, or directed to some other use.
These cautions are in this bill very judiciously observed. The trade,
which all allow to administer supplies to debauchery, and fuel to
diseases, will, by the provisions in this bill, sink away by degrees,
and the health and virtue of the people will be preserved or restored
without murmurs or commotions.
We must consider, likewise, my lords, the necessity of raising
supplies, and the success with which they have hitherto been raised
upon the scheme which is now under your consideration.
In examining the necessity of procuring supplies, I shall not
expatiate upon the present danger of the liberties of all this part of
the world; upon the distress of the house of Austria, the necessity of
preserving the balance of power, or the apparent designs of the
ancient and incessant disturbers of mankind, topicks which have been
on former occasions sufficiently explained.
It is now only necessary to observe, that the state of our affairs
requires expedition, and that a happy peace can only be expected from
a successful war, and that war can only be made successful by vigour
and despatch.
If by liberal grants of money, and ready concurrence in all necessary
measures, we enable his majesty to raise a powerful army, there is no
reason to doubt that a single campaign may procure peace, that it may
establish the liberties of Europe, and raise our allies, who were so
lately distressed, to their former greatness.
These supplies, my lords, which are so evidently necessary, may, by
the method now proposed, be easily, speedily, and cheaply raised. Upon
the security which this act will afford, large sums are already
offered to the government at the low interest of three for a hundred,
by those who, if the conditions of the loan are changed, will,
perhaps, demand four in a few days, or raise money by a combination to
the rate of five or six for a hundred; of which I would not remark how
much it will embarrass the publick measures, or how much it will
encourage our enemies to an obstinate resistance.
Such, my lords, are the inconveniencies to be feared from rejecting
this bill, or from postponing it; by which is plainly intended only a
more gentle and tender manner of rejecting it, by hinting to the
commons your disapprobation of it, and the necessity of sending up
another, which you cannot do without hazarding the peace of the nation
and the fate of the war.
The commons, who are not obliged to inquire what reception their bills
find here, may perhaps not immediately prepare another, but suffer
time to elapse, till necessity shall oblige us to comply with those
measures which we cannot approve.
They may, likewise, by a kind of senatorial craft, elude all our
precautions, and make the rejection of the bill ineffectual, as was
once done, when a bill for a tax upon leather was rejected: the
commons, determining not to be directed in the methods of raising
money, sent up the same bill with only a small alteration of the
title, to lay a duty upon tanned hides, which the lords were, for want
of time, obliged to pass.
But, my lords, should the other house discover in this single
instance, any uncommon degree of flexibility and complaisance, should
they patiently endure the rejection of the bill, admit the validity of
the reasons upon which your lordships have proceeded, and willingly
engage in drawing up a new scheme for raising supplies; even upon this
supposition, which is more favourable than can reasonably be formed,
the business of the year will be very much perplexed, and the new bill
hurried into a law without sufficient caution or deliberation.
The session is now, my lords, so far advanced, that many of the
commons have retired into the country, whose advice and assistance may
be necessary in the projection of a new money bill, so that the new
bill must be formed in a short time, and by a thin house; and, indeed,
the multiplicity of considerations necessary to another bill of this
kind, is such, that I cannot think it prudent to advise or undertake
it.
The committee on ways and means must strike out another scheme for a
considerable impost, which, in the present state of the nation, is in
itself no easy task. This scheme must be so adjusted as to be
consistent with all the other taxes, which will require long
consultations and accurate inquiries. It must then struggle, perhaps,
through an obstinate and artful opposition, before it can pass through
the forms of the other house; and, when it comes before your
lordships, may be again opposed with no less zeal than the bill before
us, and perhaps, likewise, with equal reason.
All these dangers and difficulties will be avoided by trying, for a
single year, the experiment which is now proposed; and which, if that
should fail, may be better adjusted in the time of leisure, which the
beginning of the next session will undoubtedly afford; before which
time I am afraid no amendment can possibly be made.
It has been proposed, indeed, by the noble lord, that three shillings
should be laid upon every gallon of distilled liquors, which would
undoubtedly lessen the consumption, but would at the same time destroy
the trade; a trade from which large profits may be in time gained;
since our distillers have now acquired such skill, that the most
delicate palate cannot distinguish their liquors from those which
foreigners import.
If the duty be raised to the height proposed, it must be allowed to be
repaid for all that shall be exported; otherwise foreign nations will
deprive us of this part of our trade; and it has been already shown,
that by mock exportations the duty may be frequently evaded.
Thus, my lords, there will be difficulties on either hand; if a duty
so high be paid, the manufacturer will be ruined; if it be evaded, the
consumption will be lessened.
One inconvenience will easily be discovered to be the necessary
consequence of any considerable advance of the price. We may be
certain that an act of the senate will not moderate the passions, or
alter the appetites of the people; and that they will not be less
desirous of their usual gratifications, because they are denied them.
The poor may, indeed, yield to necessity, unless they find themselves
able to resist the law, or to evade it; but those who can afford to
please their taste, or exalt their spirits at a greater expense, will
still riot as before, but with this difference, that their excesses
will produce no advantage to the publick.
If an additional duty of three shillings be laid upon every gallon of
distilled liquors, the product of our own distillery will be dearer
than those liquors which are imported from foreign parts; and,
therefore, it cannot but be expected that the money which now
circulates amongst us, will in a short time be clandestinely carried
into other countries.
Such, my lords, will be the effect of those taxes which are so
strongly recommended; and, therefore, they ought not to be imposed
till all other methods of proceeding have been found ineffectual.
It is possible, indeed, that the regulation specified in this bill may
not produce any beneficial effect, and that the present practice of
debauchery may still continue among the people; but it is likewise
possible that this tax may, by increasing the price, augment the
revenue at the same time that it lessens the consumption.
This proposal has, by some lords, been treated as a paradox; but they
certainly suspected it of falsehood, only for want of patience to form
the calculations necessary in such disquisitions. The tax of the last
year amounted to one hundred and seventy thousand pounds; this tax is
now doubled, so that the same quantity will produce three hundred and
forty thousand; but if one third less should be consumed, the present
tax will amount to no more than two hundred and twenty thousand
pounds; and when fifty thousand licenses are added, the revenue will
gain an hundred thousand pounds, though one third part of the
consumption should be hindered.
But, my lords, supposing no part of the consumption hindered, I cannot
think that bill should be rejected, which, in a time of danger like
the present, shall add to the publick revenue an annual income of more
than two hundred thousand pounds, without lessening any manufacture,
without burdening any useful or virtuous part of the nation, and
without giving the least occasion to any murmurs among the people.
It is to be remembered, my lords, that whatever corruption shall
prevail amongst us, it cannot be imputed to this bill, which did not
make, but find the nation vitiated, and only turned their vices to
publick advantage; so that if it produces any diminution of the sale
of spirits, it is indisputably to be applauded as promoting virtue. If
the sale of spirits still continues the same, it will deserve some
degree of commendation, as it will, at least, not contribute to the
increase of vice, and as it will augment the revenue without injuring
the people; for how, my lords, can we be censured for only suffering
the nation to continue in its former state?
Lord TALBOT then spoke in substance as follows:--My lords, if we
consider the tendency of the argument used by the noble lord, the only
argument on which he appears to lay any stress, it will prove, if it
proves any thing, what cannot be admitted by your lordships, without
bidding farewell to independency, and acknowledging that you are only
the substitutes of a higher power.
It appears by the tenor of his reasoning, that he considers this house
as only obliged, in questions relating to supplies, to ratify the
determinations of the other; to submit implicitly to their dictates,
and receive their sovereign commands, without daring either to refuse
compliance, or delay it.
If we conjoin the reasoning of the noble lord who spoke last, with
that of one who spoke before in favour of the bill, we shall be able
to discover the full extent of our power on these occasions; the first
was pleased to inform us, that though we were at liberty to examine
the paragraphs of this bill, we had no right, at least no power to
amend them; because in money bills, the commons left us no other
choice than that of passing or rejecting them.
This, my lords, might have been thought a sufficient contraction of
those privileges which your ancestors transmitted to you, and the
commons needed to have desired no farther concessions from this
assembly, since this was a publick confession of a subordinate state,
and admitted either that part of our ancient rights had been given up,
or that we were at present too much depressed to dare to assert them.
We might, however, still comfort ourselves with the peaceful and
uncontested possession of the alternative; we might still believe that
what we could not approve we might reject, without irritating the
formidable commons. But now, my lords, a new doctrine has been vented
among us; we are told not only that we must not amend a money bill,
but that it will be to no purpose to reject it; for that the other
house will send it again without altering any thing but the title, and
force it upon us, when there is no time for any other expedient.
If this, my lords, should be done, I know not how the bill might, at
its second appearance, be received by other lords; for my part, I
should vote immediately for rejecting it, without any alleviating or
mollifying expedients. I should reject it, my lords, even on the last
day of the session, without any regard to the pretended necessity of
raising supplies, and without suffering myself to be terrified into
compliance by the danger of the house of Austria; for though I think
the balance of power on the continent necessary to be preserved at the
hazard of a fleet or an army, I cannot think it of equal importance to
us with the equipoise of our own government; nor can I conceive it my
duty to enslave myself to secure the freedom of another.
The danger, therefore, of disgusting the commons, at this or any other
juncture, shall never influence me to a tame resignation of the
privileges of our own house; nor shall I willingly allow any force to
arguments which are intended only to operate upon our fear; and,
therefore, unless there shall appear some better plea in favour of
this bill, I shall think it my duty to oppose it.
The other plea is the difficulty, or, in the style of the noble lord
who spoke last, the impossibility of raising supplies by any other
method. That it is not easy to raise supplies by any new tax, in a
nation where almost all the necessaries of life are loaded with
imposts, must be readily allowed; but that it is impossible, the folly
of the people, which is at least equal to their poverty, will not
suffer me to grant.
One other expedient, at least, has been already discovered by the
wonderful sagacity of our new ministers; an expedient which they
cannot, indeed, claim the honour of inventing, but which appears so
conformable to the rest of their conduct, and so agreeable to their
principles, that I doubt not but they will very often practise it, if
the continuance of their power be long enough to admit of a full
display of their abilities.
Amidst their tenderness for our manufactures, and their regard for
commerce, they have established a lottery for eight hundred thousand
pounds, by which they not only take advantage of an inclination too
predominant, an inclination to grow rich rather by a lucky hazard,
than successful industry; but give up the people a prey to
stockjobbers, usurers, and brokers of tickets, who will plunder them
without mercy, by the encouragement of those by whom it might be hoped
that they would be protected from plunderers.
All lotteries, my lords, are games, which are not more honest or more
useful for being legal; and the objection which has been made to all
other games, and which has never yet been answered, will be found
equally valid when applied to them. They engross that attention which
might be employed in improving or extending our manufactures; they
swallow that money which might circulate in useful trade; they give
the idle and the diligent an equal prospect of riches; and by
conferring unexpected wealth upon those who never deserved it, and
know not how to use it, they promote extravagance and luxury,
insolence and dissoluteness.
But these consequences, my lords, and a thousand others equally
important, equally formidable, may be objected without effect, against
any scheme by which money will be raised; money! the only end at which
our ministers have aimed for almost half a century; money! by which
only they have preserved the favour of the court, and the obedience of
the senate; money! which has supplied the place of wisdom at one time,
and of courage at another.
To gain money, my lords, they have injured trade by establishing a
lottery; and they are now about to sacrifice the health and virtue of
the people, to the preservation of a trade by which money may be
furnished to the government. This, my lords, is their only design,
however they may act, or whatever they may profess; if they endeavour
to protect either the trade or lives of people, it is only because
they expect a continuance of taxes from them; and when more desperate
measures are necessary for the same purposes, they ruin their trade by
one project, and destroy their lives by another.
Lord LONSDALE next spoke, to this effect:--My lords, it is not without
the utmost grief and indignation, that I find this house considered by
some who have spoken in vindication of this bill, as obliged to comply
with any proposals sent up by the commons for raising money, however
destructive to the publick, or however contrary to the dictates of our
conscience, or convictions of our reason.
What is this, my lords, but once more to vote ourselves useless? What
but to be the first that shall destroy the constitution of the
government, and give up that liberty which our ancestors established?
That this is really the design of any of the noble lords, who have
spoken in vindication of the bill, and have asserted the necessity of
passing it, without any attempts to amend it, I am very far from
affirming; but certainly, my lords, this, and this only, is the
consequence of their positions, with whatever intention they may have
advanced them; for how, my lords, can we call ourselves independent,
if we are to receive the commands of the other house? or with what
propriety can we assume the title of legislators, if we are to pass a
bill like this without examination?
The bill now before us, my lords, is of the utmost importance to the
happiness of that nation whose welfare we have hitherto been imagined
to superintend. In this bill are involved not only the trade and
riches, but the lives and morals of the British people; nor can we
suffer it to pass unexamined, without betraying the nation to
wickedness and destruction.
Should we, on this occasion, suffer ourselves to be degraded from
legislators to messengers from the commons to the throne; should we be
content only to transmit the laws which we ought to amend, and resign
ourselves up implicitly to the wisdom of those whom we have formerly
considered as our inferiours, I know not for what purpose we sit here.
It would be my counsel that we should no longer attempt to preserve
the appearance of power, when we have lost the substance, or submit to
share the drudgery of government, without partaking of the authority.
The time of such desperation is, indeed, not yet arrived; but every
act of servile compliance will bring it nearer; and, therefore, my
lords, for the sake of ourselves, as well as of the people, I join the
noble lord's motion for resuming the house, that farther information
may be obtained both by ourselves, by the commons, and by the nation.
The duke of NEWCASTLE then rose, and spoke to the effect
following:--My lords, I believe no lord in this assembly is more
zealous for the advantage of the publick than myself, or more desirous
to preserve the lives, or amend the morals of the people; but I cannot
think that this character can justly imply any dislike of the bill now
before us.
If I should admit what the noble lord has asserted, that the lives and
morals of the people are affected by this bill, I cannot yet see that
his inference is just, or that our compliance with the motion is,
therefore, necessary.
That under the present regulation, the miseries of the nation are
every day increased; that corruption spreads every day wider, and
debauchery makes greater havock, is confessed on all sides; and,
therefore, I can discover no reason for continuing the laws in their
present state, nor can think that we ought to decline any experiment
by which that disorder, which cannot be increased, may possibly be
lessened.
It is confessed by the noble lords, who declare their approbation of
the motion for postponing the consideration of this bill, that they
intend nothing less than a gentle and tacit manner of dropping it, by
showing the commons that though to avoid offence they do not
absolutely reject it, yet they cannot approve it, and will not pass
it; and that, therefore, the necessity of raising supplies, requires
that another bill should be formed, not liable to the same objections.
The consequence of this procedure, my lords, can only be, that either
the commons will form another bill for raising money, or that they
will send up this again with a new title, and such slight alterations
as not the happiness of the nation, but the forms of the senate
demand.
If, in return for our endeavours to reform a bill, of which they think
themselves the only constitutional judges, they should send it again
with only another title; what, my lords, shall we procure by the
delay, but a new occasion of murmurs and discontent, a new
confirmation of the power of the commons, and an establishment of
senatorial chicanery, at once pernicious to the publick, and
ignominious to ourselves.
That the commons, in sending back a bill that has been rejected in
this house, with only a change in the title, act contrary to the end
of senatorial consultations, though consistently with their external
forms, cannot be denied: but as each house is without any dependence
on the other, such deviations from the principles of our constitution,
however injurious to our authority, or however detrimental to the
nation, cannot be punished, nor otherwise prevented, than by caution
and prudence.
If, therefore, the commons, as they have formerly done, should return
the bill without alteration, we shall only have impaired our own
authority, and shaken the foundations of our government by a fruitless
opposition. Nor shall we gain any advantage, though they should comply
with our expectations, and employ the little time that remains in
contriving a new tax; for corruption must then proceed without
opposition, the people must grow every day more vitious, and
debauchery will, in a short time, grow too general to be suppressed.
With regard to the bill before us, the only question that is necessary
or proper, is, whether it will promote or hinder the consumption of
distilled liquors? for as to the effects of those liquors, those that
vindicate, and that oppose this bill, are of the same opinion; and all
will readily allow, that if the law now proposed shall be found to
increase the consumption which it was intended to diminish, it ought
immediately to be repealed, as destructive to the people, and contrary
to the end for which it was designed; but if the additional duties
shall produce any degree of restraint, if they shall hinder the
consumption even of a very small part, I think it must be allowed that
the provisions are just and useful; since it has already appeared,
that this vice is too deeply rooted to be torn up at once; and that,
therefore, it is to be pruned away by imperceptible diminution.
Whether the provisions now offered in the bill might not admit of
improvements; whether some other more efficacious expedients might not
be discovered; and whether the duties might not be raised yet higher,
with more advantage to the publick, may undoubtedly admit of long
disputes and deep inquiries; but for these inquiries and disputes, my
lords, there is at present no time: the affairs of the continent
require our immediate interposition, the general oppressors of the
western world are now endeavouring to extend their dominions, and
exalt their power beyond the possibility of future opposition; and our
allies, who were straggling against them, can no longer continue their
efforts without assistance.
At a time like this, my lords, it is not proper to delay the supplies
by needless controversies; or, indeed, by any disputes which may,
without great inconvenience, be delayed to a time of tranquillity, a
time when all our inquiries may be prosecuted at leisure, when every
argument may be considered in its full extent, and when the
improvement of our laws ought, indeed, to be our principal care. At
present it appears to me, that every method of raising money, without
manifest injury to the morals of the people, deserves our approbation;
and, therefore, that we ought to pass this bill, though it should not
much hinder the consumption of spirituous liquors, if it shall barely
appear that it will not increase it.
It is at least proper, that, at this pressing exigence, those that
oppose the bills by which supplies are to be raised, should, by
offering other expedients, show that their opposition proceeds not
from any private malevolence to the ministry, or any prepossession
against the publick measures, but from a steady adherence to just
principles, and an impartial regard for the publick good; for it may
be suspected, that he who only busies himself in pulling down, without
any attempts to repair the breaches that he has made, with more fit or
durable materials, has no real design of strengthening the
fortification.
It has been proposed, indeed, by one of the noble lords, that a tax of
three shillings a gallon should be laid upon all distilled spirits,
and collected by the laws of excise at the still-head, which would
doubtless secure a great part of the people from the temptations to
which they are at present exposed, but would at the same time produce
another effect not equally to be desired.
I have been informed, my lords, upon mentioning this proposal in
conversation, that such duties will raise the price of the liquors
distilled among us above that of foreign countries; and that,
therefore, not only all our foreign trade of this kind would be
immediately destroyed, but that many of those who now drink our own
spirits, only because they are cheaper, will then purchase those of
foreign countries, which are generally allowed to be more pleasant.
That this is really the state of the affair, I do not affirm; for I
now relate only what I have heard from others; but surely the
imposition of so heavy a duty requires a long consideration; nor can
it be improper to mention any objections, the discussion of which may
contribute to our information.
But any other regulations than those now offered, will require so many
inquiries, and so long consultation, that the senate will expect to be
dismissed from their attendance, before any resolutions are formed;
and when once the supplies are provided, we shall find ourselves
obliged to leave the law relating to spirituous liquors in its present
state.
Then, my lords, will the enemies of the government imagine that they
have a new opportunity of gratifying their malignity, by censuring us
as wholly negligent of the publick happiness, and charge us with
looking without concern upon the debauchery, the diseases, and the
poverty of the people, without any compassion of their wants, or care
of their reformation.
That to continue the present law any longer, will be only to amuse
ourselves with ineffectual provisions, is universally allowed; nor is
there any difference of opinion with regard to the present state of
the vice which we are now endeavouring to hinder. The last law was
well intended, but was dictated by anger, and ratified by zeal; and
therefore was too violent to be executed, and, instead of reforming,
exasperated the nation.
No sooner, therefore, did the magistrates discover the inflexible
resolution of the people, their furious persecution of informers, and
their declared hatred of all those who concurred in depriving them of
this dangerous pleasure, than they were induced, by regard to their
own safety, to relax that severity which was enjoined, and were
contented to purchase safety by gratifying, or, at least, by not
opposing those passions of the multitude, which they could not hope to
control; the practice of drinking spirits continued, and the
consumption was every year greater than the former.
This, my lords, is the present state of the nation; a state
sufficiently deplorable, and which all the laws of humanity and
justice command us to alter. This is the universal declaration. We all
agree, that the people grow every day more corrupt, and that this
corruption ought to be stopped; but by what means is yet undecided.
Violent methods and extremity of rigour have been already tried, and
totally defeated; it is, therefore, proposed to try more easy and
gentle regulations, that shall produce, by slow degrees, the
reformation which cannot be effected by open force; these new
regulations appear to many lords not sufficiently coercive, and are
imagined still less likely to reform a vice so inveterate, and so
firmly established.
These opinions I cannot flatter myself with the hope of reconciling;
but must yet observe, that the consumption of these liquors, as of all
other commodities, can only be lessened by proper duties, and that
every additional imposition has a tendency to lessen them; and since,
so far as it extends, it can produce no ill effects, deserves the
approbation of those who sincerely desire to suppress this odious vice
that has so much prevailed, and been so widely diffused.
It is, indeed, possible, that the duties now proposed may be found not
sufficient; but for this defect there is an easy remedy. The duty, if
it be found, by the experience of a single year, to be too small, may,
in the next, be easily augmented, and swelled, by annual increases,
even to the height which is now proposed, if no remedy more easy can
be found.
It may be objected, that this fund will be mortgaged for the payment
of the sums employed in the service of the war; and that, therefore,
the state of the duty cannot afterwards be altered without injustice
to the publick creditors, and a manifest violation of the faith of the
senate; but, my lords, though in the hurry of providing for a pressing
and important war, the commons could not find any other method so easy
of raising money, it cannot be doubted but that when they consider the
state of the nation at leisure, they will easily redeem this tax, if
it shall appear inconvenient, and substitute some other, less
injurious to the happiness of the publick.
It was not impossible for them to have done this in the beginning of
this session; nor can it be supposed, that men so long versed in
publick affairs, could not easily have proposed many other imposts;
but it may be imagined, that they chose this out of many, without
suspecting that it would be opposed; and believed, that they were at
once raising supplies, and protecting the virtue of the people.
Nor, indeed, my lords, does it yet appear that they have been
mistaken; for though the arguments of the noble lords who oppose the
bill are acute and plausible, yet since they agree that the
consumption of these liquors is, at last, to be hindered by raising
their price, it is reasonable to conceive, that every augmentation of
the price must produce a proportionate diminution of the consumption;
and that, therefore, this duty will contribute, in some degree, to the
reformation of the people. It seems, at least, in the highest degree
probable, that it cannot increase the evil which it is intended to
remedy; and that, therefore, we may reasonably concur in it, as it
will furnish the government with supplies, without any inconvenience
to those that pay them.
The bishop of OXFORD next spoke to this effect:--My lords, this
subject has already been so acutely considered, and so copiously
discussed, that I rise up in despair of proposing any thing new, of
explaining any argument more clearly, or urging it more forcibly, of
starting any other subject of consideration, or pointing out any
circumstance yet untouched in those that have been proposed.
Yet, my lords, though I cannot hope to add any thing to the knowledge
which your lordships have already obtained of the subject in debate, I
think it my duty to add one voice to the truth, and to declare, that
in the balance of my understanding, the arguments against the bill
very much outweigh those that have been offered in its favour.
It is always presumed by those who vindicate it, that every
augmentation of the price will necessarily produce a proportionate
decrease of the consumption. This, my lords, is the chief, if not the
only argument that has been advanced, except that which is drawn from
the necessity of raising supplies, and the danger of disgusting the
other house. But this argument, my lords, is evidently fallacious; and
therefore the bill, if it passes, must pass without a single reason,
except immediate convenience.
Let us examine, my lords, this potent argument, which has been
successively urged by all who have endeavoured to vindicate the bill,
and echoed from one to another with all the confidence of
irrefragability; let us consider on what suppositions it is founded,
and we shall soon find how easily it will be dissipated.
It is supposed, by this argument, that every drinker of these liquors
spends as much as he can possibly procure; and that therefore the
least additional price must place part of his pleasure beyond his
reach. This, my lords, cannot be generally true; it is perhaps
generally, if not universally false. It cannot be doubted, but that
many of those who corrupt their minds and bodies with these pernicious
draughts, are above the necessity of constraining their appetites to
escape so small an expense as that which is now to be imposed upon
them; and even of those whose poverty can sink no lower, who are in
reality exhausted by every day's debauch, it is at least as likely
that they will insist upon more pay for their work, or that they will
steal with more rapacity, as that they will suffer themselves to be
debarred from the pleasures of drunkenness.
It is not certain that this duty will make these liquors dearer to
those who drink them; since the distiller will more willingly deduct
from his present profit the small tax that is now proposed, than
suffer the trade to sink; and even if that tax should be, as is usual,
levied upon the retailer, it has been already observed, that, in the
quantities necessary to drunkenness, it will not be perceptible.
But, my lords, though this argument appears thus weak upon the first
and slightest consideration, the chief fallacy is still behind. Those,
who have already initiated themselves in debauchery, deserve not the
chief consideration of this assembly; they are, for the greatest part,
hopeless and abandoned, and can only be withheld by force from
complying with those desires to which they are habitually enslaved.
They may, indeed, be sometimes punished, and at other times
restrained, but cannot often be reformed.
Those, my lords, who are yet uncorrupted, ought first to engage our
care; virtue is easily preserved, but difficultly regained. But for
those what regard has hitherto been shown? What effect can be expected
from this bill, but that of exposing them to temptations, by placing
unlawful pleasures in their view? pleasures, which, however unworthy
of human nature, are seldom forsaken after they have once been tasted.
In the consideration of the present question, it is to be remembered,
that multitudes are already corrupted, and the contagion grows more
dangerous in proportion as greater numbers are infected.
To stop the progress of this pestilence, my lords, ought to be the
governing passion of our minds; to this point ought all our aims to be
directed, and for this end ought all our projects to be calculated.
But how, my lords, is this purpose promoted by a law which gives a
license, an unlimited and cheap license, for the sale of that liquor,
to which, even those who support the bill impute the present
corruption of the people? This surely is no rational scheme of
reformation, nor can it be imagined, that a favourite and inveterate
vice is to be extirpated by such gentle methods.
Let us consider, my lords, more nearly the effects of this
new-invented regulation, and we shall see how we may expect from them
the recovery of publick virtue. A law is now to be repealed, by which
the use of distilled liquors is prohibited, but which has not been for
some time put in execution, or not with vigour sufficient to surmount
the difficulties and inconveniencies by which its operation was
obstructed. The law is, however, yet in force, and whoever sells
spirits must now sell them at the hazard of prosecution and penalties,
and with an implicit confidence in the kindness and fidelity of the
purchaser.
It cannot be supposed, my lords, but that a law like this must have
some effect. It cannot be doubted that some are honest and others
timorous; and that among the wretches who are most to be suspected of
this kind of debauchery, there are some in whom it is not safe to
confide; they, therefore, must sometimes be hindered from destroying
their reason by other restraints than want of money; and, when they
are trusted with the secret of an illegal trade, must pay a dearer
rate for the danger that is incurred.
But when this law is repealed, and every street and alley has a shop
licensed to distribute this delicious poison, what can we expect? The
most sanguine advocate for the bill cannot surely hope, that any of
those who now drink spirits will refrain from them, only because they
are sold without danger; and though what cannot be proved, or even
hoped, should be admitted, that some must content themselves with a
smaller quantity on account of the advanced price, yet while they take
all opportunities of debauchery, while they spend, in this destructive
liquor, all that either honest labour or daring theft will supply,
they must always be examples of intemperance; such examples as, from
the experience of late years, we have reason to believe will find many
imitators; and therefore will promote at once the consumption of
spirits, and the corruption of the people.
There is always to be found in wickedness a detestable ambition of
gaining proselytes: every man who has suffered himself to be
corrupted, is desirous to hide himself from infamy in crowds as
vitious as himself, or desires companions in wickedness from the same
natural inclination to society, which prompts almost every man to
avoid singularity on other occasions.
Whatever be the reason, it may be every day observed, that the great
pleasure of the vitious is to vitiate others; nor is it possible to
squander an hour in the assemblies of debauchees of any rank, without
observing with what importunity innocence is attacked, and how many
arts of sophistry and ridicule are used to weaken the influence of
virtue, and suppress the struggles of conscience.
The fatal art by which virtue is most commonly overborne is the
frequent repetition of temptations, which, though often rejected, will
at some unhappy moment generally prevail, and, therefore, ought to be
removed; but which this bill is intended to place always in sight.
To what purpose will it be, my lords, to deprive nine hardened
profligates of a tenth part of the liquor which they now drink, which
is the utmost that this duty will effect? If they have an opportunity
of corrupting one by their solicitation and example, the difference
between nine and ten acts of debauchery is of very small importance to
mankind, or even to the persons who are thus restrained, since their
forbearance of the utmost excesses is only the effect of their
poverty, not of their virtue.
How far is such restraint from being equivalent to the corruption of
one mind, yet pure and undebauched! to the seduction of one heart from
virtue, and a new addition to the interest and prevalence of
wickedness! If it be necessary that the supplies should be raised for
the government by the use of this pernicious liquor, it is desirable
that it should be confined to few, and that it should rather be
swallowed in large quantities by hopeless drunkards, than offered
everywhere to the taste of innocence and youth, in licensed houses of
wickedness.
The consumption will, for a time, be the same in both cases, but with
this important difference, that wickedness would only be continued,
not promoted; and as the poison would rid the land by degrees of the
present race of profligates, it might be hoped, that our posterity
would be uninfected.
But under the present scheme of regulations, my lords, vice will be
propagated under the countenance of the legislature; and that kind of
wickedness by which the nation is so infatuated that it has increased
yearly, in opposition to a penal law, will now not only be suffered,
but encouraged, and enjoy not impunity only, but protection.
Thus, if we pass the bill, we shall not even be able to boast the
petty merit of leaving the nation in its present state; we shall take
away the present restraints of vice, without substituting any in their
place; we shall, perhaps, deprive a few hardened drunkards of a small
part of the liquor which they now swallow, but shall open, according
to the expectation of the noble lord, fifty thousand houses of
licensed debauchery for the ruin of millions yet untainted.
To leave the nation in its present state, which is allowed on all
hands to be a state of corruption, seems to be the utmost ambition of
one of the noble lords, who has pleaded with the greatest warmth for
this bill; for he concluded, with an air of triumph, by asking, how we
can be censured for only suffering the nation to continue in its
former state?
We may be, in my opinion, my lords, censured as traitors to our trust,
and enemies to our country, if we permit any vice to prevail, when it
is in our power to suppress it. We may be cursed, with justice, by
posterity, as the abettors of that debauchery by which poverty and
disease shall be entailed upon them, contemned in the present as the
flatterers of those appetites which we ought to regulate, and insulted
by that populace whom we dare not oppose.
Had none of our predecessors endeavoured the reformation of the
people, had they contented themselves always to leave the nation as
they found it, there had been long ago an end of all the order and
security of society; for the natural depravity of human nature has
always a tendency from less to greater evil; and the same causes which
had made us thus wicked, will, if not obviated, make us worse.
Since the noble lord thinks it not necessary to attempt the
reformation of the people, he might have spared the elaborate
calculation by which he has proved, that a large sum wilt be gained by
the government, though one third part of the consumption be prevented;
for it is of very little importance to discuss the consequences of an
event which will never happen. He should first have proved, that a
third part of the consumption will in reality be prevented, and then
he might very properly have consoled the ministry, by showing how much
they would gain from the residue.
That this bill, as it now stands, will produce a large revenue to the
government, but no reformation in the people, is asserted by those
that oppose, and undoubtedly believed by those that defend it; but as
this is not the purpose which I am most desirous of promoting, I
cannot but think it my duty to agree to the proposal of the noble
lord, that by postponing the consideration of the bill, more exact
information may be obtained by us, and the commons may be alarmed at
the danger into which the nation has been brought by their
precipitation.
Lord BATH then rose again, and spoke to the following effect:--My
lords, as the noble lord who has just spoken appears to have
misapprehended some of my assertions, I think it necessary to rise
again, that I may explain with sufficient clearness what, perhaps, I
before expressed obscurely, amidst the number of different
considerations that crowded my imagination.
With regard to the diminution that might be expected from this law, I
did not absolutely assert, at least, I did not intend to assert, that
a third part would be taken off; but only advanced that supposition as
the basis of a calculation, by which I might prove what many lords
appeared to doubt, that the consumption might possibly be diminished,
and yet the revenue increased.
Upon this supposition, which must be allowed to be reasonable, both
the purposes of the bill will be answered, and the publick supplies
will be raised by the suppression of vice.
The diminution of the consumption may be greater or less than I have
supposed. If it be greater, the revenue will be, indeed, less
augmented; but the purposes which, in the opinion of the noble lords
who oppose the bill, are more to be regarded, will be better promoted,
and all their arguments against it will be, at least, defeated; nor
will the ministry, I hope, regret the failure of a tax which is
deficient only by the sobriety of the nation.
If the diminution be less than I have supposed, yet if there be any
diminution, it cannot be said that the bill has been wholly without
effect, or that the ministry have not proceeded either with more
judgment or better fortune than their predecessors, or that they have
not, at least, taken advantage of the errours that have been
committed. It must be owned, that they have either reformed the
nation, or at least pointed out the way by which the reformation that
has been so long desired, may be effected.
That this tax will in some degree hinder drunkenness, it is reasonable
to expect, because it can only be hindered by taxing the liquors which
are used in excess; but there yet remain, concerning the weight of the
tax that ought to be laid upon them, doubts which nothing but
experience can, I believe, remove.
By experience, my lords, we have been already taught, that taxes may
be so heavy as to be without effect; that restraint may be so violent
as to produce impatience; and, therefore, it is proper in the next
essay to proceed by slow degrees and gentle methods, and produce that
effect imperceptibly which we find ourselves unable to accomplish at
once.
I cannot therefore think, that the duty of three shillings a gallon
can be imposed without defeating our own design, and compelling the
people to find out some method of eluding the law like that which was
practised after the act, by which in the second year of his present
majesty, five shillings were imposed upon every gallon of compound
waters; after which it is well known, that the distillers sold a
simple spirit under the contemptuous title of _senatorial brandy_, and
the law being universally evaded, was soon after repealed as useless.
Such, my lords, or worse, will be the consequence of the tax which the
noble lord has proposed; for if it cannot be evaded, spirits will be
brought from nations that have been wiser than to burden their own
commodities with such insupportable impost, and the empire will soon
be impoverished by the exportation of its money.
Lord HERVEY answered, in substance as follows:--My lords, I am very
far from thinking the arguments of the noble lord such as can
influence men desirous to promote the real and durable happiness of
their country; for he is solicitous only about the prosperity of the
British manufactures, and the preservation of the British trade, but
has shown very little regard to British virtue.
That part of his argument is, therefore, not necessary to be answered,
if the suggestion upon which it is founded were true, since it will be
sufficient to compare the advantage of the two schemes. And with
regard to his insinuation, that senatorial brandy may be revived by a
high duty, I believe, first, that, no such evasion can be contrived,
and in the next place am confident, that it may be defeated by
burdening the new-invented liquor, whatever it be, if it be equally
pernicious, with an equal tax. The path of our duty, my lords, is
plain and easy, and only represented difficult by those who are
inclined to deviate from it.
Lord BATHURST spoke next, to the effect following:--My lords, whatever
measures may be practised by the people for eluding the purposes of
the bill now before us, with whatever industry they may invent new
kinds of senatorial brandy, or by whatever artifices they may escape
the diligence of the officers employed to collect a duty levied upon
their vices and their pleasures, there is, at least, no danger that
they will purchase from the continent those liquors which we are
endeavouring to withhold from them, or that this bill will impoverish
our country by promoting a trade contrary to its interest.
What would be the consequence of the duty of three shillings a gallon,
proposed by the noble lord, it is easy to judge. What, my lords, can
be expected from it, but that it will either oblige or encourage the
venders of spirits to procure from other places what they can no
longer buy for reasonable prices at home? and that those drunkards who
cannot or will not suddenly change their customs, will purchase from
abroad the pleasures which we withhold from them, and the wealth of
the nation be daily diminished, but the virtue little increased?
Thus, my lords, shall we at once destroy our own manufacture and
promote that of our neighbours. Thus shall we enrich other governments
by distressing our own, and instead of increasing sobriety, only
encourage a more expensive and pernicious kind of debauchery.
In the bill now under our consideration, a middle way is proposed, by
which reformation may be introduced by those gradations which have
always been found necessary when inveterate vices are to be
encountered. In this bill every necessary consideration appears to
have been regarded, the health of the people will be preserved, and
their virtue recovered, without destroying their trade or starving
their manufacturers.
The efficacy of this bill seems, indeed, to be allowed by some of the
lords who oppose it, since their chief objection has arisen from their
doubts whether it can be executed. If a law be useless in itself, it
is of no importance whether it is executed or not; and, therefore, I
think it may safely be inferred, that they who are solicitous how it
may be enforced, are convinced of its usefulness.
If this, my lords, be the chief objection now remaining, a little
consideration will easily remove it; for it is well known, that the
only obstruction of the former law was the danger of information; but
this law, my lords, is so contrived, that it will promote the
execution of itself; for by setting licenses at so low a price, their
number will be multiplied, and every man who has taken a license will
think himself justified in informing against him that shall retail
spirits without a legal right.