TESTIMONY OF JAMES HERBERT MARTIN RESUMED

The President's Commission reconvened at 9:20 p.m.

Mr. DULLES. The Committee will come to order.

Will you continue with the testimony?

Mr. REDLICH. Thank you, Mr. Dulles.

Mr. Martin, at our last session I asked you whether you knew Jack Ruby,

and you replied that you did. You indicated the brief contact that you

have had with him and the two times, I believe, that you have been to

his business establishment?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. REDLICH. Apart from your own personal contact with Jack Ruby, do

you have any other information about him and his activities which you

would like to present before this Commission?

Mr. MARTIN. No, nothing that I definitely know about him. It is just he

is a city character. He is very friendly to everyone.

Mr. REDLICH. Please understand I am not asking you for rumors or that

type of thing.

Mr. MARTIN. No, I know. Well, just what I know of him, he seems very

friendly to everyone, and he is always around. You are liable to see

him anywhere.

Mr. REDLICH. Has he ever been to the motel that you have?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes, I mentioned that.

Mr. REDLICH. Oh, yes.

Mr. MARTIN. He brought that twist board out there one time.

Mr. REDLICH. Never been there as a guest?

Mr. MARTIN. No.

Mr. REDLICH. I hand you a copy of an invoice for a Revere recorder and

a 1,200-foot reel of recording tape, and ask you if you have ever seen

this?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes. That is a tape recorder that I rented and recorded

the----

Mr. REDLICH. I will ask you about it shortly. I would just like to know

if you are familiar with it.

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. REDLICH. Mr. Chairman, I am marking this as Commission Exhibit No.

332, and ask that it be admitted in evidence.

Mr. DULLES. Any objection?

Mr. LEECH. No, sir.

Mr. DULLES. It may be admitted.

(The tape recorder and tape invoice referred to were marked

Commission's Exhibit No. 332 for identification and received in

evidence.)

Mr. REDLICH. Mr. Martin, I hand you Commission Exhibit No. 332, and

ask you to tell the Commission the conditions under which this invoice

arose?

Mr. MARTIN. We had Marina's manuscript interpreted by Ilya Mamantov,

and this was part of it. He was only able to interpret about half of it.

Mr. REDLICH. He interpreted it and put it on tape?

Mr. MARTIN. And we recorded that on tape as he interpreted it.

Mr. DULLES. How do you mean interpreted?

Mr. MARTIN. He read it in English?

Mr. DULLES. Oh, I see, translated it.

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. DULLES. From Russian into English?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. REDLICH. When I asked you this afternoon about your knowledge as to

the accuracy of that story, I take it your reply was based upon this

translation?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. REDLICH. And this only encompasses about half of the entire story,

is that right?

Mr. MARTIN. It is more than half, it is about 15 pages, I guess.

Mr. REDLICH. Did she consult with you at all in the preparation of that

story?

Mr. MARTIN. No.

Mr. REDLICH. And there is nothing on this tape other than the English

translation of that Russian story?

Mr. MARTIN. That is true.

Mr. DULLES. Do we have that translation as well as the copy of the

original?

Mr. REDLICH. Yes, Mr. Chairman, we have the original in Russian and

then it was translated by Mr. Gopadze, of the Secret Service.

Mr. MARTIN. Actually our translation is very poor. He was not able to

translate properly into English a lot of the phrases.

Mr. DULLES. Who is "he," Illa? Isn't that Ilya, by the way?

Mr. MARTIN. I am not sure.

Mr. DULLES. That is generally the Russian, I don't know.

Mr. RANKIN. That is right.

Mr. MARTIN. It might be.

Mr. DULLES. Yes.

Mr. MARTIN. But he is professor at SMU. He has a list of titles that

long. He is very well thought of. I think he works for Sun Oil Company,

and is a well-respected individual. His wife and his mother, I believe,

teach Russian also. I think his mother taught Mrs. Paine a good deal of

her Russian.

Mr. REDLICH. Mr. Martin, I would like to show you Commission Exhibit

No. 325 which was introduced earlier today. Mr. Leech, I believe you

have a photostat of this. If you could hand it to me during the course

of this questioning. I would appreciate it.

Mr. LEECH. Yes.

Mr. REDLICH. Thank you.

Could you tell the Commission what this document purports to state, and

then I will ask you about individual items.

Mr. MARTIN. These are contracts that we have made both in writing and

verbally for Marina Oswald's right, her story rights.

Mr. REDLICH. And the first item appearing on Commission Exhibit No. 325

is a contract with Texitalia Films.

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. REDLICH. Would you describe the terms and conditions of that

contract?

Mr. MARTIN. Texitalia Films is planning a 60-minute technicolor

documentary to start. They will pay $75,000 for World-Wide movie and

the TV rights.

Mr. DULLES. Excuse me, is this a documentary of Marina's life?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes. Any movie or television appearances Marina would be

paid $7,500 plus expenses for each appearance. Then for each personal

appearance, for instance, the film opens in St. Louis on such and such

a date and they would like for her to be there to make a personal

appearance for the showing, the opening of the film, she would receive

$1,500 plus expenses for each public appearance of that nature.

Mr. REDLICH. And this contract according to this exhibit was signed on

February 11, 1964?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. LEECH. By her?

Mr. MARTIN. No, by me acting for her.

Mr. REDLICH. By you acting on behalf of Mrs. Oswald?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes, in accordance with my contract with her.

Mr. REDLICH. The second item appearing here is a contract with Life

magazine. Would you tell the Commission about that?

Mr. MARTIN. Life magazine purchased the rights, North American rights

on a photograph of Lee Harvey Oswald with a rifle and pistol, primarily

for their use on a cover issue.

Mr. DULLES. That is what appeared on the recent cover issue, I guess,

it was 2 weeks ago.

Mr. MARTIN. Yes, sir.

Now, that $5,000 has been paid. We have the $5,000 in an escrow account.

Mr. REDLICH. Did you actually have in your possession the photograph, a

copy of which appeared on the cover of Life magazine?

Mr. MARTIN. No.

Mr. REDLICH. Could you tell us how this contract was consummated, in

view of the fact that Life magazine apparently printed on its cover a

photograph which you never possessed?

Mr. MARTIN. They knew the photographs belonged to Marina. They have a

common law copyright, and the only way they could legally use the film

is to purchase the rights from Marina.

Mr. REDLICH. Did Life magazine indicate to you where they obtained the

photograph?

Mr. MARTIN. No.

Mr. REDLICH. Have you had conversations with other publications

concerning that photograph?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes. I made the contact with the London Daily Mirror

for the purchase of the British Commonwealth rights on that same

photograph, and they guaranteed $2,200 plus 50-50 split on what they

sold in the Commonwealth. It was restricted to the Commonwealth only.

However, the London Daily Mail came out with the photograph prior to

the Mirror, and I was informed by Mr. Weggand of the London Daily

Express that the Detroit Free Press had sold this photograph to the

London Daily Mail for $500.

Mr. REDLICH. Do you have any idea how the Detroit Free Press obtained

this photograph?

Mr. MARTIN. No. I talked to Ken Murray, who I was informed was the

attorney for the Detroit Free Press.

Mr. REDLICH. Where did you talk to him?

Mr. MARTIN. At his home in Detroit.

Mr. REDLICH. By phone?

Mr. MARTIN. By telephone. And he stated that the photograph was public

property, and not covered under common law copyright. I asked him where

he got the photo, and he said he got it at the same place as Life did,

through a leak in the Commission. I talked to Life magazine attorney--I

can't remember his name. It is a very odd name. It begins with an "S".

Now, Murray said that Life had informed him that they had gotten it

from a leak through the Commission, and I contacted Life and he denied

saying anything of the sort to Murray.

However, Murray insisted that that is where he got that and he figured

it was public domain.

Mr. REDLICH. At the start of today's testimony when you mentioned

the possibility of a leak with regard to this photograph, something

that you said prior to the actual start of hearings, Mr. Rankin and I

commented on that assertion.

Would you tell the Commission what we said?

Mr. MARTIN. That there was definitely not a leak in the Commission, and

that you would certainly find out what Murray was talking about.

Mr. REDLICH. Did you talk to an editor of the Detroit Free Press with

regard to this photograph?

Mr. MARTIN. I called at night. It was at night, and I asked for the

news editor. He was not in, so I talked to a reporter, and he couldn't

say anything about it. He referred me to Ken Murray and gave me his

home telephone number.

Mr. REDLICH. The next item on Commission Exhibit No. 325 has reference

to Stern Magazine.

Would you tell the Commission about that, please?

Mr. MARTIN. Stern Magazine we have been working with since the middle

of December. They have been quite patient actually. For $12,500 they

wanted Marina's memoirs and photographs, available photographs for use

in Germany and Italy only. They wanted exclusive use in those two

countries. Then they would endeavor to sell these same memoirs and

pictures to other European countries, limiting it only to European

countries, and take a 30 percent commission on any sales that they

made, the remaining 70 percent going to Marina.

Mr. REDLICH. Has this contract been signed?

Mr. MARTIN. Yes.

Mr. REDLICH. Do you know when it was signed? Can you approximate the

date?

Mr. MARTIN. I confirmed it by wire to them. It is in the exhibits.

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