Hon. J. B. VARNUM, _Speaker_, _&c._

_Naval Establishment._

Mr. RANDOLPH, from the committee to whom was referred the resolution

respecting the reduction of the Naval Establishment, reported the

following bill; which was twice read, and referred to a Committee of

the Whole:

[Here follows the Bill.]

MONDAY, April 23.

_Loan Bill._

The House resolved itself into a Committee of the Whole, on the bill

authorizing a loan for a sum of money not exceeding the amount of the

principal of the public debt reimbursable during the year 1810.

[In the discussion which took place on this bill, there was no

objection to the principle of it. Every gentleman who spoke assented

to the propriety of placing at the disposal of the Government a sum of

money fully adequate to meet the appropriations authorized by law for

the present year.]

Mr. DANA wished to ascertain the precise amount of the principal of the

debt reimbursable during the year 1810, with a view to inserting the

sum in the body of the bill.

Some difference of opinion appeared to exist as to the exact amount

of principal reimbursable. The sum annually applicable to the payment

of the public debt is eight millions of dollars. The sum left, after

paying the interest of it for the year, is annually applicable to the

extinguishment of the principal. The exact amount of interest payable

on the public debt during this year not being known, there was a

difficulty in ascertaining the exact amount of principal reimbursable.

The sum of $4,800,000 was mentioned.

Mr. DANA moved to amend the bill so as to authorize a loan "not

exceeding $4,800,000, being the amount of the principal reimbursable,"

&c. This motion was supported by the mover, and Messrs. GOLD, SHEFFEY,

QUINCY, UPHAM, TALLMADGE, and PICKMAN, and opposed by Messrs. BACON, W.

ALSTON, and MONTGOMERY.

The arguments in favor of the motion were, generally, that it was

improper to attempt to disguise any thing by giving to it a specious

name; that borrowing money should not be called paying the public debt;

that all authority given to borrow money should be express and specific

as to the sum. It was said in reply, that there could be no objection

that the truth should appear on the face of a bill; that this sum not

being wanted to defray the ordinary expenses of the Government, but to

pay debts heretofore contracted, the phraseology was perfectly correct;

that it was as specific in fact as if expressed in so many figures.

Mr. DANA varied his motion, after debate, on account of the uncertainty

which appeared to exist as to the sum reimbursable, and of course as

to the sum to be loaned. He moved to amend the bill so as to give

authority to borrow a sum of money "not exceeding four millions of

dollars."

This motion was supported and opposed by the same gentlemen who

debated the former motion. In support of the motion it was said, that

this sum was all that the Secretary of the Treasury had asked for,

and was therefore as much as ought to be given. The advocates of the

amendment also said that they were averse to legislating blindfold, to

voting millions without knowing for what, or to surrendering up their

judgments to Executive discretion, under an idea that the President

would not borrow more than was necessary.

In reply it was said, that since the Secretary of the Treasury had

made the estimate in question, other expenses had been incurred; that

it was impossible to tell the precise amount which was wanted until

Congress should adjourn, as it was impossible to tell on one day what

appropriations they would make the next day; that, if not necessary,

the authority to borrow would not be used; as in the case of the

loan authorized at the last session of Congress, not a cent of which

had been actually borrowed. That law had granted an authority nearly

similar to this in nearly the same language.

Mr. DANA'S motion was negatived--52 to 29.

Mr. QUINCY observed that he felt but one difficulty on this subject. He

could not agree to borrow an amount greater than the Secretary of the

Treasury had said was necessary. He, therefore, moved to amend the bill

by adding to it the following proviso:

"_Provided_, That nothing in this act contained shall be

construed to authorize any sum to be borrowed greater than four

millions of dollars."

The motion was lost--ayes 28.

The bill was then ordered to be engrossed, and read the third time

to-morrow.

TUESDAY, April 24.

_Reduction of the Navy._

The House in Committee of the Whole on the bill to reduce the Naval

Establishment of the United States.

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