Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I can see those boxes there now. I don't know
whether you can see them or not. It seems like I can see the boxes in
that picture. Am I right?
Mr. BELIN. I don't know, sir. I can't see them on Exhibit 471. That
could be the dirty window here.
Mr. BRENNAN. Here they are here. Those boxes there.
Mr. BELIN. Well, here is Exhibit 482.
First of all, I see a box on Exhibit 482, right in the window.
Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; I don't recall that box.
Mr. BELIN. Do you recall that it definitely was not there, or just you
don't recall whether it was or was not there.
Mr. BRENNAN. I do not recall that being there. So, therefore, I could
not say it definitely wasn't there.
Mr. BELIN. You cannot say whether it was or was not?
Mr. BRENNAN. No.
Mr. BELIN. On Exhibit 482, do you want to point an arrow to where you
believe you can see boxes back there. Or where you saw boxes.
All right.
Let the record show that Exhibits 480, 481, and 482 were taken by, I
believe it is, Underwood or--just a second. Thomas C. Dillard, Chief
Photographer of the Dallas Morning News, who was riding in the car with
Robert H. Jackson, who has already testified before the Commission,
and the deposition of Mr. Dillard will be taken by Mr. Ball and me in
Dallas in the first part of April.
And that Exhibits 480, 481, and 482 were taken shortly after the firing
of the third shot. I think that this should appear in the record.
I think it should also appear in the record that Exhibit 479 is one of
the frames from the Abraham Zapruder movie film.
Mr. Brennan, from the time you first saw the Presidential motorcade
turning north on Houston from Main, did you observe the window from
which you say you saw the last shot fired at any time prior to the time
you saw the rifle in the window?
Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
Mr. BELIN. Well, what I am saying is this. You saw the motorcade turn?
Mr. BRENNAN. No; not after I saw the motorcade, I did not observe a man
or rifle in the window.
Mr. BELIN. Did you observe the window at all until after you heard that
first sound which was a backfire or firecracker, at least you thought
it was?
Mr. BRENNAN. No.
Mr. BELIN. So you did not observe the window and would not know whether
or not there was any man in the window during that period?
Mr. BRENNAN. No.
Mr. BELIN. Well, let the record be clear. The first sound you first
thought was what?
Mr. BRENNAN. Backfire of a motorcycle.
Mr. BELIN. And then you later said something about a firecracker.
Did that have reference to the first shot, or something in between the
first and last?
Mr. BRENNAN. I positively thought that the first shot was a backfire
of a motorcycle. And then something made me think that someone was
throwing firecrackers from the Texas Book Store, and a possibility it
was the second shot. But I glanced up or looked up and I saw this man
taking aim for his last shot. The first shot and last shot is my only
positive recollection of two shots.
Mr. McCLOY. Did you see the rifle explode? Did you see the flash of
what was either the second or the third shot?
Mr. BRENNAN. No.
Mr. McCLOY. Could you see that he had discharged the rifle?
Mr. BRENNAN. No. For some reason I did not get an echo at any time. The
first shot was positive and clear and the last shot was positive and
clear, with no echo on my part.
Mr. McCLOY. Yes.
But you saw him aim?
Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
Mr. McCLOY. Did you see the rifle discharge, did you see the recoil or
the flash?
Mr. BRENNAN. No.
Mr. McCLOY. But you heard the last shot.
Mr. BRENNAN. The report; yes, sir.
Mr. DULLES. Could you see who or what he was aiming at? You testified
as to the declination of the rifle, the angle of the rifle. But could
you see what he was firing at?
Mr. BRENNAN. Subconsciously I knew what he was firing at. But
immediately I looked towards where President Kennedy's car should
be, and there was something obstructing my view. I could not see the
President or his car at that time.
And I still don't know what was obstructing my view, because I was high
enough that I should have been able to see it. I could not see it.
Mr. BELIN. Mr. Brennan, on one of your interviews with the FBI, they
record a statement that you estimated your distance between the point
you were seated and the window from which the shots were fired as
approximately 90 yards.
At that time did you make that statement to the FBI--and this would be
on 22 November. To the best of your recollection?
Mr. BRENNAN. There was a mistake in the FBI recording there. He had
asked me the question of how far the shot was fired from too, and also
he had asked me the question of how far I was from the shot that was
fired. I calculated the distance at the angle his gun was resting that
he must have been firing 80 to 90 yards.