Mr. HUBERT. You saw a blur first?
Mr. HANKAL. And then the action.
Mr. HUBERT. And then your attention was directed to the action by the
blur?
Mr. HANKAL. Right.
Mr. HUBERT. So, actually, you saw a man coming?
Mr. HANKAL. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Where was he coming from?
Mr. HANKAL. To my right.
Mr. HUBERT. How far away was he?
Mr. HANKAL. I believe since I made that statement it has been paced off
and set at about 9 feet.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, in order that we may have a graphic record of the
matter, I am showing you a chart of the basement area, and you are now
sitting before the FBI mockup of substantially the same area except
that it doesn’t cover all the parking area.
I have marked that chart as follows: “Dallas, Tex., April 17, 1964,
Exhibit 5338, Deposition of R. L. Hankal,” and I have signed my name on
it.
Now, before we go into positions to be marked on that map, may I ask
you how long you had been in the basement area prior to the shooting?
Mr. HANKAL. Somewhere around 2 or 3 hours and the night before.
Mr. HUBERT. Had you ever seen Ruby around at any time?
Mr. HANKAL. Not that I recall.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you know him?
Mr. HANKAL. No; I didn’t.
Mr. HUBERT. And when you testified a moment ago that you saw the man
Ruby shoot Oswald, is it correct to state that you did not at that time
know that the man doing the shooting was Jack Ruby?
Mr. HANKAL. That’s correct.
Mr. HUBERT. Well, now, you did assume a position in the basement for
some time prior to the actual shooting and it was a rather static
position, wasn’t it?
Mr. HANKAL. The evening before we were positioned directly across from
the jail office door. The next day when we came to work, we moved our
camera across the ramp down into the parking area.
Mr. HUBERT. Back of the rail?
Mr. HANKAL. Back of the rail--we were shooting between the rails.
Mr. HUBERT. Where were you, in fact, standing at the moment of the
shooting? I ask you to place the spot first on the mockup and I give
you the chart to mark a point at which you were standing after you
fixed the point on the mockup.
Mr. HANKAL. My camera was here just to the left of this center pole and
shooting between the rails--we have a long vertical zoom lens and it
stuck out between the rails--I was standing outside of the rail of the
ramp to the left of the lens.
Mr. HUBERT. Would you mark on this chart where you were standing?
Mr. HANKAL. I was standing here [indicating and marking on the chart
referred to].
Mr. HUBERT. Now, you have marked a place “X”. Now, put it in a circle,
and I am drawing a line and writing the following “position of Hankal
at time of shooting” is that correct?
Mr. HANKAL. That’s correct.
Mr. HUBERT. The camera was to your rear and left, is that right?
Mr. HANKAL. To my right.
Mr. HUBERT. To your right or to your left?
Mr. HANKAL. To my right.
Mr. HUBERT. So that the camera would have been approximately like this?
Mr. HANKAL. That’s right.
Mr. HUBERT. I am drawing a square in which I am marking an “A” and I am
drawing a line out and writing “position of live camera”--it was a live
camera?
Mr. HANKAL. Yes, sir.
Mr. HUBERT. What is the station?
Mr. HANKAL. KRLD.
Mr. HUBERT. “KRLD”.
It was there at all pertinent times--right?
Mr. HANKAL. We moved and shot up here after the shots were fired.
Mr. HUBERT. But before the shots were fired, that’s where you were?
Mr. HANKAL. That’s right--before the shots were fired that’s where we
were.
Mr. HUBERT. Then, at all pertinent times prior to the shooting you were
there?
Mr. HANKAL. Right.
Mr. HUBERT. The camera itself was back of the rail into the parking
area--you were in front of the rail on the ramp?
Mr. HANKAL. On the ramp in front of the rail--right.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you know Jim Turner?
Mr. HANKAL. No; I don’t.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you know George Phenix?
Mr. HANKAL. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Was he there too?
Mr. HANKAL. Oh, yes.
Mr. HUBERT. What was the relative position between you and George?
Mr. HANKAL. George was to my right, I believe, he was still here.
Mr. HUBERT. Now, I am marking a position which you have designated on
the mockup as being approximately where I am putting the letter “P” for
Phenix, is that about right?
Mr. HANKAL. That’s as I last saw him before the shooting.
Mr. HUBERT. And I am drawing a line and writing “Phenix position
according to Hankal,” is that right?
Mr. HANKAL. Correct.
Mr. HUBERT. Do you know a man by the name of Huffaker?
Mr. HANKAL. I do.
Mr. HUBERT. Who is he?
Mr. HANKAL. He is a newsman at KRLD.
Mr. HUBERT. Where was he standing?
Mr. HANKAL. Well, the last time I saw Bob before the shooting, he was
just outside and to the left of the jail office door.
Mr. HUBERT. How long before the shooting was that?
Mr. HANKAL. Perhaps 5 or 6 minutes before it.
Mr. HUBERT. You didn’t see him at the time of the shooting?
Mr. HANKAL. No; I didn’t. After the shooting he came to our camera for
instructions.
Mr. HUBERT. When they brought Oswald down, was any announcement made of
it at the moment?
Mr. HANKAL. Not outside of just a cry from a newsman that said, “He’s
coming.” That’s the only announcement I ever heard.
Mr. HUBERT. And then immediately thereafter the parties escorting him
began to come through?
Mr. HANKAL. Appeared at the door and came through.
Mr. HUBERT. Can you tell us what was the reaction at the time Oswald
actually appeared into view of the news people and the police and so
forth?
Mr. HANKAL. Well, the physical things that happened was there was a
stir--some of the movie cameras lights--they need more lights than the
television cameras do, some of their lights came on, strobe lights came
on and cameras began to click. It was--at the moment not very noisy as
it had been--a little, oh, a hush fell over us.
Mr. HUBERT. Isn’t it a fact that prior to the shooting, immediately
prior to the shooting there was a general surge forward?
Mr. HANKAL. Just prior to the shooting?
Mr. HUBERT. Yes.
Mr. HANKAL. Yes--I would say.
Mr. HUBERT. I mean that there was a general movement--a step or two
forward by each person--that made a surge?
Mr. HANKAL. A moving forward, leaning forward, of all bodies.
Mr. HUBERT. And it was almost immediately thereafter or
contemporaneously with it that Jack Ruby brushed through the crowd, is
that correct?
Mr. HANKAL. Within the same action.
Mr. HUBERT. You had not seen him standing there before?
Mr. HANKAL. No; I hadn’t.
Mr. HUBERT. You don’t know how he got in?
Mr. HANKAL. I don’t.
Mr. HUBERT. Were you present at the showup of Oswald which took
place on the night of November 22 in the assembly room of the police
department when the press and other news media representatives were
allowed to see Oswald?
Mr. HANKAL. Yes.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you see Jack Ruby in that crowd?
Mr. HANKAL. No; I didn’t.
Mr. HUBERT. Did you hear anyone say anything from the rear to Oswald?
Mr. HANKAL. Well, what do you mean?