The testimony of Seymour Weitzman was taken at 2:15 p.m., on April 1,
1964, in the office of the U.S. attorney, 301 Post Office Building,
Bryan and Ervay Streets, Dallas, Tex., by Mr. Joseph A. Ball, assistant
counsel of the President's Commission.
Mr. BALL. Mr. Weitzman, I'm Joe Ball and this is Lillian Johnson, the
court reporter. Will you please stand and raise your right hand?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. Do you solemnly swear the testimony you will give before this
Commission will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the
truth, so help you God?
Mr. WEITZMAN. I do.
Mr. BALL. Will you state your name?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Seymour Weitzman.
Mr. BALL. What is your occupation?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Deputy constable, Dallas County.
Mr. BALL. What is the location of your place of business?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Precinct 1 which is the old courthouse, third floor, room
351.
Mr. BALL. Where were you born?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Dallas, Tex.
Mr. BALL. Were you educated here in this State?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Partially here and Indiana.
Mr. BALL. How far did you go through school?
Mr. WEITZMAN. I went through college, graduated in engineering, 1945.
Mr. BALL. When did you come to Texas?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Do you mean back to Texas?
Mr. BALL. Back to Texas.
Mr. WEITZMAN. Right after the service was over and when I came out of
the service.
Mr. BALL. Did you graduate from school before you went into the service?
Mr. WEITZMAN. I finished up after I received my discharge. I went back
to Indiana to engineering school in South Bend and finished my degree
in 1945.
Mr. BALL. What school?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Allison Division of General Motors Engineering School.
Mr. BALL. What did you do when you went to Dallas?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Went in business for myself.
Mr. BALL. What kind of business?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Dresses, garments, ladies garments.
Mr. BALL. What did you do after that?
Mr. WEITZMAN. I went on the road as district supervisor and manager for
Holly's Dress Shops in New York, 115 Fifth Avenue, and I supervised 26
stores for them for approximately 15 years.
Mr. BALL. Then what did you do?
Mr. WEITZMAN. I took over as general manager of the Lamont Corp. which
is a discount operation and the headquarters, which was Galveston, Tex.
We had stores in Dallas, Fort Worth, Louisiana, Phoenix and Tucson,
Ariz. At the end of 1960, I closed up all the stores, retired from the
discount operation and went to work for Robie Love in Dallas County,
precinct 1.
Mr. BALL. You've been there ever since as deputy constable?
Mr. WEITZMAN. That's right.
Mr. BALL. On November 22, 1963, around noon, where were you?
Mr. WEITZMAN. I was standing on the corner of Main and Houston.
Mr. BALL. Were you alone?
Mr. WEITZMAN. No, sir; I was with another deputy, Bill Hutton.
Mr. BALL. A deputy constable?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Yes, sir; he and I were standing there.
Mr. BALL. Did you see the President's car pass?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Yes, sir; we did. We watched the President pass and we
turned and started back to the courthouse when we heard the shots.
Mr. BALL. You say you turned and were starting back to the
courthouse--what courthouse and what is the location of that courthouse?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Sitting on Main, Houston, Record and so forth. We were at
the back side and we turned around and were going into the Main Street
entrance. We made maybe three or four steps when we heard what we
thought at that time was either a rifle shot or a firecracker, I mean
at that second.
Mr. BALL. How many shots did you hear?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Three distinct shots.
Mr. BALL. How were they spaced?
Mr. WEITZMAN. First one, then the second two seemed to be
simultaneously.
Mr. BALL. You mean the first and then there was a pause?
Mr. WEITZMAN. There was a little period in between the second and third
shot.
Mr. BALL. What was the longest, between the first and second or the
second and third shot; which had the longest time lapse in there?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Between the first and second shot.
Mr. BALL. What did you do then?
Mr. WEITZMAN. I immediately ran toward the President's car. Of course,
it was speeding away and somebody said the shots or the firecrackers,
whatever it was at that time, we still didn't know the President was
shot, came from the wall. I immediately scaled that wall.
Mr. BALL. What is the location of that wall?
Mr. WEITZMAN. It would be between the railroad overpass and I can't
remember the name of that little street that runs off Elm; it's
cater-corner--the section there between the--what do you call it--the
monument section?
Mr. BALL. That's where Elm actually dead ends?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Yes, sir; I scaled the wall and, apparently, my hands
grabbed steampipes. I burned them.
Mr. BALL. Did you go into the railroad yards?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. What did you notice in the railroad yards?
Mr. WEITZMAN. We noticed numerous kinds of footprints that did not make
sense because they were going different directions.
Mr. BALL. Were there other people there besides you?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Yes, sir; other officers, Secret Service as well, and
somebody started, there was something red in the street and I went back
over the wall and somebody brought me a piece of what he thought to
be a firecracker and it turned out to be, I believe, I wouldn't quote
this, but I turned it over to one of the Secret Service men and I told
them it should go to the lab because it looked to me like human bone. I
later found out it was supposedly a portion of the President's skull.
Mr. BALL. That you picked up off the street?
Mr. WEITZMAN. Yes.
Mr. BALL. What part of the street did you pick this up?
Mr. WEITZMAN. As the President's car was going off, it would be on the
left-hand side of the street. It would be the----