WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 29, 1787.

Article 7, Section 6, by the Committee of Eleven reported to be struck

out (see the twenty-fourth inst.) being now taken up,--

Mr. PINCKNEY moved to postpone the Report, in favor of the following

proposition: "That no act of the Legislature for the purpose of

regulating the Commerce of the United States with foreign powers,

among the several States, shall be passed without the assent of

two-thirds of the members of each House." He remarked that there were

five distinct commercial interests.

The power of regulating commerce was a pure concession on the part of

the Southern States. They did not need the protection of the Northern

States at present.--_p_. 1450.

General PINCKNEY said it was the true interest of the Southern States

to have no regulation of commerce; but considering the loss brought on

the commerce of the Eastern States by the Revolution, their liberal

conduct towards the views[7] of South Carolina, and the interest the

weak Southern States had in being united with the strong Eastern

States, he thought it proper that no fetters should be imposed on the

power of making commercial regulations, and that his constituents,

though prejudiced against the Eastern States, would be reconciled to

this liberality. He had, himself, he said, prejudices against the

Eastern States before he came here, but would acknowledge that he had

found them as liberal and candid as any men whatever.--_p_. 1451.

[Footnote 7: He meant the permission to import slaves. An understanding

on the two subjects of _navigation_ and _slavery_, had taken place

between those parts of the Union, which explains the vote of the

motion depending, as well as the language of General Pinckney and

others.]

Mr. PINCKNEY replied, that his enumeration meant the five minute

interests. It still left the two great divisions of Northern and

Southern interests.

Mr. GOUVERNEUR MORRIS opposed the object of the motion as highly

injurious.--A navy was essential to security, particularly of the

Southern States;--

Mr. WILLIAMSON. As to the weakness of the Southern States, he was not

alarmed on that account. The sickliness of their climate for invaders

would prevent their being made an object. He acknowledged that he did

not think the motion requiring two-thirds necessary in itself; because

if a majority of the Northern States should push their regulations too

far, the Southern States would build ships for themselves; but he knew

the Southern people were apprehensive on this subject, and would be

pleased with the precaution.

Mr. SPAIGHT was against the motion. The Southern States could at any

time save themselves from oppression, by building ships for their own

use.--_p_. 1452.

Mr. BUTLER differed from those who considered the rejection of the

motion as no concession on the part of the Southern States. He

considered the interests of these and of the Eastern States to be as

different as the interests of Russia and Turkey. Being,

notwithstanding, desirous of conciliating the affections of the

Eastern States, he should vote against requiring two-thirds instead of

a majority.--_p_. 1453.

Mr. MADISON. He added, that the Southern States would derive an

essential advantage, in the general security afforded by the increase

of our maritime strength. He stated the vulnerable situation of them

all, and of Virginia in particular.

Mr. RUTLEDGE was against the motion of his colleague. At the worst, a

navigation act could bear hard a little while only on the Southern

States. As we are laying the foundation for a great empire, we ought

to take a permanent view of the subject, and not look at the present

moment only.

Mr. GORMAN. The Eastern States were not led to strengthen the Union by

fear for their own safety.

He deprecated the consequences of disunion; but if it should take

place, it was the Southern part of the Continent that had most reason

to dread them.

On the question to postpone, in order to take up Mr. PINCKNEY's

motion,--

Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia, aye--4; New Hampshire,

Massachusetts, Connecticut, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, South

Carolina, no--7. The Report of the Committee for striking out Section

6, requiring two-thirds of each House to pass a navigation act, was

then agreed to, _nem. con_.

Mr. BUTLER moved to insert after Article 15, "If any person bound to

service or labor in any of the United States, shall escape into

another State, he or she shall not be discharged from such service or

labor, in consequence of any regulations subsisting in the State to

which they escape, but shall be delivered up to the person justly

claiming their service or labor,"--which was agreed to, _nem.

con_.--_p_. 1454-5-6.

THURSDAY, August 30, 1787.

Article 18, being taken up,

On a question for striking out "domestic violence," and inserting

"insurrections," it passed in the negative,--New Jersey, Virginia,

North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, aye--5; New Hampshire,

Massachusetts, Connecticut, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland,

no--6.--_pp_. 1466-7.

MONDAY, September 10, 1787.

Mr. RUTLEDGE said he never could agree to give a power by which the

articles relating to slaves might be altered by the States not

interested in that property, and prejudiced against it. In order to

obviate this objection, these words were added to the proposition:

"provided that no amendments, which may be made prior to the year 1808

shall in any manner affect the fourth and fifth sections of the

seventh Article:"--_p_. 1536.

TUESDAY, September 13, 1787.

Article 1, Section 2. On motion of Mr. RANDOLPH, the word "servitude"

was struck out, and "service" unanimously[8] inserted, the former

being thought to express the condition of slaves, and the latter the

obligations of free persons.

[Footnote 8: See page 372 of the printed journal.]

Mr. DICKENSON and Mr. WILSON moved to strike out, "and direct taxes,"

from Article 1, Section 2, as improperly placed in a clause relating

merely to the Constitution of the House of Representatives.

Mr. GOUVERNEUR MORRIS. The insertion here was in consequence of what

had passed on this point; in order to exclude the appearance of

counting the negroes in the _representation_. The including of them

may now be referred to the object of direct taxes, and incidentally

only to that of representation.

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