Pall Mall, Thursday, March 6th, 1783.
My dear Brother,
You will very naturally have expected, long before this, to have
heard of the establishment of some new system of Government,
upon the ruins of that which is now avowedly broke up in every
part of it. Still, however, the country remains, at this urgent
and critical moment, wholly without any Government whatsoever.
When all hopes were over of forming an Administration from the
remains of Lord Shelburne's, acting under some other head, the
King sent, as I imagined he would, for Lord North; having
previously had some communication with him through Lord
Guilford, whom he saw on Sunday. Lord North has been twice with
the King, and has both times been pressed to form some system to
the exclusion of the Duke of Portland and Fox, which he has
peremptorily refused; alleging the necessity of strength, and
the impossibility of supporting Government in Parliament, except
on the basis of their coalition. The last time, the conference
is said to have ended with his being told, that if _he_ was
determined, he would find that the person who talked to him
could be so likewise. In the meantime, Parliament is kept
sitting, and must be so; because Fox declares his resolution not
to suffer the Mutiny Bill to pass till a Government is formed.
In this state of things, it is difficult to do any business
whatever; because those who hold their situations only for the
moment, are of course disinclined to take any step beyond the
mere routine of office. I have, however, prevailed upon
Townshend to speak to the King about the Peers to be created
previous to the ----. I enclose my note to him upon the subject,
and his answer.
The Irish Bill stood for yesterday, and as it had been so often
put off, I thought it better not to delay it any longer.
Accordingly, I moved to go into the Committee. (Neville in the
Chair, Lord Nugent peremptorily refusing, and Jemmy not being
well.)
Before we went into the Committee, Percival desired to say, that
as he understood his idea had not been approved of by the House
in general, and that every one seemed to wish that this Bill
might pass without any division or difference of opinion, he
should not now insist upon it, though he was not convinced that
the motion was improper.
Mr. Eden said, that the principle of the Bill met his hearty
concurrence; though he wished to observe that the clause about
the judicature seemed to him so worded, as to declare that
England never had the right of appellant judicature, which was
not the case.
Lord Newhaven said, he saw no reason for not inserting the
clause, and he should, therefore, move an instruction to the
Committee, to receive a clause to prevent any treason, or
mis-prision of treason, committed in Ireland, from being
inquired of or tried in Great Britain.
Lord Lucan seconded him.
Lord Nugent objected to this. He said that, originally, when
attempts had been made in the House of Commons in favour of
Ireland, no man had been a more eager or strenuous supporter of
them than himself. But now, ever since he had seen the
disposition of this country favourable to Ireland, and that it
was the sincere wish of all Englishmen to adopt the most liberal
principles on that subject, he had thought that it became more
proper for persons connected with Ireland to remain silent, and
to leave the measures in favour of that country to be carried
through by Englishmen. In the present instance, he wished that
the clause in question had not been proposed, because it was
attended with more difficulty than the noble Lord seemed to be
aware of. The Act of Henry VIII., which had been referred to,
had been adopted and confirmed as an Irish Act by the Parliament
of that country. This being the case, the repeal of the English
Act could have no effect whatever, because the Irish statute
would still remain un-repealed, and could only be removed by the
Parliament of Ireland; whilst, on the other hand, we should be
to take away a law which had been so much approved by Ireland as
to be by them adopted.
Mr. Herbert read the Irish statute alluded to, and said that the
disposition towards Ireland which appeared in every part of the
House, could not but inspire that country with every sentiment
of affection to Great Britain.
I then said, that if the motion made by the noble Lord was
persisted in, I should most undoubtedly not oppose it, because
it was impossible for me to give opposition to any measure which
had even the appearance of adding strength to the exclusive
rights of Ireland; that I was of opinion myself that the
jurisdiction in question was not, by any means whatever,
conveyed by the Act referred to; that the statute of Henry VIII.
was not intended to affect any part of the King's dominions was
clear to a demonstration, from the subsequent statute of the
same King in explanation of it--the preamble of which, referring
to the former Act, does expressly speak of treasons committed
out of this realm, _and other the King's dominions_; and that
the circumstance of the adoption of the former Act by the Irish
Parliament was a clear proof that it was not considered as an
Act which could bind Ireland; and I could not help wishing that
the noble Lord would withdraw his motion, for the reason stated
by the noble Lord (Lord Nugent), that we could not repeal an
Irish Act; and that without so doing, the repeal of the English
statute (even if it did give any jurisdiction) would be
nugatory. Besides this, there was another reason. The framers of
this Bill had certainly never supposed that it could go to
remove at once every difficulty which might arise, and to settle
at once every point which might require to be settled when, as
in the present case, a great stream was turned into a new
channel. Our idea went to the unequivocal and permanent
establishment of those points which were in the contemplation of
Government last year, to those things to which Parliament then
intended to pledge, and to which I had ever been of opinion they
had inviolably pledged the faith of the nation. That by so
doing, we conceived we should establish a foundation of
confidence, upon which all less important points might be
adjusted with mutual temper, harmony and affection; that Ireland
could certainly entertain no doubt that the same principles
which had guided us in the great and extensive considerations
would continue to actuate our conduct in those of less concern
and more confined regulation; (that in the present case, if the
English Act was a grievance to Ireland, so also would the Irish
be to England.)[1] At the same time, however, I begged that it
might be clearly understood that this clause was not objected to
on the ground of its being a new claim on the part of Ireland.
Ireland had last year, in the Addresses of her Parliament,
claimed to be a distinct and independent kingdom. If, therefore,
this Act affected her independence--and in that light it was
objected to--so far it certainly was not in any respect a new
claim. To supreme legislation and supreme judicature, all
criminal jurisdiction was certainly annexed and inseparable.
Lord Newhaven then withdrew his motion.
Percival said, that the exercise of this jurisdiction had been
antecedent to the Act of Henry VIII.
In the Committee, Lord Beauchamp objected to the word
established, which he wished to alter to the word recognized;
but that, unless it was agreed to, he would not press it.
I said that, as every word of the Bill had undergone the most
serious discussion, and the most attentive consideration, on
both sides of the water, and that as the present form had been
approved of, I wished the Bill might receive no alteration, in
order that it might pass, without any possible difference of
opinion, in any part of the House.
He then proposed to put for ever instead of for the future; to
which I agreed.
To the last clause, to prevent the receiving writs of error,
&c., I moved an addition, which was drawn by the
Attorney-General in consequence of the enclosed papers from Mr.
Travers. I enclose also a letter to him, which I wish you would
let Bernard or Cooke copy, and send to him, with a copy of the
clause in question.
Upon the whole, the business has gone off better than I
expected; though I take it for granted that we shall hear again,
both of the criminal judicature and of the _recognition_. Pitt
offered to state the objections at large to the latter; but I
thought it better not.
Lord Bellamont has written a letter in the newspapers about the
criminal judicature, which I suppose you have seen. I saw him in
the House, and told him the part I meant to take. He said he
wished it had been inserted in the Bill, but hoped at least that
I would guard against the idea of its being called a new claim.
To this you will see that part of my speech was directed; and
for that reason, as well as on account of the miserable
statement of it in the papers of to-day, I wish that you would
revise and publish it in the Irish newspapers.
After this business was over, Eden wished that Ireland might be
inserted in the American Intercourse Bill. I was gone; but the
Solicitor-General said that he thought it pretty extraordinary
that, on the very day that the House had declared that they had
no right to legislate for Ireland, that honourable gentlemen
should wish to make trade laws for her.
I hope to be with you now in the course of a week; but wait for
your answer to my letters, having heard nothing from you since
yours of the 16th of February. Adieu.
Believe me ever,
My dear brother,
Most affectionately yours,
W. W. G.
[Footnote 1: Query the inserting this, which I omitted in my speech.]
The letter to Mr. Townshend respecting the Irish peerages contained the
expression of a desire on the part of Lord Temple to take His Majesty's
pleasure on the subject of an increase of the Irish peerage. Before Lord
Temple had entered on the Government of Ireland, His Majesty had
communicated to him his disinclination to increase the Irish peerage at
that time; but as a dissolution of Parliament was now proposed, which
would involve in troublesome and expensive contests many gentlemen upon
whom it was supposed His Majesty might be inclined to confer that mark
of the royal favour, and who had been recommended for it by former
Lord-Lieutenants, Lord Temple thought the opportunity favourable for
such a creation. Mr. Townshend's answer, conveying the substance of a
note he had received from the King in reply, is curiously characteristic
of the imperative interest taken by His Majesty in all matters of a
personal nature. After expressing His Majesty's confidence that "Lord
Temple will be as sparing as possible in his list of peers," Mr.
Townshend adds, "Mr. Pennington must be included in the promotions. If
advances are proposed, the Dowager Lady Longford must be a Countess; and
if any peer of a junior date to Lord Dartrey is advanced, he must be
promoted in the same degree."
Under the circumstances in which Lord Temple was placed by the
resignation of Lord Shelburne, and the delays that followed in the
settlement of a new Cabinet, Lord Temple resolved to resign his
Government of Ireland. Unwillingness to embarrass His Majesty
unnecessarily had hitherto restrained him from carrying this resolution
formally into effect; but it appears from the following letters that he
transmitted his final resolution to his brother, who communicated it to
Pitt. The sound judgment of Mr. Grenville is shown with remarkable
clearness in his observations on Lord Temple's answer to the Duke of
Portland, which was not marked with the decision demanded by the
occasion; and his prudence and discretion are equally apparent in the
advice he tenders to Lord Temple, upon the necessity of resigning his
office into the hands of his successor, instead of throwing it up with
an "appearance of fretfulness and intemperance." The contrast between
the temperaments of these distinguished men is frequently felt
throughout this Correspondence, in the traits of calm, practical wisdom
which will be found on the one side, affectionately checking and
controlling the tendency to hasty constructions and impatient action
that existed on the other.