Mr. TAVENNER. What is your full name, Mr. Halonen?
Mr. HALONEN. Oiva R. Halonen.
Mr. TAVENNER. Will you spell it, please.
Mr. HALONEN. The first name is O-i-v-a; the initial is R; the
last name is Halonen, H-a-l-o-n-e-n.
Mr. TAVENNER. It is noted you are accompanied by counsel. Will
counsel please identify himself for the record?
Mr. SYKES. Jay, J-a-y, G. Sykes, S-y-k-e-s.
Mr. TAVENNER. Mr. Halonen, when and where were you born?
Mr. HALONEN. In Minnesota, in 1912.
Mr. TAVENNER. Where do you now reside?
Mr. HALONEN. In Seattle.
Mr. TAVENNER. What is your occupation?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I am a machinist.
Mr. TAVENNER. How long have you worked as a machinist in
Seattle?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. The last 12 years.
Mr. TAVENNER. Will you tell the committee, please, briefly,
what your educational training has been?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Merely a high-school graduate.
Mr. TAVENNER. What employment have you had in Seattle other
than the employment beginning 12 years ago which you just described?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Prior to the time that I became a machinist I
knocked around in the apple orchards, harvest fields, did odd jobs this
way and that way--no particular trade.
Mr. TAVENNER. Mr. Halonen, where did you live in 1932?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. In Minnesota.
Mr. TAVENNER. What was your first address on arriving in
Seattle?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. 1011 East Columbia Street.
Mr. TAVENNER. During what period of time did you live at that
address?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. From the middle of 1933, I would say; between the
15th of May and the last of June, somewhere in there, for approximately
a year, or a year and a half. I can’t remember.
Mr. TAVENNER. I hand you Dennett Exhibit No. 4, purporting to
be a test or an examination taken at the Young Pioneer camp at Pine
Lake in the State of Washington. Please examine the exhibit and state
whether or not the handwriting found thereon is your handwriting.
(Document handed to the witness.)
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. On advice of counsel, that the answer to that
question might tend to incriminate me, I must invoke the fifth
amendment of the Constitution of the United States.
Mr. TAVENNER. Will you examine, please, the name at the top of
the test paper and read what name you find there?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I must invoke the fifth amendment again, for the
same reasons as stated before.
Mr. VELDE. Mr. Chairman, I notice the witness states that he
must invoke the fifth amendment.
The fifth amendment is a privilege that you have, and you are under no
compulsion to invoke the fifth amendment.
The only question is, do you?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I do invoke the fifth amendment.
Mr. TAVENNER. Will you examine the exhibit again, please, and
state what you see on the line immediately under the name appearing at
the top of the page.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Again, I do invoke the fifth amendment for the
reasons previously stated.
Mr. TAVENNER. I am not asking you, Witness, whether or not
that is your address. I am asking if you will read what appears on
the document? I am asking you no question other than what is it that
appears on the document.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I respectfully give the same answer I gave
before, on advice of counsel.
Mr. TAVENNER. Do you see it before you?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Yes; I see it.
Mr. TAVENNER. Rather than lose more time, I will read into the
record from this document that the address on the line under the name
Oiva Halonen is 1011 East Columbia, Seattle.
Mr. MOULDER. Is this the same document that you referred to as
an exhibit which was identified by Mr. Dennett?
Mr. TAVENNER. Yes, sir; and it is marked “Dennett Exhibit No.
4.” Was that your address in 1933?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. MOULDER. Did he state what his address was at the
beginning of his testimony when he first appeared on the stand?
Mr. TAVENNER. Yes, sir; I asked him where he lived when he
first came to Seattle, and it is the same address, if I recall the
testimony correctly.
So that there may be no uncertainty about it, what was your address in
1933 when you came to Seattle?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. It was 1011 East Columbia.
Mr. MOULDER. Is that the same address appearing on this
exhibit?
Mr. HALONEN. Yes.
Mr. VELDE. May I inquire of counsel the year he attended the
youth camp at Pine Lake, as testified to by Mr. Dennett. Was that in
1932?
Mr. TAVENNER. No, sir. The year was not specified.
Are you acquainted with Mr. Dennett who just testified here a moment
ago?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Was the name Dennett or Bennett?
Mr. TAVENNER. Mr. Dennett.
Mr. HALONEN. On advice of counsel, on the grounds that the
question might tend to incriminate me, I do invoke the fifth amendment
and refuse to answer the question.
Mr. VELDE. I can’t possibly see how the admission that you
were acquainted with any person would possibly tend to incriminate you.
So I ask the chairman to direct the witness to answer the question.
Mr. MOULDER. The witness is directed to answer the question.
Mr. HALONEN. I do invoke the fifth amendment.
Mr. MOULDER. I want you to answer this question.
You say upon advice of counsel you are advised that the answer might
tend to incriminate you. Now is it because of the advice of counsel or
do you yourself feel that it will incriminate you?
Mr. HALONEN. I do it on advice of counsel. Counsel advises me
to invoke the fifth amendment.
Mr. MOULDER. May I ask you this:
Would your answer tend to incriminate you?
(The witness confers with this counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. It might tend to incriminate me.
Mr. MOULDER. Proceed, Mr. Tavenner.
Mr. TAVENNER. Did you attend a Young Pioneers summer camp at
Pine Lake in the State of Washington?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Could we be more specific as to time?
Mr. TAVENNER. Did you attend any “Pioneer” summer camp at any
time?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. On advice of counsel, I do again invoke the fifth
amendment on grounds of possible self-incrimination.
Mr. TAVENNER. Are you acquainted with Barbara Hartle?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Again on advice of counsel, I find myself in the
position that I do invoke the fifth amendment on grounds of possible
self-incrimination.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. TAVENNER. Were you present in the hearing room at the time
Mr. Dennett identified you as having been a member of the Communist
Party?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Yes; I was in the room.
Mr. TAVENNER. You heard his testimony?
Mr. HALONEN. Yes.
Mr. TAVENNER. Was he correct in stating that you became a
member of the Communist Party?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I find myself in the situation of invoking the
fifth amendment again on grounds of possible self-incrimination.
Mr. TAVENNER. And you do so invoke?
Mr. HALONEN. I do so invoke.
Mr. MOULDER. Do you decline to answer the question for that
reason?
Mr. HALONEN. I decline to answer the question on grounds of
possible self-incrimination under the fifth amendment.
Mr. TAVENNER. Mrs. Barbara Hartle testified in June of 1954
before this committee as follows:
Oiva Halonen was a member of the Communist Party in the central
region; lived in that area; and was connected with the national
group’s work of the district.
Do you desire to explain her testimony in any way or to deny it? Or do
you confirm it as being true?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I decline under the grounds of the fifth
amendment, on possible self-incrimination.
Mr. TAVENNER. Are you now a member of the Communist Party?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I decline to answer that question under the fifth
amendment for the reasons stated before.
Mr. TAVENNER. Have you ever been a member of the Communist
Party?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I decline to answer that question for the same
reasons.
Mr. TAVENNER. Have you engaged in various activities of the
Communist Party within mass organizations in the area of Seattle?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I decline to answer that question for the reasons
stated previously, under the fifth amendment.
Mr. TAVENNER. Were you at any time affiliated with the Joint
Anti-Fascist Refugee Committee?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I decline again, under the fifth amendment, to
answer that question, as previously stated.
Mr. TAVENNER. Were you actively engaged in the work of the
Young Communist League in 1942?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I decline to answer that question under the fifth
amendment, as previously stated.
Mr. TAVENNER. Have you traveled outside of the continental
limits of the United States?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. SYKES. May we have a minute, please.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. MOULDER. Let the record show that the witness is
conferring with counsel.
Mr. HALONEN. To the last question I again invoke the fifth
amendment on grounds of possible self-incrimination, and refuse to
answer.
Mr. TAVENNER. Were you a member of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade?
Mr. HALONEN. Once again I do decline to answer the question on
the grounds of the fifth amendment, as previously stated.
Mr. TAVENNER. Were you in the Spanish area 14 months during
the Spanish Civil War?
Mr. HALONEN. Once again I decline to answer the question,
under the fifth amendment, on grounds previously stated.
Mr. TAVENNER. Have you had any affiliation with the
International Workers Order?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Once again I decline to answer the question,
under the fifth amendment, for previously stated reasons.
Mr. MOULDER. In response to the question asked by counsel,
which you refused to answer or declined to answer, there are
constitutional reasons as to whether or not you served in the armed
services in Spain.
Now you declined to answer the question in reference to the Spanish
Civil War. I want to ask you this question:
Did you ever serve in any branch of the armed services of the United
States of America?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. No; I never did.
Mr. MOULDER. Do you refuse to state whether or not you have
served in the armed services of another country?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I refuse to answer that specific question; yes.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. MOULDER. In other words, it leaves the impression you were
willing to fight for some other country but you are not willing to
fight for the United States of America, your own native country.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I refuse to answer the question in regard to the
Spanish Civil War.
Mr. MOULDER. Proceed, Mr. Tavenner.
Mr. TAVENNER. Mr. Halonen, I don’t want to leave an inference
that this committee feels that a person should be criticized by it for
any position he or she may take regarding any bill before Congress, but
if a certain bill before Congress is being opposed by the Communist
Party and the Communist Party is instrumental in creating opposition to
it, then the committee would be interested in that fact.
Now I am not attempting to criticize any opposition you may have
registered to the Walter-McCarran Act, but, if you did oppose it, I
want to know whether or not the Communist Party had anything to do with
the position that you took in the matter.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I decline to answer that question on the grounds
of the fifth amendment, as previously stated.
Mr. TAVENNER. Mr. Chairman, I have no further questions.
Mr. MOULDER. Mr. Velde?
Mr. VELDE. Were you born in Minnesota?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Yes.
Mr. VELDE. I note you took refuge in the fifth amendment when
questioned about your acquaintanceship with Mr. Eugene Dennett.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. That is correct.
Mr. VELDE. You were here in the hearing room while he was
testifying about your activities at the youth camp at Pine Lake, were
you not?
Mr. HALONEN. I so testified earlier.
Mr. VELDE. You did see him here, didn’t you?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Yes, I did.
Mr. VELDE. Had you ever met him before? Did you recognize him
when he was testifying?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I invoke the fifth amendment and decline to
answer that question on the grounds of possible self-incrimination.
Mr. VELDE. You might have some misunderstanding about what
acquaintanceship is. I wanted to know if you ever saw him before. I can
see no reason why you shouldn’t answer that question or why that would
tend to incriminate you in any way.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Not being too sharp on the legal aspects, I am
afraid of waiving my rights under the fifth amendment, and, for that
reason, I am invoking the fifth amendment.
Mr. VELDE. I am not trying to trap you. Seriously, I can see
no reason for not identifying him or anyone else you may have seen
before. A lot of people in this room are acquainted with people who
have been incriminated and have served jail sentences. I see no reason
why an acquaintanceship of that type with a person should incriminate
you or me or anyone else.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. Well, I respectfully invoke the fifth amendment
again on the question asked for the reasons previously stated.
Mr. VELDE. Have you ever known any member of the Communist
Party?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I again must decline to answer that question
under the fifth amendment, as previously stated.
Mr. VELDE. Have you ever met a member of the Communist Party?
Mr. HALONEN. Again I decline to answer under the fifth
amendment for the reasons stated previously.
Mr. VELDE. Do you know anyone in this room?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I know my counsel here.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. VELDE. Why do you admit that you know your counsel and
refuse to admit that you know Mr. Dennett?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. My acquaintance with my counsel could not
possibly incriminate me in any way.
Mr. VELDE. Do you feel that you are engaged at the present
time in any activity which is of a subversive nature and subversive to
the Government of the United States?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I must decline to answer that question again,
under the fifth amendment, for the reasons as stated previously.
Mr. VELDE. That is all, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. MOULDER. In connection with the last question Mr. Velde
was asking if you had any knowledge, or if you ever committed any act
of espionage or engaged in any activity contrary to the interests of
the United States, I will ask you this question?
Are you engaged in any organization work or any activities leading
toward the overthrow of our present form of government by force or
violence?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. I must decline, or I must state that I have never
engaged in any espionage, but, as far as the rest of the question
is concerned. I must again invoke the fifth amendment on possible
self-incrimination.
Mr. MOULDER. In other words, you answer by saying that you did
not engage in any espionage, but refuse to answer as to whether or not
you are actively engaged in any effort to overthrow our Government by
force and violence. That is the way I construe your answer.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. HALONEN. That is correct.
Mr. MOULDER. Are there any further questions?
Mr. VELDE. No, but I do feel that the witness possesses a
great deal of information which would be valuable to the committee in
its work, in its obligations that we are duty bound to perform, and I
regret the position the witness has taken.
I hope he will reconsider his position and return to give the committee
the information he possesses.
Mr. MOULDER. The witness is excused.
(Whereupon the witness was excused.)
Mr. MOULDER. Counsel, proceed with the next witness.
Mr. WHEELER. Mr. Eugene Frank Robel, please.
Mr. MOULDER. Will you hold up your right hand and be sworn?
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony which you are about to give
before this committee will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing
but the truth, so help you, God?
Mr. ROBEL. I do.
TESTIMONY OF EUGENE FRANK ROBEL, ACCOMPANIED BY HIS COUNSEL, JAY G.
SYKES
Mr. WHEELER. Will you state your name, please.
Mr. ROBEL. E-u-g-e-n-e F-r-a-n-k R-o-b-e-l, Eugene Frank Robel.
Mr. WHEELER. When and where were you born, Mr. Robel?
Mr. ROBEL. I was born in Kit Carson County, Colo., on a
homestead.
Mr. WHEELER. In what year?
Mr. ROBEL. 1911.
Mr. WHEELER. You are represented by counsel. Will he please
identify himself for the record?
Mr. SYKES. Jay G. Sykes, Seattle.
Mr. WHEELER. Would you briefly advise the committee as to your
education?
Mr. ROBEL. I have a high-school education and 2 years of
university.
Mr. WHEELER. What university is that?
Mr. ROBEL. Moscow, Idaho--not Russia.
Mr. WHEELER. The University of Idaho?
Mr. ROBEL. Yes, sir.
Mr. WHEELER. How long have you lived in the city of Seattle?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I came here the latter part of 1937, I believe. I
have been here since.
Mr. WHEELER. Have you ever served in the Armed Forces of the
United States?
Mr. ROBEL. Yes, sir.
Mr. WHEELER. In what branch?
Mr. ROBEL. United States Navy.
Mr. WHEELER. At what period of time were you in the United
States Navy?
Mr. ROBEL. From 1933 to 1937.
Mr. WHEELER. Were you honorably discharged?
Mr. ROBEL. Yes, sir. I had a good-conduct discharge. I have
the medal at home.
Mr. WHEELER. What is your employment record for the last 10
years?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I worked for an oil company for my first 4 years in
Seattle, General Petroleum Corp.
Mr. WHEELER. That would be 1937 to 1941?
Mr. ROBEL. I think that is approximately the figures. Then I
worked as a machinist at various jobs.
Mr. WHEELER. Specifically, what jobs have you held as a
machinist?
Mr. ROBEL. Mostly outside machinist, but at times maintenance.
Mr. WHEELER. For what companies have you worked?
Mr. ROBEL. I have worked for Todd’s, Pacific Iron Foundry,
Isaacson Iron Works, and Sahlberg Equipment Co.
Mr. WHEELER. Where are you employed now?
Mr. ROBEL. Todd’s.
Mr. WHEELER. Todd Shipyards?
Mr. ROBEL. Yes, sir.
Mr. WHEELER. Are they engaged in defense work or defense
contracts?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I think so, indirectly. I don’t know how they get
their contracts.
Mr. WHEELER. Do you have a security clearance?
Mr. ROBEL. No, sir.
Mr. WHEELER. Have you been denied security clearance?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. No, sir.
Mr. WHEELER. Are you a member of any labor union?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. On the advice of counsel, because to answer that
might tend to incriminate me, I will have to invoke the fifth amendment
and refuse to answer that.
Mr. VELDE. May I again say you are not under any compulsion to
take refuge under the fifth amendment. It is a privilege.
The question is do you invoke the fifth amendment?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I do invoke it. I recognize I am not under
compulsion, but I do invoke it because of the possibility that I might
be incriminated.
Mr. VELDE. Mr. Chairman, again let me say that I cannot
possibly see how a membership in a labor union, admission that you are
a member of a labor union, could possibly tend to incriminate a person,
and I ask the Chair to direct the witness to answer the question.
Mr. MOULDER. Certainly your being a member of a labor union
could not in any way tend to incriminate you. So you are directed to
answer that question.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. Well, membership in a particular labor union might
incriminate me, and that is the reason I invoke the fifth amendment.
One question leads to another.
Mr. MOULDER. It might lead to another question, but certainly
if the other question would tend to incriminate you that is an entirely
different matter. But the simple question as to whether or not you are
a member of a legitimate labor union could in no way whatsoever tend to
incriminate you.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I wouldn’t like to waive my rights under the fifth
amendment by answering a previous question and then be forced to answer
another one. That is the reason I took the position that I do.
Mr. MOULDER. Proceed.
Mr. VELDE. Do you belong to any labor union? That was the
original question of counsel.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. Because that question might lead to the particular
labor organization that I belong to, I will decline to answer that
question.
Mr. VELDE. If it does lead to that question, you can then
invoke your privilege under the fifth amendment of the Constitution.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. It is my understanding legally that I may waive my
rights by answering one of these questions, and I don’t wish to waive
my right to invoke the fifth amendment.
Mr. MOULDER. You certainly were not waiving your rights when
you stated a moment ago you were employed and where you were employed.
Now if you belong to some labor organization in connection with
your employment there is nothing in that connection certainly that
would tend to incriminate you, if you are employed or in legitimate
employment.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. We are getting into complicated rights of waiver,
and it is my understanding legally that I may refuse to answer.
Mr. MOULDER. Do you decline to answer under the fifth
amendment?
Mr. ROBEL. Under the fifth amendment, yes, sir.
Mr. WHEELER. Are you a member of the International Association
of Machinists, A. F. of L.?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I must invoke the fifth amendment, as previously,
and refuse to answer that.
Mr. MOULDER. I wish to say that for as long as I have served
on this committee, a period of approximately 7 years, I have never
heard anyone invoke the fifth amendment in response to a question as to
whether or not he was a member of an A. F. of L. union.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. MOULDER. Proceed.
Mr. WHEELER. Are you acquainted or have you been acquainted in
the past with Mrs. Barbara Hartle.
Mr. ROBEL. For the same reasons as previously given, that
I might tend to incriminate myself, I will have to invoke the fifth
amendment and refuse to answer that question.
Mr. WHEELER. Quoting her testimony before this committee,
appearing on page 6094 of volume 2 of the hearings held in June 1954:
The Communist Party has always had a number of members in the
machinists Union. Some of them that I can remember are Glenn
Kinney, Ray Campbell, Frank Kerr, Gene Robel.
Was Mrs. Hartle advising the committee of the truth when she testified
to that?
Mr. ROBEL. I must again invoke the fifth amendment for the
previously stated reasons, and not admit or deny anything that any
stool pigeon you may bring out says about me.
Mr. MOULDER. To whom do you refer as a stool pigeon?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I apologize for that statement, sir, and withdraw
it.
Mr. MOULDER. Ordinarily a person referred to as a stool pigeon
is one who is an accuser of some fact against someone else, and that
person ordinarily retorts that they are a stool pigeon.
You do withdraw that reference.
Mr. WHEELER. Mrs. Hartle also testified--and this reference to
her testimony can be found on page 6173 of volume 3 of the hearings:
Gene Robel, whom I have mentioned before, and Glenn Kinney were
also members of this industrial section.
Mr. Robel, the committee, in pursuance of its duties, is endeavoring to
gain knowledge of the industrial section of the Communist Party in King
County, and you, having been identified as a member of that section,
is the reason you have been subpenaed here. We would like to get what
information we can from you.
Now I would like to ask you:
Were you a member of the industrial section of the Communist Party?
Mr. ROBEL. I must invoke the fifth amendment for the same
reason previously stated, and refuse to answer that question.
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. WHEELER. Are you a member of the Communist Party today?
Mr. ROBEL. I must invoke the fifth amendment for the same
reason and refuse to answer that question on the ground that I might
incriminate myself.
Mr. WHEELER. No further questions, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. MOULDER. Were you ever a member of the Communist Party?
(The witness confers with his counsel.)
Mr. ROBEL. I must, likewise, invoke the fifth amendment on
that question, and refuse to answer, sir.
Mr. MOULDER. Mr. Velde, any questions?
Mr. VELDE. No questions.
Mr. MOULDER. The witness is excused.
(Whereupon the witness was excused.)
Call the next witness, Mr. Wheeler.
Mr. WHEELER. Mr. Frank Kerr.
Mr. SYKES. Mr. Chairman, may I address the committee in
respect to Mr. Kerr? There is a special problem involved with respect
to Mr. Kerr.
Mr. MOULDER. Yes.