Friday, August 24, 1787

_In Convention_,--Governor Livingston, from the committee of eleven,

to whom were referred the two remaining clauses of the fourth section,

and the fifth and sixth sections, of the seventh Article, delivered in

the following Report:

"Strike out so much of the fourth section as was referred to the

Committee, and insert, 'The migration or importation of such persons

as the several States, now existing, shall think proper to admit,

shall not be prohibited by the Legislature prior to the year 1800; but

a tax or duty may be imposed on such migration or importation, at a

rate not exceeding the average of the duties laid on imports.

"The fifth Section to remain as in the Report.

The sixth Section to be stricken out."--p. 1415.

SATURDAY, August 25, 1787.

The Report of the Committee of eleven (see Friday, the twenty-fourth),

being taken up,--

Gen. PINCKNEY moved to strike out the words, "the year eighteen

hundred," as the year limiting the importation of slaves; and to

insert the words, "the year eighteen hundred and eight."

Mr. GORHAM seconded the motion.

Mr. MADISON. Twenty years will produce all the mischief that can be

apprehended from the liberty to import slaves. So long a term will be

more dishonorable to the American character, than to say nothing about

it in the Constitution.

On the motion, which passed in the affirmative,--New-Hampshire,

Massachusetts, Connecticut, Maryland, North Carolina, South Carolina,

Georgia, aye--7; New-Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Virginia, no--4.

Mr. GOUVERNEUR MORRIS was for making the clause read at once, "the

importation of slaves in North Carolina, South Carolina, and Georgia,

shall not be prohibited, &c." This he said, would be most fair, and

would avoid the ambiguity by which, under the power with regard to

naturalization, the liberty reserved to the States might be defeated.

He wished it to be known, also, that this part of the Constitution was

a compliance with those States. If the change of language, however,

should be objected to, by the members from those States, he should not

urge it.

Col. MASON was not against using the term "slaves," but against naming

North Carolina, South Carolina, and Georgia, lest it should give

offence to the people of those States.

Mr. SHERMAN liked a description better than the terms proposed, which

had been declined by the old Congress, and were not pleasing to some

people.

Mr. CLYMER concurred with Mr. SHERMAN.

Mr. WILLIAMSON said, that both in opinion and practice he was against

slavery; but thought it more in favor of humanity, from a view of all

circumstances, to let in South Carolina and Georgia on those terms,

than to exclude them from the Union.

Mr. GOUVERNEUR MORRIS withdrew his motion.

Mr. DICKINSON wished the clause to be confined to the States which had

not themselves prohibited the importation of slaves; and for that

purpose moved to amend the clause, so as to read: "The importation of

slaves into such of the States as shall permit the same, shall not be

prohibited by the Legislature of the United States, until the year

1808;" which was disagreed to, _nem. con_.[4]

[Footnote 4: In the printed Journals, Connecticut, Virginia, and

Georgia, voted in the affirmative.]

The first part of the Report was then agreed to, amended as follows:

"The migration or importation of such persons as the several States

now existing shall think proper to admit, shall not be prohibited by

the Legislature prior to the year 1808,"--

New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Maryland, North Carolina,

South Carolina, Georgia, aye--7; New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware,

Virginia, no--4.

Mr. BALDWIN, in order to restrain and more explicitly define, "the

average duty," moved to strike out of the second part the words,

"average of the duties laid on imports," and insert "common impost on

articles not enumerated;" which was agreed to, _nem. con_.

Mr. SHERMAN was against this second part, as acknowledging men to be

property, by taxing them as such under the character of slaves.

Mr. KING and Mr. LANGDON considered this as the price of the first

part. Gen. PINCKNEY admitted that it was so. Col. MASON. Not to tax,

will be equivalent to a bounty on, the importation of slaves.

Mr. GORHAM thought that Mr. SHERMAN should consider the duty, not as

implying that slaves are property, but as a discouragement to the

importation of them.

Mr. GOUVERNEUR MORRIS remarked, that, as the clause now stands, it

implies that the Legislature may tax freemen imported.

Mr. SHERMAN, in answer to Mr. GORHAM, observed, that the smallness of

the duty showed revenue to be the object, not the discouragement of

the importation.

Mr. MADISON thought it wrong to admit in the Constitution the idea

that there could be property in men. The reason of duties did not

hold, as slaves are not, like merchandize consumed, &c.

Col. MASON, in answer to Mr. GOUVERNEUR MORRIS. The provision, as it

stands, was necessary for the case of convicts, in order to prevent

the introduction of them.

It was finally agreed, _nem. con_., to make the clause read: "but a

tax or duty may be imposed on such importation, not exceeding ten

dollars for each person;" and then the second part, as amended, was

agreed to.--_pp_. 1427 to 30.

TUESDAY, August 28, 1787.

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