A. That is to say, suppose this was the track. We would go and clear
this off, and then they would get in behind us, shouting and howling
and cursing. It kept three or four companies going there all day.
Q. Did you undertake to hold possession of the crossing of the track
any distance there at the crossing, or merely clear it off and fall
back?
A. Then they would rush in behind us, and we would have to send another
company.
Q. How happened there to be such a large crowd on the crossing at the
time the Philadelphia troops marched up?
A. I think our regiment had orders--that is the companies--had orders
to fall back and let the Philadelphians in. Our orders were, so far as
I can remember, that we were to go on a train, and go out.
Q. How long previous to the Philadelphia troops coming up there had you
fallen back?
A. I suppose it was about a minute.
Q. Some testify that the mob was mixed up with the troops there near
the crossing, and on the side of the hill?
A. They were only mixed up in that way, just as I told you.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. The troops were mixed in the crowd?
A. Yes; mixing in the crowd.
By Mr. Larrabee:
Q. How; were they on good terms--the crowd and the troops?
A. They didn't say anything. Some of them said they were going to clean
out the militia, we didn't take any notice of that at all.
Q. No particular hard feeling by the crowd against your troops?
A. No, sir.
Q. They showed considerable feeling against the Philadelphia troops--it
was supposed that they would clear the crossing there.
A. They were, of course, from Philadelphia, and they didn't like
them--that was about it.
Q. Could not the force you had there--these two regiments--could not
that crossing there, and the immediate neighborhood, been kept clear
entirely by the force you had there?
A. I think they could. That is very hard to tell. We didn't know what
might have happened.
Q. Were the efforts of the officers directed in that way--to keep it
clear?
A. Yes; of course some of our men were in sympathy with the strikers,
but if we were to take away two or three regiments, away to different
cities or somewhere out away from Pittsburgh, 1 think they could pretty
nearly clean out a city of this size.
Q. You don't think they were as firm in their duty as they would have
been in some other city?
A. Yes.
Q. They were a little more tender of the people they were dealing with?
A. Yes; they were friends and relatives.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Fraternize with the people--with the crowd?
A. I think if you would take the Fourteenth regiment out, in fact, even
in another riot, they would do their duty. All of our officers were men
in the army during the war except one or two. It is like all these
other things that are unexpected, and like in the war at first; they
were all demoralized, and didn't stand up as well as they did in the
last part of the war.
Q. Was the military at any time deployed on the railroad track, and any
attempt made to drive them off the track in both directions?
A. That was done all the time--they were kept off most of the time.
Q. Were the military deployed along the track of the railroad?
A. Yes; marched back and forward.
Q. Were they stationed with a skirmish line?
A. Not that I know of.
Q. In your opinion, as a military man, couldn't that mob or crowd have
been kept off the track by deploying the men along the track as a
skirmish line, or, say two skirmish lines, one on each side of the
track?
A. No, sir; I don't think it could, unless you did some shooting.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Could it have been done by doing some shooting?
A. If they had shot everybody that came they couldn't have got on.
Q. Could a skirmish line have maintained its position and kept the
crowd back?
A. I don't think they could by shooting, for the reason men, women, and
children would come in, and they couldn't have kept it clear--not kept
the whole track clear.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. The reason I asked him that, was that he said the companies marched
over on the railroad and they would fall in behind. I want to know if
the military had been deployed with two skirmish lines, why they
couldn't have kept the crowd away?
A. There was too many people.
Q. Were the people armed?
A. No, sir; not that I saw. They all might have had revolvers and such
things as that, but they had no guns.
Q. Did all that crowd appear to be violent and riotous, or were there a
great many there that were simply there out of curiosity?
A. Yes; there was a great many out of curiosity--three or four that
were working for me.
Q. How many hundred men do you think there were there that were riotous
or disposed to be lawless?
A. I should judge--of course it is a pretty hard thing to tell--there
was a great many, indeed--two thousand, anyhow.
Q. What proportion of that crowd were disposed to be riotous or
lawless?
A. There might have been five hundred in the first place, but after the
shooting commenced all were or pretty nearly all.
By Mr. Dewees:
Q. At any time before the Philadelphia troops came, could you have or
could the military have dispersed the mob at any time?
A. I think they could, yes.
* * * * *
James I. Bennett, being duly _sworn_, testified as follows:
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. State where you reside, Mr. Bennett?
A. Allegheny city is my residence.
Q. Where is your business?
A. In Pittsburgh.
Q. And what is it?
A. Manufacturing of iron nails, &c.
Q. Been engaged in the business a long time?
A. Twenty years or more. About twenty years.
Q. What is your firm name?
A. Graff, Bennett & Co.
Q. Were you in the city during the riots of July last?
A. I was.
Q. Just give us a statement of what you saw, the hour and date
commencing----
A. I was not in the riots. I was in the city, but I was not up to the
depot until Sunday--until Sunday afternoon. I didn't feel very much
concerned. Saturday is generally a busy day with us, but Saturday
afternoon I became anxious about the matter. I had been accustomed to
be in a good many of these quarrels with laboring men, and supposed the
thing would be adjusted; but on coming home on Saturday evening, from
what I heard, learned of the condition of affairs, I became
considerably alarmed and very much concerned. I live down that side of
the river at my residence, about three miles. After going home, I
hitched up my buggy, and came back to the city. When I came into the
city, the crowd was just coming, I think, out of Bowers' store. They
had cleaned out a gun store--hardware store, on Third street. The first
intimation I had of that was seeing a man with a gun, and I asked him
what was going on. I was satisfied that he had no business with the
gun. He told me there was a large crowd of men had been into Bowers'
store and broken it open and taken all the arms that they could get
there, and that they were marching then to the railroad. At one point I
turned around my horse and buggy and drove back to Mr. Thaw's house,
which is on Fifth street. I went to Mr. Thaw's house and I called him
out, and we talked about the matter. Thaw didn't appear to be alarmed;
he said he was going to his business. He thought there was no danger. I
went up again to Third street and Fifth street, and was satisfied in my
mind that there was a great deal of trouble, or was likely to be a
great deal, and I went back to Mr. Thaw. He spoke of the military
coming in, and he thought there was enough to protect. I advised him
not to go up to the offices of the Fort Wayne road at all. I think I
went back to Mr. Thaw's house the third time, and he then appeared to
be very much more concerned and alarmed this time. I think one of his
neighbors came down that had been up there. I left him then, and on my
way home, in Allegheny city, I went to Mr. McCullough's house. We sat
until perhaps eleven o'clock, talking together. Mr. McCullough at first
felt entirely satisfied that the military would be sufficient to
prevent any serious damage. I felt very much concerned, and advised him
to be very careful and not put himself in the way of danger or any
trouble.
Q. Who is Mr. McCullough?
A. Mr. McCullough is vice president of the Pennsylvania Company. He is
managing man of the Pennsylvania Company's lines.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. I would like you to state what the Pennsylvania lines were?
A. The leased lines west of this.
Q. Pennsylvania Central?
A. Their offices are altogether; but they are connecting lines. I live
in Allegheny city, and I felt concerned----
Q. What is Mr. McCollough's first name?
A. J. M. He told me there was a regiment coming up on the line of the
road that night, and that there was a sufficient number of troops
coming in that would prevent any trouble. He felt secure; but, as I
said before, I did not. I told him that there was trouble certain
ahead, and I felt very much concerned from what I could learn all
around, that there was gathering into our city a very bad set of men,
and it was hard to tell what the consequences might be. I left him, and
started home about eleven o'clock, or perhaps a little after eleven. I
got down to Strawberry lane, which is below the shops of the Fort Wayne
road. I drove right into a crowd, I presume, of several thousand
persons. I had come up that way that night, and there was no person
there.
Q. The evening before?
A. That same evening. There were no parties there when I came up, and I
drove in and called some of them to know what it meant. I was
considerably taken aback, coming unexpected into it, and they told me
they were waiting for a train of soldiers that were coming up. Three or
four came out that knew me, and said, "Don't you go away;" says I,
"Why?" Says he, "they have rifle pits just above there, and if the train
comes in you will be in the line of their fire," and I was in sight of
my house and my family was there, and I could see the situation, and
drove rapidly past them, after inquiring what was going on there. When
I came to the bridge crossing, perhaps, a quarter of a mile below
there, as I drove up there, there appeared to be sentinels stationed
along the line of the railroad across this bridge.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. At what point was this?
A. A quarter of a mile below this place where they were waiting.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. On the line of the Fort Wayne and Chicago?
A. They were there patrolling the streets with their guns, as orderly
as any soldiers. They were all very sober and polite men, nothing like
rioters, and ladies from the adjoining neighborhood had come down to
the bridge to see--that was the only place they could see anything--and
about the time they expected the train in, these men had gone up to
them and asked them to retire back behind the hill, lest a stray shot
would reach them. There appeared to be a perfect organization.
Q. What bridge?
A. This was a bridge in Allegheny City, below the outer depot of the
Fort Wayne.
Q. Bridge across the railroad?
A. Bridge across the railroad. There appeared to be an entirely perfect
organization on that side of the river. They were armed, and were sober
men. Some of them knew me--they all knew me--I could not name a great
many of them, but most of them knew me.
Q. Were they railroad men--employés?
A. There were a great many of them employés. I was told by other
persons they were employés. I could not tell certain, but I made an
inquiry, and was told that a great many of those men were employés of
the railroad company, and this organization appeared to me to be very
perfect, and they were very orderly, and appeared to be very
systematic. There was no fighting in this tremendous crowd above. The
crowd was there, but they were orderly--no quarreling nor fighting
going on.
Q. Were they all men that were in that crowd?
A. No; there was a great many boys, but the most of them were men. I
think the great majority of them were men. I stayed there until about
twelve o'clock at night, about half past twelve or one, and the report
came down about the firing on this side, and the burning of the
round-house, and the soldiers having been burned up. We were all very
much alarmed. I could do nothing but stay at home, seeing the crowd
there, and not knowing what was coming, but in the morning I came to
town--on Sunday morning. I stopped in Allegheny, and saw one or two
gentlemen, and got them to go over with me. I went to Mr. Barr's office
at the _Post_, but he was not there. He had been there, but had gone
out to the outer depot of the Pennsylvania railroad. I went around and
saw some other parties, and went down to the _Chronicle_ office. Mr.
Sieblich was there, and, I think, the _Dispatch_ people. At the office
there were posters out, one for a public meeting of the citizens at
twelve o'clock--at half past twelve, at the old city hall, notices of
which were then sent to the different churches, that there would be a
citizens' meeting--to be read from the pulpits in that neighborhood.
There was a large number of churches in the neighborhood There were no
citizens but what were extremely anxious to do anything and everything
they could do, but they appeared to be paralyzed, and did not know what
to do. The reports came in that the military had gone, and that the mob
had everything in their own hands, and no one appeared to know just how
things stood. That meeting came together, and they adjourned to the
mayor's office. I understood that there was a reason for that: that the
city hall then was used as an armory, and they had adjourned, as they
did not think it was prudent to open that. Some gentlemen I was talking
to had made a suggestion that we should go and see Bishop Tuigg, and
some other parties who would go out, and see what persuasion would do,
and there was no man that was more extensively known than Bishop Tuigg.
He said he would do so, and they proposed to get another minister that
he would nominate himself to go along with him. At our meeting in the
mayor's office, the minister of the First church, Mr. Scoville, was at
the meeting, and Mr. Scoville accompanied Bishop Tuigg. Mr. Parke and
some other gentlemen went up. At this time the fire had got down--it
had burned all the way down to the old market-house--that is a few
squares above the depot. We went up, and he addressed these people.
By Senator Yutzy.
Q. Who addressed them?
A. Bishop Tuigg. He did everything he could to get these people to
desist. I saw a few there that I knew of our own people, and these I do
say were not engaged in burning. After that, we went up to try and find
the engineers of the railroad--locomotive engineers. We went up to see
them. We got some of the citizens to go to their houses and tell them
that we would meet them. We went up there, and were not able to meet
any, but two or three of them at a time came in, and Mr. Slagle
remained there. Bishop Tuigg and the Reverend Scoville and I went over
there to Allegheny City to see the officials of the Pennsylvania
Company and Pennsylvania railroad. Mr. Cassatt was there, Mr. Thaw, Mr.
McCullough, and their solicitor, Senator Scott. We talked with them
upon the subject, but previous to that I had gone down to the
Monongahela house, and had met Mr. Cassatt there, and I think Mr. Quay,
and a number of gentlemen that were there. I took him in my buggy and
took him across to Allegheny City.
Q. Mr. Cassatt?
A. And left him there with the other gentlemen connected with the
railroad.
Q. What is Mr. Thaw's first name?
A. William Thaw.
Q. What is his official position?
A. He is also connected with the Pennsylvania Company, in charge of the
leased lines of the Pennsylvania railroad.
Q. In what capacity?
A. I think he is vice president.
Q. Mr. Cassatt is connected with what road?
A. Connected with the Pennsylvania Central.
Q. And Mr. Thaw with the Pennsylvania?
A. Mr. Thaw with the Pennsylvania. Mr. Cassatt was at the Monongahela
house, and these gentlemen had connection with the two roads running
together. He said he would like to go over. I said I would take him
over, and took him in my open buggy, which he did not appear to relish
very well just at that moment, but really there was no danger. I went
down and crossed the lower bridge, and over into the street where Mr.
Layng is living. I do not think we saw fifty people. The people had
gone up to the fire. Allegheny City was at that time as quiet as it is
on any Sabbath day, outside of the immediate neighborhood of the depot.
I met no person on Sunday who was not just as anxious as they could be
to do anything and everything they could to put down the rebellion, as
I called it, for as I have said, I never could recognize it as a riot
or anything else than an uprising of the people. On our own side of the
river it was comparative quietness, but these men were settled on
having their own way. If they had not commenced it before, it was not
likely that they could organize as quickly and as thoroughly as they
had done.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. What was the result of the interview with Cassatt and McCullough and
Thaw?
A. I think Bishop Tuigg asked them to make some concessions to those
parties, which they declined to make. I think the bishop's idea was to
have some little concession made, and the difficulty might be adjusted
as between the men and them. That was declined on their part.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. What reason did they give?
A. The reason, so far as I understood it at the time it was given, was
this: That they would not make any arrangement with men that were in
open rebellion against law, and everything of that kind--could not
recognize anything of that kind.
Q. What did your committee do then?
A. We came back to the city again, and there was a meeting in the
afternoon, and I was at the mayor's office again in the afternoon. The
mayor appeared to be entirely powerless. He had no police to do
anything with, that amounted to anything. After that we then went to
work and organized a citizens' meeting, which was perfected on the next
Monday morning, and everything was done by those men that could be
done. I do not think I ever saw men work more earnestly in trying to
protect the city, and railroad, and everything else.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. At whose instance was the citizens' meeting organized--who were the
movers in it?
A. The first I recollect of it was the bulletin boards that were put
out on Sunday--that was as soon as the citizens could be got together.
Q. What bulletin boards?
A. The bulletin boards of the _Post_, and, I think, the _Dispatch_, the
_Commercial_ and _Gazette_, and I think the _Chronicle_ and _Leader_.
They are nearly all in that neighborhood. I think Mr. Barr was at the
organization of the meeting. He was at the meeting they had on Sunday
and Monday morning. The citizens were called together again and
adjourned until Monday morning. There were a good many of our leading
manufacturers that were out of the city, their families were out in the
country, and they had gone out on Saturday.
Q. How long did that crowd you speak of in Allegheny City, that you ran
into on Saturday nights--how long had that crowd remained in force
there?
A. They were there I think nearly all that night. They were away the
next morning. When I came up the next morning they were not there, that
is, there was no crowd in comparison to what had been there--perhaps
not more than usual there.
Q. There were some there?
A. There were some few that were there. They had possession then of the
trains.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. The strikers had?
A. The strikers had possession of the trains on Sunday morning. They
were in possession there at that time.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. How many were engaged in actual riot and arson out at Twenty-eighth
street, when you were there with the bishop?
A. I do not think it was so far as Twenty-eighth street--it was within
a few squares of the depot. It would be impossible for any one to say
how many were actually engaged in it, but the whole railway connection,
so far as you could see, was filled with people on both sides of
it--the street on both sides of the railway track. The number that was
engaged in it appeared to be but few compared with the great crowd that
was there--very few.
Q. What class was the crowd that was there composed of?
A. The citizens you speak of along the street?
Q. Yes?
A. There appeared to be a general outpouring from the entire
city--every person. They were attracted there from every place.
Q. By curiosity?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. They were lookers-on?
A. They were lookers-on.
Q. Was there a crowd of sympathizers around, immediately around these
parties that were engaged in actual riot and arson?
A. There were some that were sympathizers, but so far as my own
knowledge went, men of any standing expressed no sympathy with them. A
great many of the workingmen felt that the railroad was oppressing
these men, and they were in sympathy with them--that is not taking any
part in it. There were a great many of our laboring men that were there
in their Sunday clothes that were taking no part, but walking around,
and a great many of them absolutely appeared to me to be alarmed and
frightened. That paralyzed them--not doing anything. I begged of the
men, for their own sakes, to try and stop that, and they felt as though
their lives were at stake in doing it. They were afraid to say a word;
did not know who was their friend or enemy. The men appeared to be
going on in a quiet way without saying much to anybody, except this
crowd that was before us--we were right in the immediate neighborhood
of the burning--as rough a looking set of characters as I ever saw. I
have no desire to get amongst such a crowd again very soon.
Q. Were these men laborers or men that you had ever seen in and about
Pittsburgh?
A. I could not say that any I saw in the burning were men I ever saw
before--could not say that they were men I ever saw before.
Q. Could you tell from their dress what class of people they were?
A. It would be very hard to tell that. I saw a great many of our own
men walking around looking on that were employed with us at our mills.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Have you an extensive acquaintance with the laboring men?
A. I know a great many of them by sight, and where they work. At the
two mills were employed six or seven hundred men, one way or another;
and back and forwards I have become quite familiar with them, without
knowing their names. Indeed, all the laboring men about the mills, as a
general rule they know me by sight, and I know a great many that have
worked with us, that are not working with us now, among the better
class of mill men and laboring men about the mills. I do not think they
were engaged. We have some men engaged with us that are very bad men.
Q. What was it that alarmed you on Saturday and made you apprehensive
of the future on Saturday afternoon?
A. What alarmed me first was this, when I began to make an
inquiry--that our mills all stopped on Saturday from eleven to twelve
o'clock, and the men about the mills had from one to two o'clock. They
usually dressed, and generally we see them about in the city, and they
are free from any employment. You can imagine the number of laboring
men there are about the city; and that, as a rule, would apply to
nearly all branches of manufacture.
Q. From your knowledge of the city and manufacturing establishments,
give us an estimate of the number of laborers that would be out of
employment and at leisure on Saturday afternoon.
A. I could not give you an estimate. I should say you could count it at
thousands, though--thousands of men that would be unemployed at that
time.
Q. Have you any idea of the number of thousands of laborers employed in
and about Pittsburgh?
A. I could not give any correct estimate of that.
Q. Have you had experience before with strikers? Has there been
strikes?
A. I have had a great deal to do with them at one time and another in
our own business--men that we had employed ourselves.
Q. Is it a thing of very frequent occurrence--strikes among laboring
men?
A. It is a common thing, but not so very frequent, these large
strikes--what we would call large strikes, where the mill hands in all
the mills strike. We frequently have difficulties of that kind in our
own mill when it does not occur in any others--upon a particular branch
of the business; something of that kind. We have had a number of very
large strikes here in the city where all the rolling mills were stopped
at one time.
Q. And it was your experience with the strikes, and knowing the number
of men that would be idle Saturday afternoon, that made you
apprehensive of the result?
A. That made me apprehensive; because these men were idle. They were
all idle, and a great many of them are men. For instance, to explain
more fully to you: A man comes along and he wants labor. We have our
labor bosses. We do not inquire into his character, or anything else.
If we need a man badly we put him in. He may be one of the worst men
possible, and we may have quite a number of these men about our mills
without knowing it. Tramps may come into our town, and if it is a time
that labor is a little scarce, we might have fifty of them about us
without knowing it--if they behave themselves just whilst they are
employed. Bad men may come in and settle down upon us in that way.
Q. Had you been up at the scene of the riot before Sunday?
A. No, sir; I had not been there before that.
Q. Did you at any time during the riot have any talk with the rioters
themselves, or the railroad employés, to ascertain their grievances, or
the causes of the strike?
A. Not on the Pennsylvania railroad; but I did on the other side of the
river, with them over there.
Q. Go on and give us the facts.
A. I had on the Fort Wayne and Chicago. I was among these men at the
shops. I went over there one night or two in the shops with those men,
talking to them, and they claimed that the railroad company had ground
them down; that their wages were such that they could not live. That
was their real grievance, and they wanted their wages restored. And
they complained of a large portion of the men unnecessarily being
thrown out of employment by doubling up the trains. That was the
complaint. They had their unions--there are unions existing among the
laboring men in our mills. Puddlers have their unions, and we have what
is called "The Amalgamated Iron Works Union," which embraces nearly
all. The railroad employés had their unions. These unions are all in
sympathy with each other, and as a rule, will aid each other. There
would be a sympathy existing among these men of all classes, for they
felt that they were oppressed by the railroad company; and, as I say,
they had the sympathy of the other workingmen of nearly every
class--there can be no question of that.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. Are these unions secret organizations?
A. Yes, sir; I think they are all secret organizations. I have never
known any that were not secret organizations. I was there with them,
and after some time Mr. McCullough--I don't recollect what day it
was--I was with Mr. McCullough, at his office, to get information.
Telegraphs were coming there, and I went there to get the news--to see
what was going on along the road. Mr. McCullough had not seen any of
the men of his own road. I got a gentleman to go and see them and tell
them that I thought there should be an interview between them and Mr.
McCullough, and I arranged that interview. I think there was one
engineer, a fireman, a brakeman, and a conductor--there were four, and
they agreed to meet Mr. McCullough, and I went with them and made the
arrangement to meet at B. F. Jones' house in Allegheny City. Mr.
McCullough came there and met them, and Mr. Layng also. They had a
conversation there.
Q. Give us the summary of that conversation?
A. They stated to Mr. McCullough what the grievances were with regard
to what the hands wanted. A portion of them denied that they had
anything to do with the strike.
Q. That was after the Sunday?
A. This was after the Sunday of the burning. Mr. McCullough talked with
them, and the interview was a very pleasant one. Mr. McCullough said he
would do all that he could to have everything made right and
satisfactory to them whenever the property was once placed in their
hands, but whilst they stood out and kept them from their property he
could not do anything at all. I told these men--I said to them
afterwards that Mr. McCullough was right in his position; that they
were in violation of law, and they claimed they were there, and they
were not interfering with anybody nor anything, nor had they purposed
to interfere with anybody. I told them that their simple presence was
enough to show that they were in sympathy with these people. They might
almost as well be guilty as to be doing what they were doing. I went
down and talked to a number of the engineers with regard to the matter.
As a rule, they were vary reticent and very careful about giving any
expression at all.
Q. Did they claim a right to stop trains--interfere with trains?
A. Of course, they didn't to me. They were men of too good sense. They
denied having anything to do with it. It was always somebody else. As I
said, they were there giving countenance.
Q. How did these people define a strike?
A. They said this was not a strike of the engineers. This was a strike
of the firemen--the firemen and brakemen, I believe. They threw it on
them. I thought things were settled, and they were going to work. I
came up and said, "Boys, how is it, I thought you were going to work"
They said they were going to have a meeting, and asked me to go with
them. I said I would go. They said they were going to have it then. I
went down to the meeting in the Odd Fellows' Hall, and went in with
them, and was there, and they denied that it was them solely. They said
the engineers had as much to do with it as they had--just the same--and
that they were encouraging them. I stated to them, then, that I would
do all I could to have their pay made right, but there was only one way
to do it, that I could see, and that was to report themselves ready for
work, and take their positions, and after the road was once running,
and in order, then the citizens would see to it that their case was
properly represented, and that they would be more likely to get their
rights in that way than in any other.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. At this time they had possession of the railroad property?
A. They disclaimed having possession of the property. They would not
admit that fact. They appeared to understand that that was in violation
of the law.
Q. Was that the fact?
A. This was the fact--there was no doubt of that. You could not get any
of them to admit it, though.
Q. Did they understand that they had no right to interfere with the
running of trains, or with any other employé who desired to work?
A. They denied interfering with any employé. There never was a man yet
that said he interfered with any one--never got an admission of that
kind from any one. They said if a man wanted to go to work, there was
his engine. At the same time, Mr. Layng, superintendent of the road,
whilst he was but a few squares from the depot, I think he didn't care
about going over to the railroad at that time, I met them the same day,
and they went and reported themselves to the officers at the outer
depot, and went to work.
Q. From the interviews that you had with the railroad employés, what
did you gather as being the cause--the real cause of the strike?
A. From all I could gather from the employés in one way or another, my
impression is that it was an organization. That perhaps the strike was
a little sooner than was intended. It was a regular organization,
intending to make a general strike throughout the whole country at the
same time, and it was not the intention to be commenced at Pittsburgh.
I think it was all over our country. We might call it an insurrection
of these people to take possession and enforce their demands on the
people. They then knew that the other labor organizations were in
sympathy with them.
Q. What led you to that conclusion?
A. From the fact that these uprisings at Fort Wayne and Chicago and St.
Louis, and on the line of the Baltimore and Ohio and Altoona and
Harrisburg and Philadelphia. If it had been of an ordinary character,
it would have had no influence, except where it originated.
Q. Did you ascertain from the men that there was any communication
between the rioters here and the rioters at the other places you have
mentioned?
A. I think one told me that they were in possession of the telegraph
lines, and knew all that was going on, and one stated to me at one time
something like this: He says, "We knew what was going on, because one
of the men with us is an operator, who stood outside of the window, and
he could hear the instrument and could tell us what was going over the
line." I think they had possession of the telegraph line, and a good
many were operators.
Q. He told you they knew what was going on--that was between the
authorities, &c., in reference to the matter; but did he say that they
had any communication through the rioters themselves by telegraph?
A. No; I do not know that any one admitted anything of the kind. They
were very careful in making any admissions. These men you will find, so
far as the law was concerned, they really understood that as well as
any other class of men, where they are liable and where they are not.
Q. The strikes at Fort Wayne and Chicago and Altoona and Philadelphia
that you have mentioned, were not until after the strike here--were
they?
A. I think it was almost simultaneous--it was very nearly the same
time--on the Sunday following right along--immediately on the heels of
it, and I should think it was all during two or three days.
Q. Do you know what days the strike was at its height in Chicago?
A. No.
Q. Nor Fort Wayne?
A. I have no recollection now of just when this was, for I took no note
of that.
Q. Nor in Philadelphia?
A. Nor in Philadelphia. I think it was unfortunate that they attempted
to start these trains out--these double-headers here on Saturday.
By Mr. Yutzy:
Q. Why?
A. Because there were so many men loose--the laboring men of our
town--you may say that certainly four fifths of the laboring men were
unemployed after twelve or one o'clock, and that is the best reason I
could give you for it. If I was going to do anything to a crowd, I
should have postponed it until these men were at work. I think it was
unfortunate, because, as I stated before, we all knew of the existence
of these organizations, and we knew that these men that were in these
organizations were all in sympathy, the one with the other.
By Mr. Lindsey:
Q. Was the fact that there would be so large a number of unemployed men
on Saturday afternoon, known to the railroad officers?
A. I do not know that of my own knowledge. Mr. James Park, I think,
told me that he had remonstrated with some of the railroad officials--I
think he had spoken to Mr. Cassatt on the subject.
Q. Did you have any conversation?
A. I had no conversation on the subject, because I was engaged and busy
on Saturday, and was not alarmed in regard to this. Mr. Park's
manufacturing establishment was in the immediate vicinity of the
trouble, and you might say he was in it. He was located right in it,
and he was there, and I think what I say in regard to that, will be the
testimony of every manufacturer in the city. I believe if the thing had
been left until Monday or Tuesday, that the probabilities are that men
would be generally about their employment at one thing or another, that
there might have been no burning here at all. We might have had trouble
and loss of life, and things of that kind. Why I say I think there was
an organization, when I went home on Saturday night, coming up after
dark, they were expecting this train in. These men certainly knew that
train was coming with soldiers, and they were prepared to meet them.
They were orderly--a quarter of a mile below, at the bridge--there
appeared to be entirely too much order for a riot. When there is a
riot, they generally do things up very quickly, without regard to who
is in the way. These men were orderly and systematic.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. This train you speak of--was that train from Erie?
A. I think that was the Erie train. Mr. McCullough told me he expected
that train in. I was informed that they had no ammunition or anything
of that kind.
Q. These men you conversed with gave as a reason for their strike that
the wages were so low they could not live?
A. That was the general complaint.
Q. Do you know what they were actually getting?
A. I did know, and I had it from the railroad officials--I had it from
them, but I have forgotten what it was.
Q. Were any of them getting less than a dollar a day--trainmen?
A. I think they were paid by the trip, but I do not recollect that any
of them were getting less than that. I would not speak positively in
regard to that. It may be possible. I have a memorandum of that in my
pocket-book. I never expected to be called before a committee, or I
would have saved some of these things that I had. It may be I have
something here that will enable me to answer that question.
Q. If you find it hereafter you can send it to us, and we can attach it
to your testimony.
A. It was a copy of a telegraph--you asked me a question; it would have
answered it. It was a copy of a telegraph I had sent to Mr. McCullough
on the subject, and his reply to it, but I think that, supposing that
the thing was ended, my impression is that I have destroyed it.
Q. Have you anything else to communicate, Mr. Bennett?
A. Nothing; but I would bear testimony to the fact that the citizens of
Pittsburgh appeared to be anxious to do everything they could to put
down this riot, and there was no sympathy with the rioters--none
whatever.
Q. You had a good deal to do in raising the force of citizens to put
down the riot?
A. I had, perhaps. The first move, I told you, was on Sunday. A good
many of my most intimate acquaintances were among the rolling mills,
and quite a large number of them were out of the city. I sent for Mr.
Park.
Q. Did you meet with any opposition in your efforts to raise the men?
A. Not a single instance. Upon the contrary, every man I saw was
anxious to do anything, and were willing and did go up there at the
risk of their lives, to do everything they could do, and no man I met
anywhere at all, among my own acquaintances, but what were ready to do
anything they would deem in reason, to try to stop it; and I think it
was stopped by the citizens at last. I was not present, but from what I
heard afterwards, the citizens prevented the burning of the Fort Wayne
depot.
Q. Was there any move by the citizens prior to Sunday morning?
A. Not that I know of. I have no knowledge of any--no recollection of
any now. It was early Sunday morning that they set fire to things in
the first place, and the citizens appeared to be completely paralyzed.
I saw men coming along, carrying provisions, bacon, hams, and articles
that they had taken from the cars they had broken open--carrying them
away back two or three miles into the country, and I saw them walking
along the streets, and it appeared to me that people were afraid to say
a word to them. They were alarmed--they did not know what to make of
it. It appeared to come upon them like a clap of thunder--they were
unprepared for it in any way. I never saw men labor more earnestly, and
labor harder to try to do their whole duty than that citizens'
committee did. It was through their individual efforts that there was
an additional police, and it was by private subscription to pay these
men, that they were put upon the force. Our city was in a helpless
condition, and these bad men, of which we have a large number around
the city--they knew exactly what the police force was, better than we
did.
Q. Did you know the police force had been reduced in the city, and, if
so, when were you informed of that fact?
A. I had no knowledge that our city was in so helpless a condition. I
was amazed when I heard it.
Q. Was it known to the business men--I mean generally--that your city
was in such a condition, in regard to the police force?
A. I do not think they generally understood the matter. They might have
been under the impression that there was a reduction of police, but so
few----
Q. Was it the subject of conversation when it became known?
A. Of course it was, and the very moment it was discovered, they sought
to apply the remedy by making contributions of money themselves, to
have the force put on, and agreeing to pay for it.
Q. Did you have any talk with the mayor yourself in relation to that
subject?
A. 1 did, at his office. He told me then that he had no power to do
anything, but expressed a willingness and a desire to do anything he
could, and I do not think that any suggestion I made to him, he ever
refused to do anything it was in his power to do.
Q. What day was that?
A. I had a conversation with him on Sunday, and again on Monday, and as
I met him at different times, I would have a talk with the mayor.
Q. Was it known to you that the mayor had full authority and control
over the police, to increase the number of police, or to call out--was
it known to you that he had the same authority that the sheriff had in
calling out the police?
A. No, sir; it was not.
Q. Did he make any proclamation calling for police?
A. He made some proclamation. I cannot tell you what it was--do not
recollect what it was.
Q. Did you ever examine to see what powers are given to the mayor by
your city charter?
A. I did not in regard to Allegheny City. After Sunday, I was more with
Mayor Phillips, and more on that side than I was on this. I believe
Colonel Scott telegraphed to me himself, and said that they would
commence laying the tracks, if their men would be protected, and I went
to Mr. Shinn and got him to send an answer to him that they would be,
and I would lay the matter before the committee the next morning.
Immediately on the committee convening, I brought the matter before
them, and the committee answered Colonel Scott that they would be
protected. I went out of the committee myself, and started up to meet
Mr. Pitcairn at the office of Mr. Layng, and stated to Mr. Layng in
regard to that telegram, and my own impression that they should put the
men on to work to feel their way, and if they were interfered with to
withdraw them, that I believed that before night would come that they
would have more men than they would know what to do with, and that was
the result. I spoke of being out on Sunday and not seeing any of the
officials of the railroad at all. I think they did right. I do not
think it would have been prudent for them to be there. I advised those
I knew to keep away. You could not tell to what extent this excitement
would lead a man, nor you could not tell how bad men were. They might
have been seriously injured, if not killed, if any one of them had gone
into a crowd of that kind.
Q. Would the presence of the railroad officials have tended to
exasperate the crowd, do you think?
A. Yes, sir. I don't think it would have been safe for them to have
been there. I think it would have exasperated them.
Q. Where was Adjutant Latta during the day--Sunday?
A. I think he was at the Monongahela house, with Cassatt--I think he
was there.
Q. Until what hour?
A. I was introduced to him when I took Mr. Cassatt across to Allegheny
City. It must have been between eleven and twelve o'clock. I left him
there, and I was not back to the Monongahela house after that. I
learned they had gone down the river to Beaver. I think General Latta
was along. There was a number of gentlemen there. Mr. Cassatt was
anxious in regard to the soldiers that they had. I did not know the
condition of them, nor did he--how these men that had come from
Philadelphia were. He appeared to be under the impression that they had
got out, and had neither provision nor ammunition, and I said that I
could fix a way that they could have the supplies--that there were
parties in Allegheny who would attend to that. I went down on Monday to
Mr. Ray, and he sent them out provisions, and told me afterwards that
they had removed their head-quarters, and he had followed them up to
Blairsville, and had delivered them cooked provisions.
Q. Who is Mr. Ray?
A. He is a grocer on Liberty street.
Q. In Allegheny City?
A. No, sir; Pittsburgh.
Q. Would it have been prudent for the Adjutant General to have remained
in the city during the day, Sunday?
A. To have gone into the crowd?
Q. Yes; or remained in the city?
A. I do not think there would have been a hair of his head harmed.
Q. Would it have been prudent for the other State officials?
A. If they had remained at the Monongahela house they would not have
been disturbed.
Q. If the Adjutant General had gone to the scene of the riot, would he
have been disturbed?
A. I think there would have been danger. Any man went in at the peril
of his life--any officer went in single-handed, alone.
By Senator Yutzy:
Q. You have a very extensive knowledge of what transpired here during
the riots. I want to know whether, in your opinion, there was a
disposition on the part of the city and county authorities to protect
property and to suppress the riot. If so, could they have done so?