JOHN REEVE.

_Another Epistle of_ JOHN REEVE_'s_.

_SIR_,

Your Replication to mine doth but still harp upon the same Matter as

your former, and yet you suppose you have given such Arguments as may

quite silence my former Assertions, were that there are no Spirits

without Bodies, but such as mere Shadows; and that God is not a bodiless

Spirit, but hath and ever had Form, Substance, and Shape, and that is no

other but the Form of a Man.

This is contradicted by you, and so you affirm these Particulars

following.

_1st_, You take at those my Words which said, that if a Spirit have no

Body or Shape, then it is no more then a meer Shadow: This you deny, by

saying, that a Shadow is only privative, but a Spirit, say you, is

positive.

_2dly_, You further say, that there is such immaterial Substances, which

have a separate Existence from such gross Bodies which we have about us;

witness say you the Soul of Man, which is immaterial, and lives after

the Body is dead, which is, say you, confirmed by _Paul_, 2 _Tim._ i.

10. which saith, that the _Gospel brings Life and Immortality to Light_.

_3dly_, This Doctrine, say you, was known by the Light of Nature to the

Heathen Philosophers, and hath since been confirmed by Scripture of the

New Testament to us, and so conclude it no ways repugnant to right

Reason.

_4thly_, You charge me with quoting the Scripture falsly, when I said,

that Christ reply'd to the young Man, saying, _That no Man was good but

one, which was God_; therefore say you, it is false that the Scripture

saith, that God is a Man.

To each of these take this particular Answer, 1. If your Spirit have

neither Shape nor Substance, it is but a Shadow, and no more then what

the _Egyptians_ Sorcerers produced before _Pharaoh_, what _Moses_

brought up were real Substances, but their's no other but Shadows, but

therefore a Spirit without Substance is not positive; for that which is

privative can have no Being without a positive, because that which is

positive hath a Being or Substance: Now he that will not admit God to

have a distinct Being of himself, his God that he worships is nothing

but a Shadow.

_2dly_, Where you speak of Spirits being immaterial Substances; if they

be immaterial, how are they Substances, and what Existence can they

have, and how can a Soul be immortal in a mortal Body; it is said, _the

Soul that Sins, it shall die_; yet say you, it is immortal and cannot

die, and would prove it in 2 _Tim._ i. 10. when as that Place shews

plainly, that it was Christ's Death and Resurrection which _brought Life

and Immortality Light_; so that if there be not a Resurrection, then can

there be no immortal Life.

Therefore it is, that the Scriptures doth affirm, that there can be no

Salvation without a Resurrection, so that if the Dead should not rise,

then were all Faith vain, and God the God of the Dead (seeing Death is

not abolish'd) and not of the Living; so that there is no Spirit that

can subsist or have any Existence without a Body, either Spiritual or

Natural.

Again, doth not the Gospel _bring Life and Immortality to Light_, and is

this Life and Immortality brought to Light without a Body, but it will

have a Spiritual Body suitable to that mortal Spirit made immortal. And

doth not the Scripture affirm, that it shall have a Body like unto God's

own Glorious Body, and yet you say, God hath no Body, and a Soul hath no

Body.

Do you not read also, that Christ had a Body, and that it was after the

_express Image of his Father's Person_: Would you trace substantial

Truth into an Allegory, and say Righteousness, Knowledge, and Holiness

is the Image of God, and yet must have no Body to act for it self in.

When God said, _be ye holy, as I am holy_, must we turn our Souls out of

our Bodies, to make them like your bodiless God.

When we are said to worship God in Spirit and Truth, is this spiritual

Worship performed without a Body, although there is a Mental, Privy, and

Praise without a vocal Expression, yet it must arise from a Heart, and

that Heart must be placed in a Body.

There is no Light without a Sun, no Stream without a Fountain, and no

Spirit without a Body.

_3dly._ As to your third particular, this I must tell you, that no Light

of Nature can discover Spiritual and Evangelical Truths, and it is very

gross for any Man to subject the Spiritual Truths of the Gospel, to the

heathenish Principles of Philosophers, making the New Testament no other

but for the Confirmation of the Principles of Nature, which Nature you

call right Reason, which say, you never repugns the Gospel, nor the

Gospel it.

By this your Discourse I find, that you own that Christ came, but to

confirm the heathenish Principles of Nature, as, that God, and Spirits,

and Angels, were all without Bodies, being immaterial Beings, and you

know not what.

Now give me leave to be plain with you, and to tell you, that I could

never read that the Gospel of Christ was ever sent to enlighten Nature,

Nature or Reason hath no Interest in it at all. In the moral Law it

hath, and therefore it is written, _the Law came by_ Moses; and what to

do, but only to enlighten Reason unto whom the Law was given: But as to

the Gospel, _it came by Jesus Christ_, and particularly belonged to

another Seed; namely, _to the lost Sheep of the House of_ Israel; so

that you can no more distinguish between the Law and the Gospel, than

between the two Natures of Faith and Reason, it is all a Mystery to you.

Do you know what right Reason is, if you do, you must ascend up into the

Kingdom of Heaven, and view it in the holy Angels; for you will not find

neither pure, nor right, nor uncorrupted Reason any where in this Orb

below the Stars: For it is evident that Reason, Notion can never be

capable to comprehend Spiritual Truths, as from the Power of its own

Nature, it only serves to comprehend natural and temporal Things, it

being but natural it self; but Gospel Truths are comprehended by another

Light, according as it is written by _David_ saying, _in thy Light shall

we see Light_, &c.

So that from what is said, we need not fear (as the World have) of the

Heathens rising up in Judgment against us, for maintaining Gospel Truths

against their Darkness of Reason.

_4thly_, As to your fourth Point, where you charge me of fathering upon

the Scripture those things that are not, and you make a Wonderment of

it, that I should say, that God was a Man, and to quote Christ's Words

for it, telling the young Man, _that there was no Man good but one,

which was God_; this you tell me was false, for you say, the Text saith

that _none is good but one, which is God_. Here your Ignorance appears

very great, and may be wonder'd at, considering your great Learning and

continual Study; but it appears, it is but in those heathenish

Philosophers; for observe for better Instruction, did not that young Man

call Christ Master, and own him to be a Man and no more: Now to this you

may find that Christ's Answer did tacitely imply, that if he was but a

Man, he was not perfectly good, and that no Man could be perfectly good.

And furthermore, for a more full Answer in the Old Translation,

attending to mark it, is render'd thus Word for Word, _that there is no

Man good but one, which is God_.

This is plain Scripture, and yet you are ignorant of it; I perceive you

are not very conversant in Scripture, your Philosophy turns you out of

all Scripture Knowledge. But to proceed farther, cannot you find by

Scripture, that God was ever called a Man, did not you ever read that

Scripture that saith, _God was a Man of War_.

Much more might be said of this, and several positive Proofs from

Scripture might be produced to confirm it withal, but because it is not

the general received Opinion, therefore it must be quarrelled with; for

the Honour of this World must be both sought after and submitted to.

And whereas you farther say, that the Apostles of Christ did ever teach

after they had received their Commission, that Spirits were immaterial

and could subsist without Bodies, now answer to this:

It is most certainly evident, that the Apostles never taught, that any

Spirit could subsist without a Body, but the contrary altogether; for

their Doctrine was, that as the Soul and Body lives together, so it dies

together, and at the Last Day rises together, and is ever without

Separation.

When the Apostles said, _That many Spirits were generate into the World,

which denied that Christ was come in the Flesh_, did he mean Spirits

without Bodies: And when _Paul_ said, _that the Spirit speaketh

expresly, that some shall depart from the Faith_: Now what Spirit was

that, but _Paul_'s own Spirit of Faith, in his own mortal Body; for

without a Tongue it could not be expressed.

And where the Apostles tells of the Doctrine of Devils, were those

Devils bodiless, and teached damnable Doctrine.

So that the Apostles never taught that there was any Spirits without

Bodies, but always Spirit and Body went together, and so makes Longitude

and Latitude profoundly, as your Philosophical Notions teacheth,

although you cannot apply it to any sublime or spiritual Thing, you

knowing nothing of it, but all is nothing and of no Substance; and so in

that your Darkness I leave you, seeing you are no Friend to the Light;

and rest yours in all civil Respects,

JOHN REEVE_'s, the only true Witness unto the very true God, amongst

many pretended Spiritual Messengers in this confused Age_.

_An Epistle wrote by the Prophet_ JOHN REEVE _to_ ISAAC PENNINGTON,

_Esq; dated 1658. concerning an Answer to a Book of his, with several

Mysteries and Divine and Spiritual Revelations declared by the Prophet,

concerning God's visible appearing in the Flesh_.

In your Self-return, you seem to mourn over the sunk Spirit of both

Creations, so termed by you. Also you write as though many from a

Satanical Spirit write most accurately, both of the Works of Creation

and Mystery of Redemption by an immediate Gift of God from our Lord

Jesus Christ. To this I answer, a little Season will produce Mourning

enough in you, when you shall see your Angelical Motions like Lightning,

cast down with Confusion of Fear from their former Perfection of

imaginary Glory, rational Dreams and Visions, Revelations, Inspirations,

Experiences, or Voices proceeding from an incomprehensible Spirit.

Again, I have both read and heard a Voice to say, that the Secrets of

the Lord are his Choice Treasures, reserved only for Redeemed ones; but

I never read or heard from any Spiritual wise Man before now, that any

Satanical Spirit was able to intellect deceived Persons, exactly to

write of the hidden Mysteries of the Everlasting God. Again, you pretend

unto no such Revelations as I proceed upon, but say you, there is

another Way more certain than Reason or Revelation, which whether as I

presume you were led into, the Lord will one Day make manifest, from the

true Light of Life Eternal. To this I answer, your Light as terming of

the true Inspirations of the Lord Jesus Christ, written by me to you, is

because as yet his Holy Spirit vails them from your Eyes; but as for

your new Sound of teaching them from your God, more certain than Reason

or Revelation, from the Divine Voice spoken in the Ear, through the

Glorious Mouth of my Lord. I declare that in all Ages the Elect lost

Sheep of _Israel_, did never read or heard of any more than two original

Ways either Natural or Spiritual in Mankind, whether you call them

Creature or Creator, Light or Darkness, Truth and Error, Revelation and

Reason, Inspiration and Imagination, Truth and Unbelief, Flesh and

Spirit, and such like.

'Tis confess'd, that visible Appearances of God or any else unto Mortals

is teaching of all, but he that expects that kind of Teaching any more

until Men are immortalized, lieth under at present as great an imaginary

Deceit, as ever yet appeared in this Land. It is also granted that the

most holy God speaketh to his Chosen Messengers by Voice of Words, even

to the hearing of the Ear, unto which Truth for Ends best known unto

himself, by his gracious Power only, can bear Record in this present

Generation, unto the Grief only of all Angelical, Wise, Envious, Proud,

Inglorious, Hypocritical Reprobates that hear of it.

Moreover, yet if your more sure way of teaching from God were Vision it

self, yet it is impossible for you to enjoy any true and lasting Peace,

unless it swallows up all your former Writings produced from your own

Spirit, without an immediate Commission from God, and in the room

thereof, perswade your Soul to pour in your Oil, into the natural Wounds

of oppressed Persons, under what Opinions or Appearances whatsoever.

Again, you say, O Lord God, pity the Captivity of Man, yea, pity the

Captivity of thy own poor Seed, hear the Prayers of that Spirit that

interceedeth with thee for every thing, not according to any fleshly

Imaginations, but according to Truth and Righteousness of thine one

Ballance. From the God of Truth, to this I answer, concerning that

Spiritual Captivity of the Elect, in Reference of a right understanding

of the Creator, you need not trouble yourself about that, unless you

think through much importuning the unchangeable God, may be perswaded to

loose their Bonds before the decreed time thereof; but if you think that

Glory of God's Eternal Love towards them, will provoke to their

Spiritual Darknesses through the invisible Appearances of his own pure

Light, then you may know, until his own Glorious Season, that all the

Desires of Men or Angels are of no Effect, no nor of the Son himself, if

you imagine a Father besides. 'Tis confess'd, when the Time draweth near

of some great Deliverance of the Chosen of God, usually the Lord

provokes his People to cry unto him with Sighs and Groans, which cannot

be uttered but from the innocent Spirit of his Spiritual redeemed ones,

as his Due, he may receive all Honour, Praise and Glory for their

Deliverance out of their natural Darknesses, unto his marvellous Light.

Again, I declare from the true Light of the true God, that the Spirit

which entereth with the Creator for all Mankind, upon the Account of his

Eternal Happiness, was never principled upon a Spiritual Foundation of

Truth, whatever subtile Expressions of God's righteous Ballance

proceedeth from him. Moreover, is it not the new heavenly Glanses of

Christ Jesus in Man's dark Soul, which upon an immortal Account, becomes

all Light, Life, or ravishing Glory in him; and of the contrary, is it

not the absenting Voice or Virtue of the uncreated Spirit of the Lord

Christ Jesus, that occasions Mens Spirits to be full of Satanical

aspiring Wisdom about the Creator; and whence think you cometh this to

pass, or possible could be of the Spirit, if the Creator were, and

Angels were essentially living in one another there.

Again, if your literal Request unto the Lord God, as in Reference unto

the miserable Captivity of poor Mankind, lying under the miserable Yoak

of unmerciful rich Tyrants, especially over his own innocent Seed or

chosen People, then this will most necessarily follow; nay, you cannot

deny it, if there be any Light in you, that all your conceived Spiritual

Speakings, or Writings, or Prayers, in the Great Day of the Lord Jesus

Christ, will become but fiery burning Death in you of utter Darkness,

according to the true Saying, _If that Light in you be Darkness, how

great is that Darkness_. Unless as before said, answerable to your

Profession of Love unto God, and Pity unto Man, you are a bountiful

Reliever of his oppressed Ones, according to his Bountifulness towards

you, then mind the Virtues of Christ Jesus thus shining in you, will

occasion from the refreshed Bowels of his own Seed new Spiritual

Acknowledgments, and a loving Return in the Lord for you, why because it

is rare to find a merciful rich Man.

_Friend_, I certainly know that if you are one of God's Elect, you

cannot be offended with me for writing the Truth, though at present, I

be contrary to you in Spirit. Again, you write that you would beg unto

the Lord for me, both with Tears and Blood, and you would speak somewhat

concerning me, but you are afraid to open the Spirit before the Season

thereof. _Friend_, As to that if ever the Lord of Life and Glory

manifest himself to your Soul, then you will see clearly the Vanity of

those Words.

Moreover, if I should tell you, that in the pure Eyes of the Lord Christ

Jesus, that one Handful of your Silver Tears, are of more Value than a

Horse Load of your Tears and Blood, you might account it a very strange

saying from me; truly I unfeignedly believe it will be found a principal

Truth, when our Lord Jesus Christ shall say in the Day of Judgment,

_Come ye blessed of my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you, for

when I was a hungry, ye fed me; Go ye Cursed into everlasting Fire, when

I was an hungry ye fed me not_. So that without Controversy, there is

nothing in Man comparable to Love, Mercy and Forgiveness, even to his

greatest Enemies.

Again, It is a marvellous thing, if you or any other Man, should have a

Spiritual Gift to distinguish between Divine and Diabolical Appearances,

and yet defer the Examination thereof to another Season, or did the most

wise God ever Commission any Man or Angel to make a Discovery of any

Spiritual Counterfeits, and yet that Messenger remaineth dark in his own

Understanding, concerning the Creator that sent him. I remember such a

like Scripture Saying as this, _him whom you ignorantly worship, declare

I unto you_. Moreover, if the most wise Creator, either visible or

invisible by himself or Angel, hath appeared in your Spirit, whereby

unto your thinking, I was clearly discovered as a deceived Person among

the rest, is it not a strange thing that you should have Power over that

Light above Men or Angels, before you for the producing of it at another

Season, the Creator himself will visible make it manifest, _even so come

Lord Jesus Christ, for thy glorious Namesake, come quickly, and in the

visible Sight of Men and Angels bear Record whether thy Holy Spirit sent

me (as I have declared almost these three Years) or no_. Again, when the

Lord made Choice of such a simple poor Man as I was, as many can witness

in the City of _London_, that have known me about these twenty Years,

that I might instrumentally discover the two principal Heads of

mischievous Darkness in the Land; as namely, _John Robins_ past, and

_John Tawney_ almost spent, truly I had no Power in me to put by his

Message until another time; why because (whether you can believe it or

no) his Voice was so Glorious in me, that it shun as the Sun, and it was

of Motion swifter than Thought, and so pleasant to be declared by

Tongue; yet for all that Godlike Glory piercing in me, and through me,

there arose a Desire in me to be eased of that Burden of the Lord

committed to my Charge, because of that sharp Sentence that I was to

declare against any Man that should despise it; then the Lord spake

again unto my Soul, Words of turning Death, of sensible unutterable

Darkness, answerable to that _Jonas_-like Rebellion in me, against so

great convincing Glory; and truly I was compelled immediately to cry

unto him for Deliverance from the Wounds or Anguish of my Soul, that I

might presently obey his Word that shined in me with such Light, and

Majesty, and Glory in whatsoever it should command me.

Wherefore _Friend_, happy are you if preserved from slighting an

Appearance, that is contrary unto your Light, though it strike at the

Foundation on which is built all your Spiritual Enjoyments; for alas,

you know in the End, all false Lights will be made manifest unto those

that possess the true Light of Eternal Life in them; Blessed therefore

are those, that in Obedience unto the Creator from a purified Spirit are

compassionate to all Men, but especially to those innocent Appearances,

in the Name of the Lord, though they all differ in their Declaration for

them. If there be but one true Messenger from the Lord among the rest,

they shall as formerly, receive an Angel of God unawares, and with him

be Partakers of the Glorious Secrets of the everliving God, to their

eternal Consolation: For this I know, from the Spirit of Truth, that

those that are left under a Spirit of rejecting and despising of false

Appearances, coming forth in the Name of the Lord, they not clearly

knowing them to be so, they will as readily despise a true Messenger of

the Lord to their eternal Hurt; wherefore are all those, that neither

Honour nor Life it self is dear unto them, but upon an Account of

Spiritual Wisdom amongst wise Men, when the Glorious Things of Eternity,

though in base Appearance presented unto them, from that Spiritual Rock

of all Ages, which is our Lord Jesus Christ, God and Man, is one

distinct Body or Person glorified; for whatsoever Men dream from their

imaginary Gods, of two or three Persons, or a vast incomprehensible

Spirit, essentially living in all Things and Places; from an immediate

Voice from the highest Heavens, I positively affirm against Men or

Angels, that there neither is, nor ever was any other God or Creator,

but that God-man Christ Jesus, which was nailed to the Cross, the which

Glorious God will one Day visibly appear with his mighty Angels, to the

Everlasting Terror of those that reject his Person, as to love a thing

for an infinite God to dwell in or to be; yea this very true God in

Opposition to all other Gods, Men, or Angels, is already come with his

invisible pure piercing Light, to make an everlasting Distinction

between the imaginary notional Mysteries of Men in rational Darkness,

and the Spiritual Mysteries of his everlasting Kingdom, by true

Inspirations from an holy and unerring Spirit. _Even so come Lord Jesus

Christ, visibly also according to thine own Word, come quickly._ Amen.

* * * * *

Yours with all the Elect, in that only wise very true God, which in the

Sight of Men and Angels visible appeared in Flesh, and in that very Body

of Flesh and Bone, is ascended far above all Gods, Heavens, Angels, or

Men, and there to remain until the Resurrection of all elect Things, or

the Judgment-Day, whose uncreated Spirit of fiery Love, is all Variety

of immortal Crowns of new ravishing Glories, prepared for all those that

long for his visible appearing, to make an everlasting Separation,

between the merciful Elect, and unmerciful Reprobate.

JOHN REEVE, _the only true Witness unto the very true God, amongst

many pretended Spiritual Messengers in this confused Age_.

_FINIS._

Transcriber's Notes:

Archaic and colloquial spelling and punctuation was retained.

Missing or obscured punctuation was corrected.

Text that was in italics is enclosed by underscores (_italics_).

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