Mr. PRICE. And I asked him if it was still doing the job, if it was
still set, and he said, "It was shooting just fine," and Mr. Slack was
there at the time and at this particular time--that might have been the
day that they had the hassle there, I don't know, but they were sitting
right next to one another--Mr. Slack was in booth 9 and Oswald was in
booth 8, and he commented on his telescope.
Mr. LIEBELER. Who commented on the telescope?
Mr. PRICE. Oswald.
Mr. LIEBELER. Commented to you?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; he asked me to look through it, and he said, "It's
one of the clearest telescopes that I have ever seen--one of the
brightest." He said, "It's a Japanese scope and I gave $18 for it."
Mr. LIEBELER. He told you that he paid $18 for it?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; he said that it was--he remarked that it was a 4-power
telescope and he said it was mounted on Redfield mounts. You see, they
make mounts for several different guns, but I don't know one mount from
another myself. I just took his word for it that it was a Redfield
mount, but I looked through the scope and it was very clear. It was
very bright and we compared it with two scopes that Mr. Slack had on
his gun and a fellow that was shooting on the right side in booth
7--I don't know who that was, but we compared it with three different
American-made scopes and his telescope was brighter and clearer by far.
You could read the lines and numerals on the target very plainly with
it.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did he tell you that he paid $18 for the scope or did he
say that he paid $18 for the whole works?
Mr. PRICE. No; he said he paid $18 for the scope.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did he tell you where he had it mounted?
Mr. PRICE. He said that he got the thing from a gunsmith in Cedar Hill
for a debt, the gun, and that he bought the scope and that the gunsmith
mounted it for him.
Mr. LIEBELER. The same gunsmith?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. And that was in Cedar Hill?
Mr. PRICE. It might be; but I don't know of any gunsmith in Cedar Hill.
Mr. LIEBELER. But you remember that he did tell you it was done by a
gunsmith in Cedar Hill?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; then, I questioned him about it, I told him, I said, "I
didn't know there was a gunsmith in Cedar Hill."
Mr. LIEBELER. And what did he say?
Mr. PRICE. He said, "Yes; one over there and he owed me some money and
he gave me this gun to settle the debt" and he said, "I bought the
scope and he mounted it and boresighted it."
Mr. LIEBELER. Did he tell you where this gunsmith was located?
Mr. PRICE. No; he didn't say anything about the location other than it
was in Cedar Hill.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did he tell you what the guy's name was?
Mr. PRICE. No.
Mr. LIEBELER. Was there anyone with him that day or was he by himself?
Mr. PRICE. I don't know; I don't know whether he was by himself or not.
Mr. LIEBELER. You didn't see anybody else that seemed to be with him?
Mr. PRICE. No; there was a lot of people there and everybody was
milling around talking to everybody else and I don't know whether he
was with anyone or not.
Mr. LIEBELER. Now, what about the fellow that was in the booth on the
other side of Mr. Slack, do you remember anything about him--I think
you said.
Mr. PRICE. All I remember about him was that he was a big fellow with a
long black--it was either black or dark red beard.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you talk to him at all?
Mr. PRICE. Other than just to comment on his scope--I didn't have any
conversation at all with him.
Mr. LIEBELER. You are talking about Oswald now?
Mr. PRICE. No; I'm talking about the fellow with the beard.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you look through his scope too?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; I did.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did Oswald talk to the fellow with the beard?
Mr. PRICE. Well, I suppose--he spoke to all of them--to Oswald and
Slack both, about the clarity of the telescope.
Mr. LIEBELER. Were you there when they were talking about the clarity
of Oswald's telescope?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you see this fellow that you think was Oswald come or
go from the range or did you just see him there then?
Mr. PRICE. I just saw him there. I just saw him there a couple of times.
Mr. LIEBELER. A couple of times that day?
Mr. PRICE. No; two separate times, I believe, that Oswald was present
at the range both times that he was, as I remember, but I don't know
whether they were there together or not.
Mr. LIEBELER. We are getting our wires crossed--you're talking now
about the fellow with the beard?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. You meant that he was there on the range a couple of
different times?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; he was there both times that I saw Oswald.
Mr. LIEBELER. That you saw Oswald?
Mr. PRICE. That I saw Oswald; yes. The second and third time.
Mr. LIEBELER. But you never saw them come and go together?
Mr. PRICE. No; I didn't pay any attention to who came--whether they
came and left together or how they got there, but just that one
particular time--he was the only one there.
Mr. LIEBELER. You never noticed how Oswald came to the rifle range and
left the range?
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. Except that first time you saw him?
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did anything else happen with relation to this fellow
that you think was Oswald on this third time that you saw him there at
the rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. No; it was just a conversation about the telescope is all.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you see the rifle closely that day--you must have
handled it in looking through the scope?
Mr. PRICE. Oh, yes; I handled it--it was a Mauser-type rifle.
Mr. LIEBELER. What do you mean by that--I don't know anything about
rifles?
Mr. PRICE. Well, it's strictly a military rifle and it's patterned
after the German Mauser.
Mr. LIEBELER. A bolt-action rifle?
Mr. PRICE. A bolt action, and the general outline it had--about oh,
possibly a six shot clip that set just ahead of the trigger, and I
understand it was a 6.5 Italian, but at that time I didn't know. I
thought it was a Mauser because there's a friend of mine in Grand
Prairie that has an Argentine Mauser that was 7.6 and it looked very
familiar--they looked a whole lot alike.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you have a chance to look at any of the writing or
printing that was stamped on the rifle?
Mr. PRICE. Well, the only thing that I could see on it--I looked for a
brand name so I could see approximately where it was made, and the only
thing that I could find on it was a serial number.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you look closely for a brand name?
Mr. PRICE. I didn't examine it too close.
Mr. LIEBELER. But you did see the serial number?
Mr. PRICE. I saw the serial number and the gun wasn't blued at the
time--it had a bright finish on the barrel. It looked like it had been
placed in a lathe and turned down, as far as--well, in an attempt to
sporterize the gun.
Mr. LIEBELER. It had been worked on in some manner in an attempt to
sporterize it?
Mr. PRICE. I thought it had.
Mr. LIEBELER. How far did the barrel protrude from the stock of the
rifle, how far did it stick out from the end of the stock?
Mr. PRICE. Possibly 6 or 8 inches at the most.
Mr. LIEBELER. Had the stock been cut back in this attempt to sporterize
the rifle?
Mr. PRICE. Well, not that I could tell--it was similar to a German
Mauser and they have, you know, they have got a full length, almost a
full length stock with a wooden piece on the top of them also.
Mr. LIEBELER. And the wooden piece on top was still on this
rifle--which you did see?
Mr. PRICE. No; I don't believe it was.
Mr. LIEBELER. It had been taken off?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. It had been taken off as part of the attempt to
sporterize the rifle?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Had the end of the barrel been cut off?
Mr. PRICE. I don't know whether it had been cut off or not.
Mr. LIEBELER. You say the barrel had a shiny finish?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; it did at that time.
Mr. LIEBELER. I will show you two pictures that have been previously
marked "Exhibits 3 and 4" on the deposition of Mr. Greener and ask you
if you recognize that as the rifle that this man had at the range?
Mr. PRICE. [Examining instruments referred to.] Except for the sling
and the forepiece--I would say they are the same gun. The gun had no
sling on it. It did have the mounts on the side for a sling.
Mr. LIEBELER. It didn't have a sling on it?
Mr. PRICE. It didn't.
Mr. LIEBELER. What do you mean when you say the forepiece?
Mr. PRICE. The forepiece is this top wooden piece; of course, that
could be taken off and replaced very easily.
Mr. LIEBELER. The wooden piece that is on top of the barrel, is that
what you are referring to?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. And you say that that was not on the rifle that you saw?
Mr. PRICE. No; it wasn't. This barrel has a step along in here
somewhere.
Mr. LIEBELER. A step?
Mr. PRICE. A step along in here building it up to a larger diameter and
another one here, which you can see.
Mr. LIEBELER. It gets larger by degrees as it comes back toward the
action, is that right?
Mr. PRICE. That's right, and that's the reason I thought at the time
that it had been placed in a lathe and turned down, but I'm not too
familiar with the foreign made guns and I have learned since then that
all Mauser rifles are that type--they are made that way.
Mr. LIEBELER. With these steps as they come back toward the action?
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. Is this the same kind of scope that you saw on the rifle
that Oswald had, the fellow you thought was Oswald?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; it had large receivers at both ends and I believe,
now, I might not be right about the brand name, but I believe it was a
Tascosa, since I examined it--it was a Japanese made scope. They make
several different brands of those things--it could be any of them, but
I believe, as I remember it--it was a Tascosa.
Mr. LIEBELER. So, if you took the sling off this rifle and took the top
wooden piece off the barrel, you think it would look pretty much like
the one that this fellow had?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Now, you testified before that when you examined this
rifle, you looked for the brand name and you weren't able to find a
brand name?
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. But you did see the serial number?
Mr. PRICE. The serial number was--it was in here, in here, or in
here--I believe it was right along in here.
Mr. LIEBELER. And you are referring to the fore part of the action or
the part of the rifle just before the action and immediately under the
front edge of the scope, is that right?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; the largest diameter of the barrel. The clip is here.
Mr. LIEBELER. It fits in just in front of the trigger?
Mr. PRICE. It fits in just in front of the trigger there.
Mr. LIEBELER. I will hand you some pictures and see if you can
recognize any of the people in them as the man you saw at the rifle
range--these have been previously marked "Commission Exhibits Nos. 451
and 453 through 456."
Mr. PRICE. [Examining documents referred to.] Yes; this is the only one
that has any similarity I can recall.
Mr. LIEBELER. You are referring to No. 455--does that look like him?
Mr. PRICE. Well, these all seem like a photograph of the same fellow,
but this is the only one that has any resemblance, as I can remember.
Mr. LIEBELER. Now, I show you another picture--it is a photograph of
a street scene with several people in it and I show you two different
pictures and ask you if you notice anybody in there as being the fellow
you saw at the rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; this one here and this one here--he has a part of the
receding hairline on the right side.
Mr. LIEBELER. Which one?
Mr. PRICE. This one--right here--he's got a long--kind of a sharp nose.
Mr. LIEBELER. The pictures that I have just showed you do not have any
marks on them, is that right?
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. Let me show you two other pictures which are the same as
the pictures I just showed you except that they have some green marks
on them.
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. The first picture I showed you--you have indicated on it
that you recognized the man who has a green mark over his head.
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. In the identical picture which has been marked as "Pizzo
Exhibit No. 453-B," and that is the man that you saw at the rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. Right.
Mr. LIEBELER. On the second picture I showed you, you identified as the
man you saw at the rifle range--the man who has a green "X" over him?
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. And that picture has been marked "Pizzo Exhibit No.
453-A." I'll show you a picture that has been marked as "Pizzo Exhibit
No. 453-C," and ask you if you recognize that as the man you saw on the
rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Do you have any questions about it at all?
Mr. PRICE. About that picture?
Mr. LIEBELER. Whether that's the fellow?
Mr. PRICE. Other than the scar or cut on his head, because he didn't
have a cut on his head at the time.
Mr. LIEBELER. When did you first become aware of the fact that this
fellow you saw was Lee Oswald, did you ever know his name?
Mr. PRICE. No; I never knew his name.
Mr. LIEBELER. When did you first become aware of the fact it was
Oswald--when did you first think that it was Oswald?
Mr. PRICE. When I saw him on television when they were transferring him
from the Dallas jail.
Mr. LIEBELER. And did you recognize him right away as the fellow you
had seen at the rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; and I contacted the FBI the next day. I debated on it
all night whether I should call them or get mixed up with it or not.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you mention it to anyone else, when you saw him on
television?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; my family.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you talk about it with anyone else before you told
the FBI?
Mr. PRICE. No.
Mr. LIEBELER. Whom did you talk with at the FBI, do you remember?
Mr. PRICE. Charlie Brown.
Mr. LIEBELER. Let's see if we can establish the date of the last time
that you saw this man at the rifle range. Do you recall that the
President was assassinated on Friday, November 22? Can you tell us
approximately how long prior to the assassination this time was that
you saw the man?
Mr. PRICE. The last time I saw him was a week before Thanksgiving;
Sunday before.
Mr. LIEBELER. The Sunday before Thanksgiving--that's the last time you
saw him at the rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. That's the last time that I was down at the rifle range--the
last time I went there until after, oh, a month or so after the
assassination.
Mr. LIEBELER. You mean it was the Sunday immediately preceding
Thanksgiving?
Mr. PRICE. That's right; I was down there for the turkey shoot we had.
Mr. LIEBELER. You saw him at the rifle range that day?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Well, the last Sunday before Thanksgiving was after the
assassination.
Mr. PRICE. It was after?
Mr. LIEBELER. Yes; and you saw this man at the rifle range, you saw
Oswald at the rifle range after the assassination?
Mr. PRICE. I believe I did, because that was the last time that I went
down there.
Mr. LIEBELER. And the time you saw him the last time and looked through
the scope was the last time you were down at the rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. Yes; that was the last day I was down there.
Mr. LIEBELER. What makes you say it was the Sunday preceding
Thanksgiving, are you sure about that?
Mr. PRICE. Well, I'm not exactly positive but it was getting close to
Thanksgiving because I was trying to get a turkey.
Mr. LIEBELER. Do you remember whether you saw him after the
assassination?
Mr. PRICE. No.
Mr. LIEBELER. You are not sure one way or the other?
Mr. PRICE. I know I haven't seen him after the assassination, but it
was before this assassination--I was down there the last time and I was
thinking it was a week before Thanksgiving, but anyhow, it was before
the assassination, the Sunday before, but they were holding a turkey
shoot.
Mr. LIEBELER. The Sunday before the assassination would have been the
17th--that would have been two Sundays before Thanksgiving.
Mr. PRICE. Well, it might be right--that's been so long ago--I'm not
sure about the dates, I don't remember dates too well.
Mr. LIEBELER. But you were pretty clear in your mind you didn't see
Oswald after the assassination?
Mr. PRICE. That's right.
Mr. LIEBELER. Have you ever seen him since?
Mr. PRICE. I have never seen him since. I have been down there quite
often since December.
Mr. LIEBELER. Down at the rifle range?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. And business at the rifle range has fallen off since the
assassination, rather sharply, hasn't it?
Mr. PRICE. Well, for a while it continued, but it has fallen off very
sharply in the last, oh, in the last month and a half except for
Sundays--they do have good business on Sunday.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did the FBI show you any pictures of anybody and ask you
to identify them when they talked to you?
Mr. PRICE. It was the FBI or Secret Service, one of the two, I believe
it was the FBI.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did they show you any of the pictures that we have shown
you this morning?
Mr. PRICE. They have shown one similar--they had three or four photos
showing this bruise and cut on the forehead.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did they show you a picture of the rifle?
Mr. PRICE. I believe the Secret Service showed me a picture of the
rifle. I told them the same thing--it wasn't made up exactly the
same--it didn't have the sling, it didn't have the forepiece, like
there had been an attempt to sporterize the gun.
Mr. LIEBELER. The last time you saw this man at the rifle range--do you
remember if there was anybody else there that you know?
Mr. PRICE. Garland Slack.
Mr. LIEBELER. And you saw Mr. Slack?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Anybody else?
Mr. PRICE. Well, there was this big fellow--I don't know who he is.
Mr. LIEBELER. Have you ever seen him since?
Mr. PRICE. No; I haven't. I understand that Mr. Davis saw him one time
because he called me and told me that he saw him, about 2 weeks ago,
and he turned the license number of the car over to the FBI.
Mr. LIEBELER. But you, yourself, have never seen him since?
Mr. PRICE. I have never seen him since.
Mr. LIEBELER. Was there anybody else that last day at the rifle range
that saw this man that might be able to identify him other than Mr.
Slack and Mr. Davis?
Mr. PRICE. Well, not that I know of. There was a lot of people
there--there were 300 or 400 people there. There could be any number of
them that could identify him, but I don't know them.
Mr. LIEBELER. Can you think of anything about this subject that
I haven't asked you about that you think I should have asked you
about--anything you would like to add?
Mr. PRICE. No; a conversation I had with him about the telescope--I
forgot that. I forgot to mention that--to Mr. Brown when he was out,
and I don't know whether I mentioned that to the Secret Service agent
or not. It will be in his report if I did.
Mr. LIEBELER. The conversation about the clarity of the scope?
Mr. PRICE. Yes. He wasn't--he didn't seem to be too talkative to anyone
other than when he was talking about the telescope--he seemed rather
proud of that.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you ever see him talk to this big fellow other than
talk to him about this telescope on this time you have told us about?
Mr. PRICE. Well, not that I particular remember.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you form any impression as to whether they were
together or not?
Mr. PRICE. No.
Mr. LIEBELER. You couldn't tell one way or the other?
Mr. PRICE. No; I didn't pay any attention to it. There was--I just
thought of it--there was a doctor and his son there at the same time
and they were firing a .308 caliber Winchester, I believe--it was
either a Winchester or a Remington and anyhow, they had identical guns
and they were sharpening up for, I believe, they said they were going
to Canada and they were there at the same time.
Mr. LIEBELER. This was the Sunday, the last time you saw him?
Mr. PRICE. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Do you know their names--do you know what their names are?
Mr. PRICE. No; I don't--I don't know their names--I have heard it but I
don't remember it.
Mr. LIEBELER. Would you remember it if I mentioned it to you?
Mr. PRICE. Well, I might.
Mr. LIEBELER. Is the doctor's name--Dr. Wood?
Mr. PRICE. That don't sound like it--there was a doctor there and his
son--I know they were father and son.
Mr. LIEBELER. About how old was the son?
Mr. PRICE. He was in his early twenties, I believe.
Mr. LIEBELER. And did they talk to this fellow about the telescope?
Mr. PRICE. I don't remember whether they had any conversation with him
or not.
Mr. LIEBELER. What makes you mention that?
Mr. PRICE. It's just the fact that they were there at the same time and
I know they were talking to Garland Slack and there is a possibility
that they either observed or talked to Oswald, because he was sitting
next to Slack.
Mr. LIEBELER. You have nothing else that you want to add--I don't
think of any more questions. I want to thank you for coming down
and cooperating with us to the extent that you have and it has been
considerable cooperation because you got very short notice and you came
very early this morning, and we appreciate this and we want you to know
that the Commission appreciates this very much. Thank you.
Mr. PRICE. Well, I try to help all I can. I don't remember dates too
well--it's been quite some time. I can remember faces but I can't
remember names and dates worth a hoot.
Mr. LIEBELER. Well, we sure appreciate your coming down.
Mr. DAVIS. Thanks again--we appreciate your coming down.
Mr. PRICE. You bet.