George K. Dewey, city clerk of Brockville, Ontario.
F. S. Evanson, mayor of Prescott, Ontario.
R. R. Dowsley, superintendent of the water and light system of
Prescott, Ontario.
G. F. Darrow, chairman of the water board of Ogdensburg, N. Y.
Andrew Irving, chairman of the board of public works of Ogdensburg,
N. Y.
Frank Chapman, member of the board of commissioners of Ogdensburg, N.
Y.
Mr. GARDNER. We will first call on the mayor of Brockville.
STATEMENT OF MR. GEORGE A. WRIGHT, MAYOR OF BROCKVILLE,
ONTARIO.
Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, I shall have very little
to say, personally. We have with us our city engineer and medical
health officer, who will be able to give you whatever information you
require and to ask for whatever information we ourselves desire. It
is needless to say that we are very much interested in this question.
Pure water has been a big problem with us in the town of Brockville.
Within a year we have suffered severely from impure water. Therefore
we are looking at the present time for ways and means to secure a
supply of pure water. We have been dealing with the question of
filtration, but the matter has not been definitely settled by us yet.
As to the disposal of our sewage, our civic officers will give you
information regarding that. I do not think it is necessary for me to
take up any more of your time than to introduce to you, first, our
medical health officer, Dr. Macauley.
Mr. GARDNER. You obtain your water from the St. Lawrence River, do
you?
Mr. WRIGHT. We take our drinking water from the St. Lawrence River
and discharge our sewage into it.
Mr. MIGNAULT. Do you discharge your sewage into the St. Lawrence
River treated or untreated?
Mr. WRIGHT. Untreated.
Mr. TAWNEY. You said that you had suffered severely from impure water
within the last year. Will you kindly state what your experience was
in that regard?
Mr. WRIGHT. We had a typhoid epidemic about a year ago.
Mr. TAWNEY. How large an epidemic did you have in your town?
Mr. WRIGHT. We had about 180 cases.
Mr. TAWNEY. What is the population of Brockville?
Mr. WRIGHT. About 10,000.
Mr. TAWNEY. How many deaths were there?
Mr. WRIGHT. Fourteen.
Mr. GARDNER. Was that the first instance of typhoid that you had?
Mr. WRIGHT. It was the first epidemic. We had a break in one of our
pipes, which I think had something to do with the cause of it.
Mr. TAWNEY. Did you trace the source of the epidemic to the pollution
in the river water?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes.
Mr. POWELL. What is the cause of your pollution?
Mr. WRIGHT. We think the sewage is the cause.
Mr. POWELL. Sewage from where?
Mr. WRIGHT. From the town of Brockville. Of course, as I stated,
there was a break in our sewage pipe which permitted the
contamination.
Mr. POWELL. Is the source of your intake farther upstream?
Mr. WRIGHT. It is above our sewage outlet; yes, sir.
Mr. MIGNAULT. How far above?
Mr. WRIGHT. Not a great distance, but much farther out in the river.
The town engineer will be able to give you that information.
Mr. POWELL. If your intake is farther upstream than the outlet of the
sewage, how can the sewage be responsible for the trouble?
Mr. WRIGHT. We have a considerable eddy. On account of the eddy in
the river we occasionally find sewage above the town.
Mr. POWELL. That is the town’s own sewage?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes. We find that the river there is contaminated, and
we find a great deal of difficulty in obtaining any samples of pure
water in the river anywhere in the neighborhood of the town.
Mr. POWELL. Are there many shoals in the river which cause a
deflection of the current?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes; there are a great many shoals.
Mr. POWELL. That leads to a mixture of the waters on both banks?
Mr. WRIGHT. Yes.
Mr. MIGNAULT. Is there any sewage in the river above Brockville?
Mr. WRIGHT. There are some small summer resorts above the town, and I
understand that a limited amount of sewage goes in from them.
Mr. POWELL. How far is it from Brockville to Gananoque?
Mr. WRIGHT. A little over 30 miles. We do not feel that we are
contaminated from Gananoque, though.
Mr. POWELL. I suppose you have never made an investigation to see
whether you are or not?
Mr. WRIGHT. No.
Mr. MAGRATH. You would rather have those questions directed to your
health officer, would you not?
Mr. WRIGHT. I think so. I will ask our health officer, Dr. Macauley,
to take the floor now.
STATEMENT OF DR. A. J. MACAULEY, MEDICAL HEALTH OFFICER
OF BROCKVILLE, ONTARIO.
Mr. GARDNER. What is your official position, Dr. Macauley?
Dr. MACAULEY. I am medical health officer of Brockville.
Mr. GARDNER. How long have you occupied that position?
Dr. MACAULEY. About 15 years.
Mr. GARDNER. What has been your observation in regard to the water
supply for the city of Brockville?
Dr. MACAULEY. The water supply, the untreated water, for years has
been found to be impure. It is much more impure now than it was some
years ago, but we have always found colon bacilli in the water.
Mr. GARDNER. In your opinion, does it increase in amount as the time
goes on?
Dr. MACAULEY. It certainly has increased.
Mr. POWELL. To what do you attribute the increase?
Dr. MACAULEY. I suppose it is the pollution. There is a constant
emptying of sewers into the water all the way up. As you will find
by investigation, the St. Lawrence River is polluted all the way up,
even above the towns where the summer resorts are.
Mr. MIGNAULT. There are a large number of boats that ply on the
river, are there not?
Dr. MACAULEY. There are a great many boats; I could not say as to the
number.
Mr. MIGNAULT. I suppose the islands and the riparian communities are
increasing in population, and the increase in sewage would be the
logical result?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes, sir.
Mr. TAWNEY. Have you ever made any independent examinations?
Dr. MACAULAY. Examinations have been made by our board. They are made
every week. I think from four to six samples a week are analyzed, and
the raw water is now found to be constantly polluted.
Mr. TAWNEY. Have you a water-filtration plant?
Dr. MACAULEY. We have not. We chlorinate our water by gas
chlorination.
Mr. POWELL. What would be the average summer contamination, expressed
in colon bacilli?
Dr. MACAULEY. We find colon bacilli practically constant in 5 to 10
cubic centimeters.
Mr. GARDNER. Do you notice any difference in the amount of pollution
in winter and summer?
Dr. MACAULEY. I think it is practically the same; perhaps it may be a
little higher in the summer season.
Mr. MIGNAULT. What have you done locally to remedy the situation, Dr.
Macauley?
Dr. MACAULEY. Our epidemic was due to an accident. The intake pipe we
have now extends 700 feet out into the St. Lawrence from the dock,
but the one we had before extended only a little over 100 feet into
the river. There is an eddy that flows down to Picketts Point right
below Brockville, and it goes right straight up back along the shore;
but our sewage pipe extends about 900 feet down and about 800 feet
from the shore. In December about two years ago a boat anchor got a
hold of the sewer pipe down below our intake pipe and opened it about
200 feet from shore. It made an opening in the joint of the pipe,
and we got the pollution from the sewage into the intake pipe. That
is undoubtedly what caused the epidemic. When that was remedied the
epidemic stopped.
Our water is chlorinated. We use about 100 pounds of hypochloride to
3,000,000 gallons of water. It is put in as an equivalent, because we
use gas instead of the chlorine.
Mr. GARDNER. Have you more than one outlet to your sewage discharge?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes; we have. We have an outlet at the western end of
the town. Our engineer will give you the capacity of that outlet. Our
main outlet is below the town and also below our intake pipe.
Mr. POWELL. Your system of piping is a series of small pipes, is it
not?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes; but there is a trunk sewer.
Mr. POWELL. How large are those pipes?
Dr. MACAULEY. The engineer can give you that information.
Mr. POWELL. Dr. Macauley, on which side of the river is the riparian
population increasing most rapidly, on the United States or the
Canadian side?
Dr. MACAULEY. I think it is increasing most rapidly on the Canadian
side; perhaps not in the summer resorts; there is quite a large
population on the islands, but principally on the American side. The
population is increasing very rapidly each year.
Mr. POWELL. When you say on the Canadian side do you mean exclusive
of Brockville?
Dr. MACAULEY. Well, they are increasing every year.
Mr. POWELL. As rapidly as on the American side?
Dr. MACAULEY. I do not think so with respect to the summer resorts,
because the majority of the islands are on the American side.
Mr. POWELL. What is the density of the population during the time
that the summer residents are there?
Dr. MACAULEY. I could scarcely tell you that.
Mr. POWELL. I want to get the floating population passing from one
side to the other.
Dr. MACAULEY. I could not give you that information. There is a great
deal of pollution undoubtedly from the boats.
Mr. MIGNAULT. There is quite a large summer population on the islands?
Dr. MACAULEY. There is, particularly this summer.
Mr. MIGNAULT. You do not make provision for letting the surface water
of the city pass into your sewerage system, do you?
Dr. MACAULEY. Partially it does; but it enters the St. Lawrence by a
separate pipe.
Mr. GARDNER. How many cases of typhoid fever do you think developed
in consequence of the sewage pollution in your water supply?
Dr. MACAULEY. At that time?
Mr. GARDNER. Yes; that is approximately how many cases?
Dr. MACAULEY. There is no doubt that the breaking of the intake pipe
was practically the cause of the epidemic. We have had too high a
typhoid content always until the water was heavily chlorinated. We
have chlorinated our water since 1910.
Mr. GARDNER. Previous to that time did you have an epidemic of
typhoid?
Dr. MACAULEY. We had in 1909 a slight epidemic. There were, perhaps,
25 or 30 cases. I could not give you the exact number now. We had
none in 1910. The dredging that was being done along the river front
was practically the cause of the epidemic. We have never been as
free from typhoid as we were this last summer. We have never had
any cases that we could trace to the water since it has been highly
chlorinated. Still our water is always suspicious, and if anything
went wrong with the chlorination plant we would surely have typhoid.
Mr. MIGNAULT. At the time of the last epidemic the water was
chlorinated?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes; but it was not chlorinated highly enough. We
practically got sewage into our water pipe.
Mr. POWELL. I suppose there was too great a burden thrown on your
chlorinating system?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes.
Mr. POWELL. In the official circles of your city has the question of
purification of your sewage ever been mooted or discussed?
Dr. MACAULEY. Not of our sewage. We have been for some time agitating
very seriously the question of putting in a filtration plant.
Mr. POWELL. That is for your water for consumption?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes.
Mr. POWELL. But what about the sewage?
Dr. MACAULEY. The sewage is never treated.
Mr. MAGRATH. Have any demands been made upon you by the public-health
service of Ontario to improve your system?
Dr. MACAULEY. We have been notified that the time would come when we
would have to do that. We are trying to get our filtration plant in.
We thought last year that we practically had it.
Mr. POWELL. You would look after your water and let the other fellow
look after the sewage?
Dr. MACAULEY. Self-preservation first, always.
Mr. MAGRATH. Have you any complaints against the pollution of water
from this side crossing over to the Canadian side?
Dr. MACAULEY. I do not know that we have. Examinations made by our
local board have shown that for several miles up the river the
pollution is practically constant in the raw water.
Mr. POWELL. Across the whole river?
Dr. MACAULEY. Right across the channel. We examined all the way
across.
Mr. POWELL. But you have had no independent examination?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes; we have.
Mr. POWELL. And that independent examination showed the same results
as our examinations?
Dr. MACAULEY. Practically the same.
Mr. POWELL. Showing that contamination extends across the whole
channel?
Dr. MACAULEY. Across the whole channel and all the way up.
Mr. POWELL. Has any opposition on the part of the citizens to
purification of the sewage, or sterilization of it, ever manifested
itself?
Dr. MACAULEY. I think not. It has been mooted, but no definite action
has been taken.
Mr. POWELL. Why was not definite action taken in compliance with the
request of the provincial board?
Dr. MACAULEY. I think the lack of funds was the main thing.
Mr. MIGNAULT. Did you ever have studies made as to sewage treatment
in Brockville?
Dr. MACAULEY. No; I think not; not for Brockville especially.
Mr. MAGRATH. It is just your water supply that you are contemplating
improving?
Dr. MACAULEY. At the present time that is all. We know that we shall
have to improve the other in time. No doubt it is dangerous.
Mr. MIGNAULT. But you have not seriously considered it so far?
Dr. MACAULEY. I can not say that we have. It has not been brought to
my notice if it has been.
Mr. POWELL. The engineer can probably answer this question, but
his experience may not go far enough back. Has any investigation
ever been made as to the natural facilities that are afforded for
sedimentation beds and things of that kind on the other side of the
boundary?
Dr. MACAULEY. I think not.
Mr. POWELL. Have you ever heard of any complaints owing to sewage
from vessels passing up and down the river?
Dr. MACAULEY. Yes; we have heard complaints. During the year 1909
one of our wharves was in bad condition, and many of the large boats
stopped at a point that was practically over the end of our intake
pipe. That was doubtless the cause of our epidemic. There is no doubt
that the year the boats were there there was an epidemic. We went so
far as to prohibit the boats staying there. We prohibited the large
liners or passenger boats tying up to that wharf. For some months,
however, they did tie up to the wharf.
Mr. POWELL. As a man having to do with sanitary matters, what is your
opinion regarding the effect of the boats discharging the sewage
into the river? Is the discharging of that sewage into the river
detrimental to health on your side?
Dr. MACAULEY. Undoubtedly.
Mr. MAGRATH. I would like to say, Mr. Chairman, that if Dr. Macauley
as the health officer of a great town along the river here wishes to
make any statement to the commission he may do so. He may have gotten
the idea that he is here to ask questions. If he has anything to say
on the subject, this is the time to say it.
Dr. MACAULEY. I do not know of anything special at this time.
Something may later suggest itself to my mind.
Mr. TAWNEY. Can anyone here give us information as to the number of
vessels passing up and down this river in front of Brockville? Is
there any record that would give such information?
Dr. MACAULEY. I do not think we have any such record.
Mr. GARDNER. I suppose, Dr. Macauley, that you are willing to say
that the tonnage passing up and down the river here is very large?
Dr. MACAULEY. Certainly there are a great many people passing up
and down the river on the line of boats, the _Kingston_ and the
_Toronto_, especially this season. Owing to the fact that the season
has been a very hot one, the boats have been crowded all summer.
Mr. POWELL. I suppose the reports of the lock masters of the canals
would give us some idea of the number of boats passing up and down.
Dr. MACAULEY. I do not think so, because a large portion of the
travel comes from the train or from Brockville; but a large number of
passengers would go only as far as Prescott. I think it would be only
a fractional part would go to Montreal.
STATEMENT OF MR. G. H. BRYSON, CITY ENGINEER OF BROCKVILLE,
ONTARIO.
Mr. GARDNER. Mr. Bryson, you are the city engineer of Brockville, are
you?
Mr. BRYSON. I am.
Mr. GARDNER. How long have you held that position?
Mr. BRYSON. Four and a half years.
Mr. GARDNER. Have you with you plans of your sewerage system?
Mr. BRYSON. No; I did not bring any. They are on file with the
commission’s original report of 1914.
Mr. GARDNER. Can you give us a general outline of the character of
your sewerage system?
Mr. BRYSON. The town is divided into two systems. One system
discharges into what is called the west-end division. The main
sewerage area takes about three-fourths of the area of the town
and discharges about 820 feet from the intake pipe. It starts with
a 16-inch outlet and then follows up with an 8-inch outlet in the
river. The original system was laid out to take only sanitary sewage,
but for some reason that was abandoned. The west-end system is a
9-inch pipe, except the small piece of 8-inch cast-iron pipe running
into the river. That discharges about half a mile above the intake
pipe. It is practically all sanitary sewage.
Mr. GARDNER. What is the nature of the surface of the country there?
Is it flat?
Mr. BRYSON. No; it is very hilly. We have really three watersheds in
the town.
Mr. GARDNER. As an engineer, would it, in your judgment, be very
difficult to put an intercepting sewer in there for the purpose of
purifying the sewage?
Mr. BRYSON. Plans have been gotten out for intercepting all the west
end sewage and bringing it into the main system.
Mr. MAGRATH. Have those plans been approved by the public health
service?
Mr. BRYSON. No; they have never gone to them, but it is a
recommendation from them that the sewage from the west end be pumped
into the main sewerage system. That was one of the conditions
contained in the original order, that the west end sewage be passed
into the main sewerage system.
Mr. POWELL. What is the estimated cost of that work?.
Mr. BRYSON. About $10,000.
Mr. GARDNER. That was a suggestion for the purification of your
sewage?
Mr. BRYSON. It was just simply to divert the sewage so it would go
out below the intake.
Mr. GARDNER. You have never taken into consideration the purification
of your sewage before it is discharged?
Mr. BRYSON. No; nothing has been done about that.
Mr. POWELL. What is the axis of this rotary area where you have the
back flow?
Mr. BRYSON. I beg your pardon?
Mr. POWELL. There is a back flow on the Brockville side. What is the
major axis, and what is the minor axis?
Mr. BRYSON. It flows west to about the Canadian Pacific Railway dock
and then turns down the river.
Mr. POWELL. About how far is it from where it starts to flow up to
the end of the curve?
Mr. BRYSON. It starts about half a mile below the town. I should
think it is out about 800 feet. The intake is supposed to be across
the present eddy.
Mr. POWELL. Just beyond it, near the margin.
Mr. BRYSON. Yes.
Mr. POWELL. During your time has the pollution increased very much?
Mr. BRYSON. It has increased with the population in the western end
of the town.
Mr. POWELL. Have you ever made any estimate as to what the cost would
be of sterilization by sedimentation or otherwise of the sewage?
Mr. BRYSON. No, sir.
Mr. MAGRATH. So far as I can gather, you have been the chief offender
against yourself in the past.
Mr. BRYSON. I think so, Mr. Magrath.
Mr. GARDNER. Your concern has been chiefly in regard to your water
supply?
Mr. BRYSON. It has been to protect ourselves.
Mr. GARDNER. And you have no complaint to make about the water being
polluted in the stream above you?
Mr. BRYSON. No.
Mr. MIGNAULT. Are there any large towns below Brockville that would
be polluted by your sewage?
Mr. BRYSON. Prescott is the only possible place that could be
affected by it, I think.
Mr. POWELL. There is no surface sewage that passes into your western
system?
Mr. BRYSON. There is very little; nothing to speak of.
Mr. POWELL. Does all the surface sewage in the lower system pass into
your pipes?
Mr. BRYSON. It passes into other pipes now; but for the last four
years we have been taking out such surface sewage as we could because
we have been having very heavy floods in the lower pipes of the town.
Mr. POWELL. Could you avoid a pumping system in disposing of your
sewage?
Mr. BRYSON. No; we have to pump. The location of a plant would be
very difficult from the present point of discharge.
Mr. POWELL. Have you any idea from what elevation you would have to
pump the sewage in order to dispose of it?
Mr. BRYSON. I think to get land we would have to go outside of the
town limits entirely.
Mr. POWELL. But how high would you have to go?
Mr. BRYSON. About 90 feet.
Mr. POWELL. That would be quite expensive?
Mr. BRYSON. Yes. There is no available land in sight.
Mr. MAGRATH. You have no general statement that you wish to make
regarding this situation, have you?
Mr. BRYSON. Dr. Macauley was asked about the pollution in the river.
Last year I went out all over the lake taking samples and sent them
to the provincial board of health. Every one showed contamination. We
crossed the main channel and right over to the American side. We went
up the river to Big Island.
Mr. GARDNER. Did that investigation cover the whole surface of the
river from shore to shore?
Mr. BRYSON. We took samples every 400 feet right across.
Mr. POWELL. Have there ever been any complaints made by the lower
communities on your side against the sewage?
Mr. BRYSON. No.
Mr. POWELL. You have never been threatened with any lawsuits?
Mr. BRYSON. No.
Mr. EVANSON. May I ask Mr. Bryson a question?
Mr. GARDNER. Certainly.
Mr. EVANSON. Mr. Bryson, in speaking of purifying the sewage of
the town of Brockville you said it would have to be pumped for
a considerable distance. Do not the sewers go down some of the
principal streets of Brockville?
Mr. BRYSON. Yes.
Mr. EVANSON. Is it not possible that a plant could be built under
ground beneath those streets to take care of the sewage?
Mr. BRYSON. I do not think so. I think we would have to spend too
much money in rock excavation.
Mr. EVANSON. I know that Mr. Murray, of Toronto, suggested that
system to me some years ago. He said it could be taken care of
without pumping at all.
Mr. BRYSON. Our outlet is in rock now and it is below the level of
the St. Lawrence.
Mr. POWELL. There is not much rise and fall of the St. Lawrence River
here, is there?
Mr. BRYSON. No; not very much.
Mr. POWELL. About what is the range?
Mr. BRYSON. About 4 feet at Brockville.
Mr. POWELL. Is there much shallow water on the Brockville side?
Mr. BRYSON. Not along the main water front. It is only along the
west end that it begins to get shallow. There is a shoal over there.
Mr. POWELL. Is there an area there of some acres of shallow water?
Mr. BRYSON. Yes.
Mr. POWELL. Could you not dike it off? Or would that be too expensive?
Mr. BRYSON. Yes; it would be too expensive.
Mr. GARDNER. Is there anyone else from Brockville who wishes to be
heard?
Mr. WRIGHT. Possibly we might hear from the chairman of the water
commission, if the question of filtration is of any interest to this
commission.
Mr. GARDNER. This commission is not so much concerned about the
purification of your water supply as about the purification of your
sewage.
Mr. WRIGHT. I understand that. The point we wish to establish is that
so far as our experience goes we have not been able to find pure
water in the river irrespective of any pollution that comes from the
town of Brockville. While no doubt there is pollution from the sewage
in the town of Brockville, at the same time in all our experience
with the river we have been unable to find pure water in the
neighborhood of the town, either above or below the sewage outlet.
Therefore, we have come to the conclusion that the river is polluted
irrespective of our sewage.
Mr. MAGRATH. Do you know of any community treating the sewage above
you?
Mr. WRIGHT. No, sir.
Mr. GARDNER. The commission would be glad to hear from the chairman
of the water commission.
STATEMENT OF MR. W. H. KYLE, CHAIRMAN OF THE PUBLIC
UTILITIES COMMISSION OF BROCKVILLE, ONTARIO.
Mr. KYLE. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen: We had tests made of the water
above the town, away above any contamination from our sewage, and I
believe to-day if we could get pure water above Brockville we could
put a pumping plant up there.
Mr. MAGRATH. And treat your sewage so as to leave the people below
you in the same position?
Mr. KYLE. We are in the position that we take that as an
international question, and there would be no use of their treating
it unless it is made general. The water is polluted also from the big
insane asylum there. That will have to be taken into consideration
when the question of the town of Brockville is considered.
Mr. GARDNER. Where is that located, in reference to your city?
Mr. KYLE. It is about a mile below our city. I believe we can not
get any pure water in the river at the present time and that we
shall have to treat our sewage and also put in a filtration plant.
I believe that the trouble in our water is caused by shipping. I
remember passing one of those big liners in a motor boat one day.
I do not know what sort of an apparatus they had, but they dumped
the material, and everybody immediately grabbed their handkerchiefs
and held their noses until they got by. I believe that has a great
deal to do with the contamination of the water. Many of the summer
residents also wrap their garbage in paper and throw it in the river.
Mr. GARDNER. That is increasing in amount?
Mr. KYLE. Every year.
Mr. MIGNAULT. Have you any idea as to the summer population above
Brockville?
Mr. KYLE. Practically all the islands are occupied now, as well as
the shores, by summer residents, and at Alexandria Bay there are
thousands and thousands of people every day. I think we are getting
more contamination from the vicinity of Alexandria Bay than we are
perhaps from Gananoque.
Mr. MIGNAULT. How far are you from Alexandria Bay?
Mr. KYLE. About 22 miles.
Mr. MIGNAULT. How far are you from Gananoque?
Mr. KYLE. About 30 miles. I think probably in another year we will
filter our water. I think the water should be filtered, no matter
whether the sewage is treated or not.
Mr. MIGNAULT. I suppose the point you make, Mr. Kyle, is that unless
all communities treat their sewage, the treatment of sewage at
Brockville would not help you?
Mr. KYLE. It would not affect us and would not affect the other
towns. They would still have to chlorinate.
Mr. MIGNAULT. In other words, the water as it comes down from
Brockville is already polluted.
Mr. KYLE. Yes.
Mr. MIGNAULT. And I suppose, inasmuch as the summer population on
the islands is increasing, you could hardly expect that any system
of treatment of sewage or garbage going into the river could be ever
attempted?
Mr. KYLE. I do not know just how they would get after them. But
they would have to burn the garbage and treat their sewage. It is
a serious question for the municipalities. They have all issued
debentures for putting in plants for the disposal of the sewage, I
suppose with the permission of the Government. Some towns can do it
very easily, but in our town it would be a very serious question.
Mr. MIGNAULT. I understand that no studies have been made as to
sewage treatment in Brockville.
Mr. KYLE. Well, not to any great extent. The engineers have informed
us that it would be a very expensive undertaking on account of the
rocky formation and the hilly ground on which we are located.
Mr. POWELL. As I understand you, your personal view is that there
should be a general prevention of the deposit into the river of raw
sewage?
Mr. KYLE. Yes; it is my view that it should be prevented by both the
United States and Canada.
Mr. POWELL. You think it should be prevented by all concerned?
Mr. KYLE. Yes; by all concerned.
Mr. POWELL. All communities should be prohibited from depositing raw
sewage into the river.
Mr. KYLE. Yes, sir.
Mr. MIGNAULT. You would still have trouble from the campers on the
islands, even if the communities treated their sewage?
Mr. KYLE. Yes.
Mr. GARDNER. And from navigation also?
Mr. KYLE. Yes, sir; also from navigation.
Mr. POWELL. You are in favor of that as applying to the whole
community, but you think that it would be of no avail for any
particular community to attempt purification because of the
communities above?
Mr. KYLE. Yes, sir; because the boats would still contaminate the
water.
Mr. POWELL. Have you ever brought to the notice of the steamboat
association the pollution of the waters of the river through the
boats?
Mr. KYLE. Only by ordering them away from our docks. We have a dock
at the pumping station where the boats sometimes land, and we have
refused to allow them to land; but that applies more to our old
intake pipe than to the present one.
Mr. POWELL. But the fact remains that their presence there has the
effect of polluting the water?
Mr. KYLE. We simply ordered them away as a precaution.
Mr. POWELL. Was it a mere precautionary measure or was it because
they were a source of pollution?
Mr. KYLE. At that time we believed they were stirring up the water,
and the diver told us that the bottom was all soft stuff and it would
be naturally stirred up and go into the intake pipe. They can not do
that now. There is no question but what our water with the new intake
pipe is very much better than we got before.
Mr. POWELL. Then, what is the ground of your complaint? Is it against
the steamboats in that they stir up the deposit at the bottom of the
river, or that they add to the pollution?
Mr. KYLE. At the present time they add to the pollution. I do not
think they stir it up to any great extent.
Mr. POWELL. And you believe that is a real source of danger?
Mr. KYLE. Yes.
Mr. MAGRATH. Do you think that the passenger traffic is of sufficient
size to be a danger?
Mr. KYLE. I do. I think a thousand people coming out on a boat would
produce pollution in the river.
Mr. GARDNER. Have you any idea of the number of people that passed up
and down the river in boats during a season within the past two years?
Mr. KYLE. The excursion steamer _Thousand Islander_ goes out with a
thousand people. It very seldom goes farther than Alexandria Bay,
which is about 28 miles from Brockville.
Mr. POWELL. How many trips does she make a week?
Mr. KYLE. She makes a trip every day, practically; but that is only
one of the boats.
Mr. GARDNER. Do you think that on an average a thousand people a day
pass up and down the river during the period of navigation?
Mr. KYLE. For the total number of boats; yes, sir; very many more.
I think that around Alexandria Bay there are two or three thousand
people, or more, perhaps, every day, because the boats from Kingston
run in there.
Mr. Dewey has just informed me that he thinks there would be 30,000
people during the day within 30 miles of Brockville on passenger
steamers.
Mr. GARDNER. That would have reference to the whole navigation season?
Mr. DEWEY. Yes; and during July and August I think it would be a very
conservative estimate to say that there would be 35,000 people on
steamers every day.
Mr. POWELL. About how many freight steamers pass up and down daily?
Mr. DEWEY. I could not say. There is a continuous line of them. The
majority of the boats that go through the Welland Canal, freight
boats, that pass down the river, pass by here.
Mr. GARDNER. I do not suppose you have any means of knowing what the
average river population would be during the entire navigation season?
Mr. DEWEY. No, sir.
Mr. GARDNER. It would fall off greatly, of course, after what you
might term the vacation season?
Mr. DEWEY. My estimate of the number of people, tourists, would be
from the regular line of boats and the excursion steamers passing.
Mr. GARDNER. How late do these steamers run on the river here?
Mr. DEWEY. Until the middle of September.
Mr. MIGNAULT. Can you give us an idea as to the population on the
islands?
Mr. DEWEY. On the islands in the immediate vicinity of Brockville
there are about 1,500 people.
Mr. MAGRATH. You say Brockville people?
Mr. DEWEY. Probably Brockville people.
Mr. MIGNAULT. But from elsewhere than Brockville, what would the
total be?
Mr. DEWEY. The number of nonresidents of Brockville that would be in
the vicinity of Brockville would not be very large.
Mr. MIGNAULT. I am referring to the population that might affect the
water flowing past Brockville.
Mr. DEWEY. There would not be any substantial increase there, but I
should think it would be safe to say that there would be anywhere
from 5,000 to 10,000 people in the immediate vicinity of Alexandria
Bay and Clayton during the summer months.
Mr. POWELL. I was told that on one island alone there were pretty
nearly 10,000 people as a floating population.
Mr. DEWEY. Yes; that is on Thousand Island Park.
Mr. POWELL. You will find the floating population of Thousand Islands
and Alexandria Bay to be pretty close to 50,000.
Mr. DEWEY. Yes; but these would be permanent for the summer. There is
practically none in the immediate vicinity of Brockville occupied by
summer cottages.
Mr. POWELL. Taking the region that we have loosely called the
Thousand Island region, what would be the floating population of
those islands and the vicinity on the main land?
Mr. KYLE. That is difficult to say because they are coming in by the
thousand every day and staying a day and then leaving. I believe
100,000 a day would be a conservative estimate for the islands and
the immediate shores.
Mr. POWELL. Mr. Dallyn, did the bacteriological examinations that
were made on the river here cover the season when the floating
population was present?
Mr. DALLYN. There were two examinations made. We were on the river
with a laboratory from about the middle of April until the end of
May, and from about the 10th of August, to the 20th of August. It is
reported in the progress report.
Mr. POWELL. Have you any data, exact or otherwise, as to the summer
population of the district?
Mr. DALLYN. No; but I think there is something in Dr. McLaughlin’s
report as to that. We made no calculations ourselves. I know the
populations of Cape Vincent and Clayton double themselves in the
summer; but what the island population and the excursion population
were I have not any idea.
Mr. MIGNAULT. Is there any record available to show what that summer
population amounts to?
Mr. DALLYN. I am not sure.
Mr. MIGNAULT. It is rather important to know because that is a
feature, that and the pollution, and it strikes me at the present
moment that even if the communities treat their sewage and the boats
sterilize theirs, there will be still a danger from this summer
population camping on the islands.
Mr. DALLYN. Yes; that is true. They will come, of course, under
township regulations. I do not know just how they handle them on the
American side. In the Muskoka Lakes we make them treat their sewage
properly.
Mr. MIGNAULT. How do they accomplish that?
Mr. DALLYN. They have various methods of getting at it. Some use the
chemical process, and store it and pump it out in a nocuous form into
beds. Some lay piles through the sand.
Mr. MIGNAULT. What is your opinion as to the danger of pollution from
your summer population?
Mr. DALLYN. It is very serious. We were very much amazed in making a
minute survey on some of the islands to find that their sewage outlet
and their intakes would be only 40 feet away from each other, making
it practically certain that the two would mingle.
Mr. TAWNEY. Mr. Dallyn, I have here a report which you and Dr.
McLaughlin and Dr. McCullough made, a portion of which I wish to
read into the record. From page 50 of the progress report I read as
follows:
While examination below Wolfe Island among the Thousand
Islands did not show an average gross pollution, its
intermittent character presents a menace to the summer
residents in this section who take their supply of water
from the river without purification.
Examinations made in the vicinity of Brockville showed
that the shore samples collected from the cross section
above Brockville carried considerable pollution. Toward
midstream, where dilution and mixing had taken place,
the samples showed constant pollution of lesser degree.
Below Brockville the major pollution remained near the
banks of the river. Samples collected in midstream showed
very little pollution in the early work before navigation
opened. The latter work in August showed a very general
serious pollution, due probably to summer resort population
and to boat traffic. The condition of the river between
Brockville and Cornwall is very bad in the summer months,
as evidenced by midstream samples Nos. 266-273.
Unquestionably, the water from this portion of the St.
Lawrence River should not be used as a water supply without
adequate purification.
Mr. POWELL. It is a fact, is it not, that the pollution at these
summer resorts is steadily and rapidly increasing?
Mr. DALLYN. Undoubtedly so.
Mr. TAWNEY. There has been more this year than ever before, on
account of the long period of hot weather, and also the fact that
many people who have formerly gone abroad on their vacations have
remained here.
Mr. DALLYN. The education of the people has improved very materially
during the last few years, and they demand better conditions at the
summer resorts.
Mr. POWELL. You are quite familiar with the Thousand Island region,
are you not?
Mr. DALLYN. We spent about a month there in small boats.
Mr. POWELL. Passing in and out among the islands?
Mr. DALLYN. Yes, sir.
Mr. POWELL. Bearing in mind what Mr. Tawney read from the progress
report to the effect that there was a greater admixture of water
above Brockville than below, that would be due, would it not, to the
various channels and rapids among these islands?
Mr. DALLYN. Yes, sir; and the channel is very tortuous just at that
point.
Mr. POWELL. And there are jetties in all directions, which result in
a general churning and admixture of the water.
Mr. DALLYN. We discovered that the Cataraqui Bay at Kingston
periodically discharged itself completely into the St. Lawrence. That
would give us a very high pollution. It is simply a tidal effect. The
river seems to flow in both directions opposite Kingston.
Mr. MAGRATH. How far is it from Kingston to Charlotte?
Mr. DALLYN. I am really not aware. I imagine it would be about 130
miles.