CLEVELAND AND THURMAN.

_Question_. What do you think of the Democratic nominations?

_Answer_. In the first place, I hope that this campaign is to be

fought on the issues involved, and not on the private characters

of the candidates. All that they have done as politicians--all

measures that they have favored or opposed--these are the proper

subjects of criticism; in all other respects I think it better to

let the candidates alone. I care but little about the private

character of Mr. Cleveland or of Mr. Thurman. The real question

is, what do they stand for? What policy do they advocate? What

are the reasons for and against the adoption of the policy they

propose?

I do not regard Cleveland as personally popular. He has done

nothing, so far as I know, calculated to endear him to the popular

heart. He certainly is not a man of enthusiasm. He has said

nothing of a striking or forcible character. His messages are

exceedingly commonplace. He is not a man of education, of wide

reading, of refined tastes, or of general cultivation. He has some

firmness and a good deal of obstinacy, and he was exceedingly

fortunate in his marriage.

Four years ago he was distinctly opposed to a second term. He was

then satisfied that no man should be elected President more than

once. He was then fearful that a President might use his office,

his appointing power, to further his own ends instead of for the

good of the people. He started, undoubtedly, with that idea in

his mind. He was going to carry out the civil service doctrine to

the utmost. But when he had been President a few months he was

exceedingly unpopular with his party. The Democrats who elected

him had been out of office for twenty-five years. During all those

years they had watched the Republicans sitting at the national

banquet. Their appetites had grown keener and keener, and they

expected when the 4th of March, 1885, came that the Republicans

would be sent from the table and that they would be allowed to tuck

the napkins under their chins. The moment Cleveland got at the

head of the table he told his hungry followers that there was

nothing for them, and he allowed the Republicans to go on as usual.

In a little while he began to hope for a second term, and gradually

the civil service notion faded from his mind. He stuck to it long

enough to get the principal mugwump papers committed to him and to

his policy; long enough to draw their fire and to put them in a

place where they could not honorably retreat without making themselves

liable to the charge of having fought only for the loaves and

fishes. As a matter of fact, no men were hungrier for office than

the gentlemen who had done so much for civil service reform. They

were so earnest in the advocacy of that principle that they insisted

that only their followers should have place; but the real rank and

file, the men who had been Democrats through all the disastrous

years, and who had prayed and fasted, became utterly disgusted with

Mr. Cleveland's administration and they were not slow to express

their feelings. Mr. Cleveland saw that he was in danger of being

left with no supporters, except a few who thought themselves too

respectable really to join the Democratic party. So for the last

two years, and especially the last year, he turned his attention

to pacifying the real Democrats. He is not the choice of the

Democratic party. Although unanimously nominated, I doubt if he

was the unanimous choice of a single delegate.

Another very great mistake, I think, has been made by Mr. Cleveland.

He seems to have taken the greatest delight in vetoing pension

bills, and they seem to be about the only bills he has examined,

and he has examined them as a lawyer would examine the declaration,

brief or plea of his opponent. He has sought for technicalities,

to the end that he might veto these bills. By this course he has

lost the soldier vote, and there is no way by which he can regain

it. Upon this point I regard the President as exceedingly weak.

He has shown about the same feeling toward the soldier now that he

did during the war. He was not with them then either in mind or

body. He is not with them now. His sympathies are on the other

side. He has taken occasion to show his contempt for the Democratic

party again and again. This certainly will not add to his strength.

He has treated the old leaders with great arrogance. He has cared

nothing for their advice, for their opinions, or for their feelings.

The principal vestige of monarchy or despotism in our Constitution

is the veto power, and this has been more liberally used by Mr.

Cleveland than by any other President. This shows the nature of

the man and how narrow he is, and through what a small intellectual

aperture he views the world. Nothing is farther from true democracy

than this perpetual application of the veto power. As a matter of

fact, it should be abolished, and the utmost that a President should

be allowed to do, would be to return a bill with his objections,

and the bill should then become a law upon being passed by both

houses by a simple majority. This would give the Executive the

opportunity of calling attention to the supposed defects, and

getting the judgment of Congress a second time.

I am perfectly satisfied that Mr. Cleveland is not popular with

his party. The noise and confusion of the convention, the cheers

and cries, were all produced and manufactured for effect and for

the purpose of starting the campaign.

Now, as to Senator Thurman. During the war he occupied substantially

the same position occupied by Mr. Cleveland. He was opposed to

putting down the Rebellion by force, and as I remember it, he rather

justified the people of the South for going with their States.

Ohio was in favor of putting down the Rebellion, yet Mr. Thurman,

by some peculiar logic of his own, while he justified Southern

people for going into rebellion because they followed their States,

justified himself for not following his State. His State was for

the Union. His State was in favor of putting down rebellion. His

State was in favor of destroying slavery. Certainly, if a man is

bound to follow his State, he is equally bound when the State is

right. It is hardly reasonable to say that a man is only bound to

follow his State when his State is wrong; yet this was really the

position of Senator Thurman.

I saw the other day that some gentlemen in this city had given as

a reason for thinking that Thurman would strengthen the ticket,

that he had always been right on the financial question. Now, as

a matter of fact, he was always wrong. When it was necessary for

the Government to issue greenbacks, he was a hard money man--he

believed in the mint drops--and if that policy had been carried

out, the Rebellion could not have been suppressed. After the

suppression of the Rebellion, and when hundreds and hundreds of

millions of greenbacks were afloat, and the Republican party proposed

to redeem them in gold, and to go back--as it always intended to

do--to hard money--to a gold and silver basis--then Senator Thurman,

holding aloft the red bandanna, repudiated hard money, opposed

resumption, and came out for rag currency as being the best. Let

him change his ideas--put those first that he had last--and you

might say that he was right on the currency question; but when the

country needed the greenback he was opposed to it, and when the

country was able to redeem the greenback, he was opposed to it.

It gives me pleasure to say that I regard Senator Thurman as a man

of ability, and I have no doubt that he was coaxed into his last

financial position by the Democratic party, by the necessities of

Ohio, and by the force and direction of the political wind. No

matter how much respectability he adds to the ticket, I do not

believe that he will give any great strength. In the first place,

he is an old man. He has substantially finished his career. Young

men cannot attach themselves to him, because he has no future.

His following is not an army of the young and ambitious--it is

rather a funeral procession. Yet, notwithstanding this fact, he

will furnish most of the enthusiasm for this campaign--and that

will be done with his handkerchief. The Democratic banner is

Thurman's red bandanna. I do not believe that it will be possible

for the Democracy to carry Ohio by reason of Thurman's nomination,

and I think the failure to nominate Gray or some good man from that

State, will lose Indiana. So, while I have nothing to say against

Senator Thurman, nothing against his integrity or his ability,

still, under the circumstances, I do not think his nomination a

strong one.

_Question_. Do you think that the nominations have been well

received throughout the United States?

_Answer_. Not as well as in England. I see that all the Tory

papers regard the nominations as excellent--especially that of

Cleveland. Every Englishman who wants Ireland turned into a

penitentiary, and every Irishman to be treated as a convict, is

delighted with the action of the St. Louis convention. England

knows what she wants. Her market is growing small. A few years

ago she furnished manufactured articles to a vast portion of the

world. Millions of her customers have become ingenious enough to

manufacture many things that they need, so the next thing England

did was to sell them the machinery. Now they are beginning to make

their own machinery. Consequently, English trade is falling off.

She must have new customers. Nothing would so gratify her as to

have sixty millions of Americans buy her wares. If she could see

our factories still and dead; if she could put out the fires of

our furnaces and forges; there would come to her the greatest

prosperity she has ever known. She would fatten on our misfortunes

--grow rich and powerful and arrogant upon our poverty. We would

become her servants. We would raise the raw material with ignorant

labor and allow her children to reap all the profit of its manufacture,

and in the meantime to become intelligent and cultured while we

grew poor and ignorant.

The greatest blow that can be inflicted upon England is to keep

her manufactured articles out of the United States. Sixty millions

of Americans buy and use more than five hundred millions of Asiatics

--buy and use more than all of China, all of India and all of

Africa. One civilized man has a thousand times the wants of a

savage or of a semi-barbarian. Most of the customers of England

want a few yards of calico, some cheap jewelry, a little powder,

a few knives and a few gallons of orthodox rum.

To-day the United States is the greatest market in the world. The

commerce between the States is almost inconceivable in its immensity.

In order that you may have some idea of the commerce of this country,

it is only necessary to remember one fact. We have railroads enough

engaged in this commerce to make six lines around the globe. The

addition of a million Americans to our population gives us a better

market than a monopoly of ten millions of Asiatics. England, with

her workhouses, with her labor that barely exists, wishes this

market, and wishes to destroy the manufactures of America, and she

expects Irish-Americans to assist her in this patriotic business.

Now, as to the enthusiasm in this country. I fail to see it. The

nominations have fallen flat. It has been known for a long time

that Cleveland was to be nominated. That has all been discounted,

and the nomination of Judge Thurman has been received in a quite

matter-of-fact way. It may be that his enthusiasm was somewhat

dampened by what might be called the appearance above the horizon

of the morning star of this campaign--Oregon. What a star to rise

over the work of the St. Louis convention! What a prophecy for

Democrats to commence business with! Oregon, with the free trade

issue, seven thousand to eight thousand Republican majority--the

largest ever given by that State--Oregon speaks for the Pacific

Coast.

_Question_. What do you think of the Democratic platform?

_Answer_. Mr. Watterson was kind enough to say that before they

took the roof off of the house they were going to give the occupants

a chance to get out. By the "house" I suppose he means the great

workshop of America. By the "roof" he means protection; and by

the "occupants" the mechanics. He is not going to turn them out

at once, or take the roof off in an instant, but this is to be done

gradually.

In other words, they will remove it shingle by shingle or tile by

tile, until it becomes so leaky or so unsafe that the occupants--

that is to say, the mechanics, will leave the building.

The first thing in the platform is a reaffirmation of the platform

of 1884, and an unqualified endorsement of President Cleveland's

message on the tariff. And if President Cleveland's message has

any meaning whatever, it means free trade--not instantly, it may

be--but that is the object and the end to be attained. All his

reasoning, if reasoning it can be called, is in favor of absolute

free trade. The issue is fairly made--shall American labor be

protected, or must the American laborer take his chances with the

labor market of the world? Must he stand upon an exact par with

the laborers of Belgium and England and Germany, not only, but with

the slaves and serfs of other countries? Must he be reduced to

the diet of the old country? Is he to have meat on holidays and

a reasonably good dinner on Christmas, and live the rest of the

year on crusts, crumbs, scraps, skimmed milk, potatoes, turnips,

and a few greens that he can steal from the corners of fences? Is

he to rely for meat, on poaching, and then is he to be transported

to some far colony for the crime of catching a rabbit? Are our

workingmen to wear wooden shoes?

Now, understand me, I do not believe that the Democrats think that

free trade would result in disaster. Their minds are so constituted

that they really believe that free trade would be a great blessing.

I am not calling in question their honesty. I am simply disputing

the correctness of their theory. It makes no difference, as a

matter of fact, whether they are honest or dishonest. Free trade

established by honest people would be just as injurious as if

established by dishonest people. So there is no necessity of

raising the question of intention. Consequently, I admit that they

are doing the best they know now. This is not admitting much, but

it is something, as it tends to take from the discussion all ill

feeling.

We all know that the tariff protects special interests in particular

States. Louisiana is not for free trade. It may be for free trade

in everything except sugar. It is willing that the rest of the

country should pay an additional cent or two a pound on sugar for

its benefit, and while receiving the benefit it does not wish to

bear its part of the burden. If the other States protect the sugar

interests in Louisiana, certainly that State ought to be willing

to protect the wool interest in Ohio, the lead and hemp interest

in Missouri, the lead and wool interest in Colorado, the lumber

interest in Minnesota, the salt and lumber interest in Michigan,

the iron interest in Pennsylvania, and so I might go on with a list

of the States--because each one has something that it wishes to

have protected.

It sounds a little strange to hear a Democratic convention cry out

that the party "is in favor of the maintenance of an indissoluble

union of free and indestructible States." Only a little while ago

the Democratic party regarded it as the height of tyranny to coerce

a free State. Can it be said that a State is "free" that is

absolutely governed by the Nation? Is a State free that can make

no treaty with any other State or country--that is not permitted

to coin money or to declare war? Why should such a State be called

free? The truth is that the States are not free in that sense.

The Republican party believes that this is a Nation and that the

national power is the highest, and that every citizen owes the

highest allegiance to the General Government and not to his State.

In other words, we are not Virginians or Mississippians or Delawareans

--we are Americans. The great Republic is a free Nation, and the

States are but parts of that Nation. The doctrine of State

Sovereignty was born of the institution of slavery. In the history

of our country, whenever anything wrong was to be done, this doctrine

of State Sovereignty was appealed to. It protected the slave-trade

until the year 1808. It passed the Fugitive Slave Law. It made

every citizen in the North a catcher of his fellow-man--made it

the duty of free people to enslave others. This doctrine of State

Rights was appealed to for the purpose of polluting the Territories

with the institution of slavery. To deprive a man of his liberty,

to put him back into slavery, State lines were instantly obliterated;

but whenever the Government wanted to protect one of its citizens

from outrage, then the State lines became impassable barriers, and

the sword of justice fell in twain across the line of a State.

People forget that the National Government is the creature of the

people. The real sovereign is the people themselves. Presidents

and congressmen and judges are the creatures of the people. If we

had a governing class--if men were presidents or senators by virtue

of birth--then we might talk about the danger of centralization;

but if the people are sufficiently intelligent to govern themselves,

they will never create a government for the destruction of their

liberties, and they are just as able to protect their rights in

the General Government as they are in the States. If you say that

the sovereignty of the State protects labor, you might as well say

that the sovereignty of the county protects labor in the State and

that the sovereignty of the town protects labor in the county.

Of all subjects in the world the Democratic party should avoid

speaking of "a critical period of our financial affairs, resulting

from over taxation." How did taxation become necessary? Who

created the vast debt that American labor must pay? Who made this

taxation of thousands of millions necessary? Why were the greenbacks

issued? Why were the bonds sold? Who brought about "a critical

period of our financial affairs"? How has the Democratic party

"averted disaster"? How could there be a disaster with a vast

surplus in the treasury? Can you find in the graveyard of nations

this epitaph: "Died of a Surplus"? Has any nation ever been known

to perish because it had too much gold and too much silver, and

because its credit was better than that of any other nation on the

earth? The Democrats seem to think--and it is greatly to their

credit--that they have prevented the destruction of the Government

when the treasury was full--when the vaults were overflowing. What

would they have done had the vaults been empty? Let them wrestle

with the question of poverty; let them then see how the Democratic

party would succeed. When it is necessary to create credit, to

inspire confidence, not only in our own people, but in the nations

of the world--which of the parties is best adapted for the task?

The Democratic party congratulates itself that it has not been

ruined by a Republican surplus! What good boys we are! We have

not been able to throw away our legacy!

Is it not a little curious that the convention plumed itself on

having paid out more for pensions and bounties to the soldiers and

sailors of the Republic than was ever paid before during an equal

period? It goes wild in its pretended enthusiasm for the President

who has vetoed more pension bills than all the other Presidents put

together.

The platform informs us that "the Democratic party has adopted and

consistently pursued and affirmed a prudent foreign policy, preserving

peace with all nations." Does it point with pride to the Mexican

fiasco, or does it rely entirely upon the great fishery triumph?

What has the administration done--what has it accomplished in the

field of diplomacy?

When we come to civil service, about how many Federal officials

were at the St. Louis convention? About how many have taken part

in the recent nominations? In other words, who has been idle?

We have recently been told that the wages of workingmen are just

as high in the old country as in this, when you take into consideration

the cost of living. We have always been told by all the free trade

papers and orators, that the tariff has no bearing whatever upon

wages, and yet, the Democrats have not succeeded in convincing

themselves. I find in their platform this language: "A fair and

careful revision of our tax laws, with due allowance for the

difference between the wages of American and foreign labor, must

promote and encourage every branch of such industries and enterprises

by giving them the assurance of an extended market and steady and

continuous operations."

It would seem from this that the Democratic party admits that wages

are higher here than in foreign countries. Certainly they do not

mean to say that they are lower. If they are higher here than in

foreign countries, the question arises, why are they higher? If

you took off the tariff, the presumption is that they would be as

low here as anywhere else, because this very Democratic convention

says: "A fair and careful revision of our tax laws, with due

allowance for the difference between wages." In other words, they

would keep tariff enough on to protect our workingmen from the low

wages of the foreigner--consequently, we have the admission of the

Democratic party that in order to keep wages in this country higher

than they are in Belgium, in Italy, in England and in Germany, we

must protect home labor. Then follows the _non sequitur_, which

is a Democratic earmark. They tell us that by keeping a tariff,

"making due allowance for the difference between wages, all the

industries and enterprises would be encouraged and promoted by

giving them the assurance of an extended market." What does the

word "extended" mean? If it means anything, it means a market in

other countries. In other words, we will put the tariff so low

that the wages of American workingmen will be so low that he can

compete with the laborers of other countries; otherwise his market

could not be "extended." What does this mean? There is evidently

a lack of thought here. The two things cannot be accomplished in

that way. If the tariff raises American wages, the American cannot

compete in foreign markets with the men who work for half the price.

What may be the final result is another question. American industry

properly protected, American genius properly fostered, may invent

ways and means--such wonderful machinery, such quick, inexpensive

processes, that in time American genius may produce at a less rate

than any other country, for the reason that the laborers of other

countries will not be as intelligent, will not be as independent,

will not have the same ambition.

Fine phrases will not deceive the people of this country. The

American mechanic already has a market of sixty millions of people,

and, as I said before, the best market in the world. This country

is now so rich, so prosperous, that it is the greatest market of

the earth, even for luxuries. It is the best market for pictures,

for works of art. It is the best market for music and song. It

is the best market for dramatic genius, and it is the best market

for skilled labor, the best market for common labor, and in this

country the poor man to-day has the best chance--he can look forward

to becoming the proprietor of a home, of some land, to independence,

to respectability, and to an old age without want and without

disgrace.

The platform, except upon this question of free trade, means very

little. There are other features in it which I have not at present

time to examine, but shall do so hereafter. I want to take it up

point by point and find really what it means, what its scope is,

and what the intentions were of the gentlemen who made it.

But it may be proper to say here, that in my judgment it is a very

weak and flimsy document, as Victor Hugo would say, "badly cut and

badly sewed."

Of course, I know that the country will exist whatever party may

be in power. I know that all our blessings do not come from laws,

or from the carrying into effect of certain policies, and probably

I could pay no greater compliment to any country than to say that

even eight years of Democratic rule cannot materially affect her

destiny.

--_New York Press_, June 10, 1888.

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