Mr. KELLERMAN. But after the flurry of shots, I recall her saying,
"What are they doing to you?" Now again, of course, my comparison of
the voice of her speech--certainly, I have heard it many times, and in
the car there was conversation she was carrying on through shock, I am
sure.
Mr. SPECTER. Well, going back to the precise time that you heard the
President say, "My God, I am hit," do you recollect whether she said
anything at that time?
Mr. KELLERMAN. No.
Mr. SPECTER. Whether or not you can re-create what she said?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Not that I can recall right then, sir. This statement,
or whatever she said, happened after all the shooting was over.
Mr. SPECTER. All right. Now, you have described hearing a noise which
sounded like a firecracker and you have described turning to your right
and described hearing the President's voice and, again, what was your
next motion, if any, or movement, if any?
Mr. KELLERMAN. After I was sure that his statement was right that he
was hit, turned from the back I come right down----
Mr. SPECTER. You just indicated that you had turned to the left. Had
you turned to the left after hearing his voice?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes; certainly.
Mr. SPECTER. And what did you see? You have described what you saw in
terms of position of his hands.
Mr. KELLERMAN. That was it.
Mr. SPECTER. What did you do next?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is when I completely turned to my right and grabbed
for the mike in the same motion, sideways telling the driver, "Let's
get out of here; we are hit."
Mr. SPECTER. Will you give us the best estimate of the lapse of
time from the instant you heard the sound which appeared to you to
be a firecracker until you instructed Mr. Greer in the way you have
described?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Seconds.
Mr. SPECTER. How many seconds?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Three or four.
Mr. SPECTER. Now, how long did it take you to relay the instructions
which you have told us about to Special Agent Lawson; what your best
estimate would be?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Instant, in seconds again. Again it is three to five.
Mr. SPECTER. Now, in your prior testimony you described a flurry of
shells into the car. How many shots did you hear after the first noise
which you described as sounding like a firecracker?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Mr. Specter, these shells came in all together.
Mr. SPECTER. Are you able to say how many you heard?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I am going to say two, and it was like a double
bang--bang, bang.
Mr. SPECTER. You mean now two shots in addition to the first noise?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes, sir; yes, sir; at least.
Mr. SPECTER. What is your best estimate of the time, in seconds, from
the first noise sounding like a firecracker until the second noise
which you heard?
Mr. KELLERMAN. This was instantaneous.
Mr. SPECTER. No; let me repeat the question so I am sure you understand
it. From the time you first heard the noise coming to your right rear,
which you described as sounding like a firecracker, until you heard the
flurry of shots?
Mr. KELLERMAN. This is about how long it took, sir. As I am viewing,
trying to determine this noise, I turned to my right and I heard the
voice and I came back and I verify it and speak to the driver, grab the
mike, these shots come in.
Mr. SPECTER. Well, you have described it as 3 to 4 seconds from the
time----
Mr. KELLERMAN. No more.
Mr. SPECTER. From the time of the first noise--wait a minute--until you
gave the instruction to Mr. Greer and then as you made the statement
to Special Agent Lawson over the microphone that was an instantaneous
timespan as you have described it.
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes, sir.
Mr. SPECTER. How soon thereafter did the flurry of shots come?
Mr. KELLERMAN. They came in, Mr. Specter, while I am delivering that
radio message.
Mr. SPECTER. To Mr. Lawson. All right. Was there any timespan which
you could discern between the first and second shots and what you have
described as the flurry?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I will estimate 5 seconds, if that.
Representative FORD. But this flurry took place while you were occupied
with these other activities; is that correct?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right, sir.
Representative FORD. You don't recall precisely a second shot and a
third shot such as you did in the case of the first?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Let me give you an illustration, sir, before I can give
you an answer. You have heard the sound barrier, of a plane breaking
the sound barrier, bang, bang? That is it.
Representative FORD. This is for the second and the third, or the
flurry as you described it?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right; that is right, sir.
Mr. SPECTER. On your 5-second estimate, was that in reference, Mr.
Kellerman, to the total timespan from the first noise until the flurry
ended?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right; that is right.
Mr. SPECTER. All right. Now, when the flurry occurred then, were you
still facing forward talking into the microphone to Lawson?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right.
Mr. SPECTER. All right. Then precisely what was your next movement
after completing the delivery of that message to Lawson?
Mr. KELLERMAN. When I completed the delivery of those instructions to
Lawson, I just hung up the receiver and looked back.
Mr. SPECTER. To your right this time--to your left; pardon me.
Mr. KELLERMAN. To my left; that is right. This is when I first viewed
Mr. Hill, who was on the back of the----
Mr. SPECTER. Precisely where was he in that instant?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Lying right across the trunk of the car with Mrs.
Kennedy on the left rear. Mr. Hill's head was right up in back of her.
Mr. SPECTER. When you describe the left rear you mean as the car was
facing?
Mr. KELLERMAN. As the car is traveling, sir; yes, sir. He was lying
across the trunk of this car, feet on this side.
Mr. SPECTER. Was he flat across the trunk of the car?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Flat; that is right.
Mr. SPECTER. What was the position of Mrs. Kennedy's body at that time?
Mr. KELLERMAN. She was sitting up in the corner of this back seat, like
this.
Mr. SPECTER. So that she was on the buttocks area of her body at that
time?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes, sir.
Mr. SPECTER. And what movement, if any, did you observe Mrs. Kennedy
make at that time?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I never did see Mrs. Kennedy leave that back seat, sir.